Fogbow

I asked Foggy to create a sub-forum about religion and politics, to explore the connection between them. The most obvious topic is about evangelicals behaving badly. Let 'er rip!

johnpcapitalist wrote: ↑Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:07 pm I asked Foggy to create a sub-forum about religion and politics, to explore the connection between them. The most obvious topic is about evangelicals behaving badly. Let 'er rip!

scirreeve wrote: ↑Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:29 pm

johnpcapitalist wrote: ↑Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:07 pm I asked Foggy to create a sub-forum about religion and politics, to explore the connection between them. The most obvious topic is about evangelicals behaving badly. Let 'er rip!

Hidden Content

This board requires you to be registered and logged-in to view hidden content.

As we have Cops Behaving Badly, Democrats Behaving Badly, and even Lawyers Behaving Badly, it should be remembered that Evangelical is not a blanket term for evil Christians (or, to a point, even a specific group because the term Evangelical is not neatly defined as a denominational group). I could easily come up with candidates for Anglicans Acting Badly and being a good Via Media Broad Church type, blast folks on both sides of the multi-sided Right/Left/Anglo-Catholic/Evangelical spectrum. One of the Bishops I despised the most was most definitely left (and a first-rate jerk).

Ponder this: My BIL has a Bachelor's and an M. S. in Science fields dealing with wetlands. He works in the wetland management field. He is a solo business. He is an evangelical that believes the Biden election is a China takeover. I could go on and on.

My MIL was brought up as a Roman Catholic, but later in life, she switched to an Assemblies of God congregation. For the record, AoG is the denomination of Jimmy Swaggart, Jim Bakker and many other televangelists.

When she became ill, my wife and I visited her in the hospital. A couple of friends from church were also there. As they were talking, I forget what prompted it, but MIL told her friends that "They (meaning my wife and I) wouldn't understand. They're Catholic, not Christian". We didn't say anything, but that vile statement has always stuck with me as an example of the hypocrisy of many who call themselves "Christian", but don't practice its teachings of love.

I'm not at all religious, but I think that, if there is a God, it is the ultimate in pretentiousness for someone to presume that they can know what that god is thinking and will do, and all others are 1000 percent wrong. It is downright hubris to say what God can and can't do.

My opinion is that we are all looking at the same thing, and looking for the same things, but each from a slightly different perspective. Therefore, we each see it a little bit differently. None of us can see the whole thing so none of us can be completely wrong or completely right.

Those who think that theirs is the only true interpretation, are the least correct of all. That is my fundamental (no pun intended) problem with most evangelicals. They insist that they alone know the path.

Humanity would be so much better off if we banned one phrase:

"The one true religion."

“It does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are 20 gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.” ---Thomas Jefferson

"Man is a Religious Animal. He is the only Religious Animal. He is the only animal that has the True Religion -- several of them. He is the only animal that loves his neighbor as himself and cuts his throat if his theology isn't straight."

Mark Twain

"Evangelicals Behaving Badly," or, as I call it, Carl Gallups. E.g.:

"For completeness":

I hate to admit it but Joel Osteen is a guilty pleasure. I listen to him for a couple of minutes a couple times a month.

I am amazed at his religious ideology. It has nothing to do with the teachings in the Old or New Testaments. It's all about being optimistic and confident. Period.

And this fake is rich!

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:19 pm I hate to admit it but Joel Osteen is a guilty pleasure. I listen to him for a couple of minutes a couple times a month.

I am amazed at his religious ideology. It has nothing to do with the teachings in the Old or New Testaments. It's all about being optimistic and confident. Period.

And this fake is rich!

That's how he got rich.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:19 pm I hate to admit it but Joel Osteen is a guilty pleasure. I listen to him for a couple of minutes a couple times a month.

I am amazed at his religious ideology. It has nothing to do with the teachings in the Old or New Testaments. It's all about being optimistic and confident. Period.

And this fake is rich!

You sound jealous. Why didn't go into preaching instead of law? Much less formal training and work.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:19 pm I hate to admit it but Joel Osteen is a guilty pleasure. I listen to him for a couple of minutes a couple times a month.

I am amazed at his religious ideology. It has nothing to do with the teachings in the Old or New Testaments. It's all about being optimistic and confident. Period.

And this fake is rich!

I think that he is one of the leading proponents of the so-called "prosperity theology", which posits that God wants you to be rich beyond your wildest dreams. Just send me money and I'll tell you how he plans to accomplish this for you.

neonzx wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 8:20 pm

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:19 pm I hate to admit it but Joel Osteen is a guilty pleasure. I listen to him for a couple of minutes a couple times a month.

I am amazed at his religious ideology. It has nothing to do with the teachings in the Old or New Testaments. It's all about being optimistic and confident. Period.

And this fake is rich!

You sound jealous. Why didn't go into preaching instead of law? Much less formal training and work.

More difficult to grift the people in my affinity group.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 11:14 pm More difficult to grift the people in my affinity group.

The plus side is that the people in your affinity group are less likely to try to grift you.

noblepa wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:46 pm I think that he is one of the leading proponents of the so-called "prosperity theology", which posits that God wants you to be rich beyond your wildest dreams. Just send me money and I'll tell you how he plans to accomplish this for you.

If he's saying that you make your own heaven here on earth, I can go along with that. I've flown up in the clouds and there is no heaven up there. Now maybe I didn't fly while the earth was positioned in just the ideal way.

zekeb wrote: ↑Fri Apr 16, 2021 7:13 am

noblepa wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 9:46 pm I think that he is one of the leading proponents of the so-called "prosperity theology", which posits that God wants you to be rich beyond your wildest dreams. Just send me money and I'll tell you how he plans to accomplish this for you.

If he's saying that you make your own heaven here on earth, I can go along with that. I've flown up in the clouds and there is no heaven up there. Now maybe I didn't fly while the earth was positioned in just the ideal way.

Maybe you didn't take the right drugs before you flew.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Thu Apr 15, 2021 11:14 pmMore difficult to grift the people in my affinity group.

Well, except for the antics of that recently deceased Madoff fellow, but I digress...

Prosperity Theology is an insidious disease that is spreading. Its very big in Africa, and I've read that some Catholic Priests are starting to buy into it too.

Suranis wrote: ↑Fri Apr 16, 2021 10:03 am Prosperity Theology is an insidious disease that is spreading. Its very big in Africa, and I've read that some Catholic Priests are starting to buy into it too.

Mind boggling. Apart from the fact it obviously “sells” it’s almost unbelievable that it exists.

Gallups' beliefs easily could be in the anti-vaxxer thread. But:

I've been to various faiths' services, and not one has involved "touching." One would think a savvy marketer like Gallups ( ) would know not to list "touching" as a "benefit" of church fellowship.

And, unsurprisingly, others do not read Hebrews 10:25 as Gallups does.

bob wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:07 pm
Gallups' beliefs easily could be in the anti-vaxxer thread. But:

I've been to various faiths' services, and not one has involved "touching."

Catholics do. We shake hands or hug during the sign of peace and a lot of people hold hands when praying.

It's been a long time since Sunday School, but one of the things I remember clearly is how it's better to pray in private than to pray in public.

AndyinPA wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:17 pm It's been a long time since Sunday School, but one of the things I remember clearly is how it's better to pray in private than to pray in public.

I always wonder, when I read stories like this, the their position would be if cancer were contagious, and we were having a cancer pandemic.

Silly me.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:14 pm

bob wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:07 pm
Gallups' beliefs easily could be in the anti-vaxxer thread. But:

I've been to various faiths' services, and not one has involved "touching."

Catholics do. We shake hands or hug during the sign of peace and a lot of people hold hands when praying.

It seems to vary by culture. In Chinese, Korean and Filipino services in Singapore, the sign of peace involves nodding or slight bows, but no touching. In the Philippines, family members sometimes hug or shake hands, but not between strangers. At least in my experience

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:14 pmCatholics do. We shake hands or hug during the sign of peace and a lot of people hold hands when praying.

That was not my experience, and (IIRC) there's actually no rule requiring touching.

My larger point is that "come to our church and get touched" is poor marketing, even when marketing to COVID deniers.