Fogbow

Due to no lack of 2,000 pound bombs, the battle was lost. Call me a pariah, but I have parrhesia and called it first. Kids aren't that hip to genocide and he lost the youth vote.

You probably don't want to discuss that. It's starting to look like the dead parrot sketch.



It's not resting. It's dead. It's bleeding demised and shit.

Agree. As much as I have believed since even before the disastrous debate that Biden was probably going to lose, I have still been busting my ass actively engaged in trying to reverse reality.

I got off my ass and started knocking on doors starting when Allen West was running to retain his House seat. I saw the power of mobilizing first hand when we got rid of that asshole and haven't stopped since.

Even in Orlando, which is where I spent all last week, I have seen Biden's support among young people just absolutely hemorrhaging. And it's not just that they are moving to Trump, but many are taking on the mantle of Maga and even repeating the stupidest of the stupid Magat claims. For instance last week I got to hear people fully embracing and repeating the belief that in California doctors have up to 24 hours after the birth of a baby to decide if they want to "abort the baby". Yes, the old "abortion after birth" isn't just some stupid thing Trump is saying with his followers just ignoring the stupid stuff but wanting that tax cut he's going to give them. They believe the stupid stuff. And now it isn't just the mother trying to kill the baby, apparently doctors are in on the decision making in California. Who knew.

When I asked how do you perform an abortion on a live person, I was informed that they "go ahead and kill it". This was being told to a rapt audience of NURSING STUDENTS who, instead of responding with even the slightest bit of skepticism or questions were just shocked that "California would do such a thing, OMG, what a fucked up State!" After I stepped in and said that what is being described is actually considered murder in every single state in the USA. There in fact is no state that has any laws that allow doctors, nurses, or individuals any amount of time after a baby is born to just kill it without being arrested and charged with murder. In my immediate vicinity I think there were one or two (out of a whole shit ton of students) that seemed relieved to find out that killing babies might be considered murder in California.

I'm about spent trying to do my part in getting people to vote for sanity, which is what I am focusing on. Trying to sell Biden is simply not going to work at all. As much as I love the man, there was the perfect time and place for him, he did his part. We needed him in 2020, he did his part to thwart Trump at that time and I am grateful. He exceeded my expectations in terms of what he would accomplish, frankly I didn't even care if the only thing he accomplished was to get Trump out of the White House.

In spite of the fact that I feel free on this forum to share my views that Biden is going to lose, nobody out in the real world would ever suspect that I feel this way. I even managed to recruit a couple of people to help get out there and spread some sanity during my worst week ever, which was last week. But I am not even trying to sell Biden because it ain't gonna work. I am trying to sell sanity, things like explaining why young women trying to start families are at risk of losing their lives. That is because of Donald Trump. I keep a copy of Project 2025 with me to explain this is where we are going if Trump gets back in the White House.

Selling sanity is way easier than trying to sell people on Joe Biden himself. Showing his list of accomplishments does get people thinking, and asking people to try to imagine what would happen if Donald Trump were to become President and then die of a heart attack partly through his term vs what would happen if Joe Biden has a heart attack and dies partway through his term also can help get people thinking. Joe Biden is surrounded by serious adults who don't just understand how to govern but understand the importance of good governance. But the media is not helping at all, and from the stand point of someone who is not just a keyboard warrior but actually puts on a pair of comfortable shoes and gets the fuck out in the real world to try to make a difference, the media has made it next to impossible.

Fuck it. The end.

The worst decision Biden ever made was not running in 2016. I think he would have beat Trump back then and ended this madness before it began

Dr. Ken wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:41 am The worst decision Biden ever made was not running in 2016. I think he would have beat Trump back then and ended this madness before it began

I agree that if Biden had run in 2016 that likely would have ended Trump's foray into politics. But I think Biden was deep in grief over his son's death and just didn't have it in him to run. But yeah, that would have stopped Trump. I think if he had lost 2016 he would have slunk away, he never thought he'd win and he wouldn't have wanted another loss.

Yesterday ol' Wifehorn and I drove 100 miles to visit a lower income black couple in the struggling town of Kinston, NC. He's turning 65, so finally we get to meet people who have been clients for many years.

Eastern NC is still heavily segregated, sad to say (of course, in NC, segregation begins with the churches). We drove through many miles of obvious MAGA country, but we didn't see a single Trump sign.

The couple we visited when we got to Kinston was all fired up for Biden.

YMMV. I refuse to panic. Yet.

busterbunker, did you see the poll we have on the subject? Did you vote in the poll? It's 51-12 against Biden dropping out. But those 12 are respected members here and they are invited to share their thoughts, even if you need a new thread to talk about it.

RVInit wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:49 am ... if he had lost 2016 he would have slunk away, he never thought he'd win and he wouldn't have wanted another loss.

I disagree. He made it very clear before the 2016 election that he would not accept a loss as legitimate.

He lost in 2012 and didn't slink away. Ya, most people don't Remember he ran for the Republican nom in 2012. That's why he made Mitt Romney prostrate himself, revenge. And right now he is risking another loss.

Biden would have gotten slammed by the same bullshit as Hillary did. Right now we would all be saying that Hillary should have run in 2016 as she had less negatives than Biden did. The difference was that in 2020 Bidens team was ready for the bullshit.

Suranis wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 8:34 am He lost in 2012 and didn't slink away. Ya, most people don't Remember he ran for the Republican nom in 2012. That's why he made Mitt Romney prostrate himself, revenge. And right now he is risking another loss.

He probably didn't have anyone to tell him that it could be called fake and negated.

He was barely a blip in 2012.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Results_o ... _primaries

Bearly a blip, and He still loudly demanded that the RNC give hm the Nomination without a primary, and when they refused he flounced off. The point is, losing does not make him slink away.

Hell he ran for President in 2000 and bankrupted the reform party. And that didn't stop him hinting at the press that he was about to announce for the presidency for the next 10 years.

I cannot yet give in. Partly, because I don't believe the polls at this point. Saturday proved that a lot of things could change disastrously from this point. I expect a lot of bad things are yet to come, but not necessarily that tfg will win.

538 still giving biden a higher win%

I have a feeling if Trump loses again this time he'll run again in 2028

I hope he's not able by then, by whatever means.

Foggy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:51 am busterbunker, did you see the poll we have on the subject? Did you vote in the poll? It's 51-12 against Biden dropping out. But those 12 are respected members here and they are invited to share their thoughts, even if you need a new thread to talk about it.

Yes, and I was one of the 12, not that I consider myself respected. I kinda feel sorry for the guy, losing his marbles due to old age, on such a public stage. It's practically elder abuse. But genocide is genocide and I expect the electoral map will be blood red.

I have friends who have entered a state of panic, but they're rich and can afford it. Some of us don't have that luxury, we're just planning ahead.

busterbunker wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 12:27 pm

Foggy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:51 am busterbunker, did you see the poll we have on the subject? Did you vote in the poll? It's 51-12 against Biden dropping out. But those 12 are respected members here and they are invited to share their thoughts, even if you need a new thread to talk about it.

Yes, and I was one of the 12, not that I consider myself respected. I kinda feel sorry for the guy, losing his marbles due to old age, on such a public stage. It's practically elder abuse. But genocide is genocide and I expect the electoral map will be blood red.

I have friends who have entered a state of panic, but they're rich and can afford it. Some of us don't have that luxury, we're just planning ahead.

So what's your excuse for trump losing his marbles?

Meanwhile, in the real world, Postcards to Swing States has a goal of mailing 19 million postcards. Neither the media nor the pollsters ever take note of the thousands of grassroots activists working to save democracy.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 12:36 pm

busterbunker wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 12:27 pm

Foggy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:51 am busterbunker, did you see the poll we have on the subject? Did you vote in the poll? It's 51-12 against Biden dropping out. But those 12 are respected members here and they are invited to share their thoughts, even if you need a new thread to talk about it.

Yes, and I was one of the 12, not that I consider myself respected. I kinda feel sorry for the guy, losing his marbles due to old age, on such a public stage. It's practically elder abuse. But genocide is genocide and I expect the electoral map will be blood red.

I have friends who have entered a state of panic, but they're rich and can afford it. Some of us don't have that luxury, we're just planning ahead.

So what's your excuse for trump losing his marbles?

You have to have marbles to begin with in order to lose them.

busterbunker wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 5:03 am Kids aren't that hip to genocide and he lost the youth vote.

I agree that Biden has lost the progressive youth vote. (Not voting for Biden benefits the greater of their perceived evils, of course, but there's a sense the next Bernie eventually will correct everything and vindicate their principled opposition.)

But, due to electoral math, it isn't a pure numbers game. Biden can spare votes in California, New York, and other deep blue states. (Which likely encourages the progressives to "vote their conscience"; there's nothing at stake.)

The Biden campaign seems aware this election will be decided not in the Beltway but the Rust Belt, and will be targeting those voters.

bob wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 1:49 pm I agree that Biden has lost the progressive youth vote.

No-one wants to lose the vote of the people who never vote out of principle or too much weed. [/snark]

Dr. Ken wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:41 am The worst decision Biden ever made was not running in 2016. I think he would have beat Trump back then and ended this madness before it began

That is correct.

Suranis wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:32 pm

bob wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 1:49 pm I agree that Biden has lost the progressive youth vote.

No-one wants to lose the vote of the people who never vote out of principle or too much weed. [/snark]

It's more than that. The deck is stacked against young people voting, and particularly if they do not have a family history of civic engagement.

It is difficult for young people, who are more transient than older folks, to have established residency at a particular address for the requisite length of time in many jurisdictions - particularly if they are college students against whom the rules are particularly stacked.

But, yeah, we went through the whole rigamarolle of amending the Constitution to make sure that draft age persons could vote, but that was the only thing in my lifetime that ever motivated young people to take action in significant numbers (aside from possibly Eugene McCarthy) - and it still was mainly the product of older people who didn't want their kids sent to Vietnam believing that younger people would magically vote our way out of it.

The exception? Evangelical right wing kids who would just as soon cheerlead killing Gazans faster. They vote.

Two of my 3 kids, all in their 30s, don't vote, and I'm not sure either of them ever have. My oldest doesn't even live in this country and she takes time off of work to make sure she has her vote counted here. It seems like every election there is some problem with her getting her ballot though. Odd how it never seems to happen when the IRS comes calling for her taxes.

busterbunker wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 5:03 am Kids aren't that hip to genocide and he lost the youth vote.

Thing is.. no one cares. ok, being a bit less flippant.. the youth vote has never been a terribly important block, bordering on irrelevant. Its main value historically has been presenting it to older voters as 'look what the kids are doing! doin't you want to that too/stop that??''

The youth vote has never been terribly good at coalescing and delivering a reliable block of votes. Since they can't deliver, there isn't much incentive to spend political capital catering to them.

And he's got covid

neeneko wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 7:05 pm

busterbunker wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2024 5:03 am Kids aren't that hip to genocide and he lost the youth vote.

Thing is.. no one cares. ok, being a bit less flippant.. the youth vote has never been a terribly important block, bordering on irrelevant. Its main value historically has been presenting it to older voters as 'look what the kids are doing! doin't you want to that too/stop that??''

The youth vote has never been terribly good at coalescing and delivering a reliable block of votes. Since they can't deliver, there isn't much incentive to spend political capital catering to them.

Pffft. You have no clue about target demographics and media marketing. I can't even respond, i might be accused of ageism.

Would you push your grandpa in front of crowds while we still got Covid? Desperate times.

And you gotta know you're toast when all your AiPAC freinds are wheeling you to your grave, even though you gave them all the bombs they needed to kill Arab children. You're just a Catholic goy and they know it. They are exploiting you. That's elder abuse.

Props to the dude who mentioned Eugene McCarthy but this Chicago DNC will be a snoozefest for losers.

I have three questions:

What are you willing to do to force Biden to quit against his will?

How do you force pledged delegates at the convention to violate their pledge? and

What should the name of the new political party be, after all the African Americans leave the Democratic Party in revolt?

Because this is all about a minority of Democrats deciding they're in charge, using force to get their way, and they are going to FUCK the rest of us.