Spreadnecks: COVIDIOTS, Anti-Maskers, Anti-Vaxxers, Etc.

[LM K]

YouTube shorts don't embed.

These shorts are from Doc Schmidt.

A day at anti-vaxx hospital

The logic of an anti-vaxx nurse

If hypertension was as controversial as covid

A covid denier goes through the 5 stages of grief

[RTH10260]

The channel of Doc Schmidt
"I'm a GI doctor who likes making funny and informative videos. I started out on TikTok and now I'm here to make longer form content. Let me know what you think!"
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLbidg ... rxDkwNKr0g

[RTH10260]

Off Topic

Youtube Shorts

A new Youtube format created with a special tool, clips limited to max 60", in vertical format, as a direct response to TikTok.

What is the point of YouTube Shorts?

YouTube Shorts enables users to produce vertical short-form videos, with features such as video segmenting, app-based recording, and musical overlays. Videos must be 60 seconds or less and do not disappear like Instagram Reels or Stories content.

The Shorts are also listed with a regular video clip id in the authors Videos section.

Shorts link   https:// www.youtube.com/shorts/__4gKWO5UN4
regular link  https:// www.youtube.com/watch?v=__4gKWO5UN4

[bill_g]

Well, she couldn't get a transplant anyway, since her religious beliefs preclude her from taking the immunosuppressants required to prevent rejection.

Immabettin no one discussed the finer points with her.

[Lani]

Well, she couldn't get a transplant anyway, since her religious beliefs preclude her from taking the immunosuppressants required to prevent rejection.

Immabettin no one discussed the finer points with her.

I'm betting she wouldn't have listened to it anyway.

[bill_g]

I'm betting she wouldn't have listened to it anyway.

We need that list again that had all the common products that used stem cell testing to prove safety and efficacy like Pepto Bismol and aspirin.

[Lani]

I'm betting she wouldn't have listened to it anyway.

We need that list again that had all the common products that used stem cell testing to prove safety and efficacy like Pepto Bismol and aspirin.

And tylenol!

[Sam the Centipede]

Is the list of baby-sacrificing drugs entirely fair? Many very old medications will have been developed without cell cultures, so were probably kosher or halal or whatever term fundy christians use.

Is it reasonable to suggest that these drugs should become haram because many years later safety testers or medical researchers working on them use cell lines that arguably have fetal origins? It seems dishonest to me, especially when criticizing hypocritical behavior in others.

The point about these people's allegedly religious objections being contingent on "owning the libs" is well made. If they really object to cell cultures that seriously they need to stick to boiling up herbs and making poultices. Definitely no chemotherapy or transplant surgery.

[bill_g]

I stay away from calling someone hypocritical because it's inflammatory and shuts down discussions before they begin. Hypocracy is the Health Food store owner (the my-body-is-my-temple guy) busted for smoking cigs behind the store ... even if they are organic.

I think the liver transplant patient dropped from the recipient list needs to be informed that the process she wants involves factors she claims she doesn't want. Perhaps she'll understand. Not holding my breath.

[sugar magnolia]

Is the list of baby-sacrificing drugs entirely fair? Many very old medications will have been developed without cell cultures, so were probably kosher or halal or whatever term fundy christians use.

Is it reasonable to suggest that these drugs should become haram because many years later safety testers or medical researchers working on them use cell lines that arguably have fetal origins? It seems dishonest to me, especially when criticizing hypocritical behavior in others.

The point about these people's allegedly religious objections being contingent on "owning the libs" is well made. If they really object to cell cultures that seriously they need to stick to boiling up herbs and making poultices. Definitely no chemotherapy or transplant surgery.

The fundies are the ones with the objections. All the list maker did was identify a group of commonly used medications that relied on stem cells in research and development. Sounds perfectly fair to me, and should have been welcomed with open arms by the objectors. If, in fact, that is their true objection. It isn't.

[Suranis]

Plus saying "stem cells" is a bit of a misnomer anyway. There is a long line of research that relied on non foetal stem cells and resulted in drugs and treatments.

[Sam the Centipede]

All the list maker did was identify a group of commonly used medications that relied on stem cells in research and development.

My point was that I don't think all those old drugs "relied on stem cells in research and development."

As Suranis points out, not all stem cells or other cell culture lines are fetally derived. And even if they were, their posited "unclean" nature does not permeate everything connected to them.

But it is a shibboleth (as is ranting about abortion rights) for nutters to prove they sacrifice at the holy orange altar in the One True Temple of Assholery.

[Sequoia32]

I don't know where to put this, so I'm putting it here.

While some employees are leaving United because of the vaccine requirement, some people applying for jobs at the airline “volunteered that they were especially interested in career opportunities at United because of the vaccine requirement,” a spokesperson said.

Since late August — after it announced the vaccine requirement — United said it received more than 20,000 applications for 2,000 open flight attendant positions.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/business ... story.html

[Azastan]

[
My point was that I don't think all those old drugs "relied on stem cells in research and development."

Well, apparently stem cells are used to research these medications, regardless of how old the drugs are.

Sep. 18, 2021 -- A hospital system in Arkansas is requiring employees to confirm that they won’t use common medications — such as Tylenol, Tums, and Preparation H — to receive a religious exemption for the COVID-19 vaccine, according to Becker’s Hospital Review.

The Conway Regional Health System has required the flu shot annually as part of employment, but managers saw a spike in vaccine exemption requests for the COVID-19 vaccine.

“This was significantly disproportionate to what we’ve seen with the influenza vaccine,” Matt Troup, president and CEO of the health system, told Becker’s.

The majority of requests cited the use of fetal cell lines in the development of vaccines as part of the religious exemption. The practice uses cells grown in labs to test many new vaccines and drugs, including common antacids and cold medications.

“Thus, we provided a religious attestation form for those individuals requesting a religious exemption,” Troup said.

The hospital’s form includes a list of 30 common medications that used fetal cell lines during research and development. The list includes acetaminophen, albuterol, aspirin, ibuprofen, Tylenol, Pepto Bismol, Tums, Lipitor, Senokot, Motrin, Maalox, Ex-Lax, Benadryl, Sudafed, Preparation H, Claritin, Prilosec, and Zoloft.

Employees are asked to attest that they “truthfully acknowledge and affirm that my sincerely held religious belief is consistent and true” and that they won’t use the medications listed.

Health system administrators want to “educate staff who might have requested an exemption without understanding the full scope of how fetal cells are used in testing and development in common medicines,” Troup said.

And this:

To be clear, food and beverages do not contain any aborted fetal material; however, they may be tastier because of it. How is that?

The American biotech company Senomyx has developed chemical additives that can enhance flavor and smell. To do this, they had to produce an army of never-tiring taste testers–that is, flavor receptors engineered from human embryonic kidney cells (HEK 293, fetal cell line popular in pharmaceutical research). These artificial taste buds can tell product developers which products the public will crave. The goal is to do a taste bud “sleight of hand,” creating low-sugar and low-sodium products that taste sweet or salty while actually using less sugar or sodium in the product.

Does your Nestle Coffee-mate Pumpkin Spice refrigerated creamer taste more like autumn? Does your Maggi bouillon taste just like chicken? Thank Senomyx.

The laboratory-created artificial enhancers do not have to be tested at length by the FDA because the Senomyx chemical “flavor compounds are used in proportions less than one part per million” and can be classified as artificial flavors.

In 2005, Senomyx had contracts to develop products for Kraft Foods, Nestle, Campbell Soup and Coca-Cola. However, when it was discovered in 2011 that PepsiCo was using Senomyx to develop a reduced sugar beverage, a boycott ensued that caused Kraft-Cadbury Adams LLC and Campbell Soup cancelled their contracts with Senomyx. In a 2012 letter to Children of God for Life, PepsiCo stated, “Senomyx does not use HEK cells or any other tissues or cell lines derived from human embryos or fetuses for research performed on behalf of PepsiCo.” To that effect, PepsiCo is working with Senomyx on two products developed with Sweetmyx 617, a new Senomyx sweet taste modifier.

In November 2018, the Swiss company Firmenich acquired Senomyx, Inc. Firmenich describes itself as “a global leader in taste innovation and expert in sweet, cooling and bitter solutions.”

and this:

Perhaps you are a diligent supporter and promoter of pro-life legislation, only vote for pro-life candidates, avoid entertainment from musicians and actors who openly support Planned Parenthood. Regardless, you may unwittingly be cooperating in aborted fetal cell research by purchasing products that use aborted fetuses, either in the product itself or in its development.

One might take Enbrel (Amgen) to relieve Rheumatoid Arthritis. Your husband was given Zoastavax (Merck), a Shingles vaccine, at his annual physical. Your mother with diabetes and renal failure is prescribed Arensep (Amgen). Your grandfather is given the blood product Repro (Eli Lilly) during an angioplasty. The local school district requires that your grandchildren receive the MMRII (the Merck Measles-Mumps-Rubella vaccine). Your daughter and son use coffee creamers and eat soup with artificial flavor enhancers (Senomyx/Firmenich) tested on artificial taste buds engineered from aborted fetal cells.

If you are truly looking for a religious exemption because you object to using fetal stem cell research, you should be avoiding ALL of these products.

[Sam the Centipede]

No Azastan, i don't buy that faulty reasoning. It's rather analogous to saying that because I disapprove of Donald Trump and Donald Trump wears shoes, I must not wear shoes.

Shoes as a class don't become unclean because somebody somebody objectionable wears shoes. Kitchen knives are occasionally used to commit murder, but I don't see that as a reason to deny myself kitchen knives. Not do I suggest that others who dislike Donald Trump and murder live without nice shoes or sharp knives.

If I claimed to be an observant vegetarian and I incessantly railed against exploitation of animals, iyou could reasonably comment on seeing me in a shop choosing new leather shoes. Equally it would be appropriate to question whether I really dislike Donald Trump if you saw a photo of my happy face under a MAGA hat. That I don't dispute.

Precursors of aspirin, such as willow leaves, were used in prehistory; preparations of willow bark in the 18th century (a 1763 paper to the Royal Society describes an English vicar's experiments with powdered willow bark), early 19th century chemists purified and identified the active ingredient, and at the end of the 19th century a less irritant form, acetylsalicylic acid (aspirin), was developed and patented in Germany. Not a cell culture in sight (no human cell cultures before the 20th century).

Yet according to this reasoning that gains disappointing traction here, a conscientious and consistent objector to the use of human cell cultures must deny him/herself aspirin because some later tests and experiments with aspirin (and there are many each year) use cell cultures?

Of course I don't support religious exemptions claimed inconsistently. I'm not a fan of religious exemptions generally. But neither do I enjoy overcooked arguments against those exemptions seemingly based on faulty reasoning and guilt by association.

[p0rtia]

I don't think you guys are arguing the same issue.

[Azastan]

I don't think you guys are arguing the same issue.

Yes, you are correct!

[Azastan]

Yet according to this reasoning that gains disappointing traction here, a conscientious and consistent objector to the use of human cell cultures must deny him/herself aspirin because some later tests and experiments with aspirin (and there are many each year) use cell cultures?

Of course I don't support religious exemptions claimed inconsistently. I'm not a fan of religious exemptions generally. But neither do I enjoy overcooked arguments against those exemptions seemingly based on faulty reasoning and guilt by association.

My quotes are taken directly from the Children of God for Life website. It's what THEY believe. So, in other words, if you are truly anti-abortion, then you must not use these drugs. Period. The hospital's religious exemption form lets these people know, if you are using any of these commonly used drugs, you are violating your religious beliefs.

What you WOULD be allowed to do is use a preparation of steeped willow bark, because that's not had research done on it by testing with cell cultures.

[pipistrelle]

Off Topic

Indigenous people knew about willow bark and other drugs. Just saying.

[LM K]

Plus saying "stem cells" is a bit of a misnomer anyway. There is a long line of research that relied on non foetal stem cells and resulted in drugs and treatments.

True. And I applaud those developing alternatives to fetal cell lines.

But most drugs are researched using the 40 and 50 year fetal cell lines.

Think about the items in your house for a moment. Do you have coffee creamer in the fridge? Mouthwash or anti-aging cream on the bathroom counter? Spices in your kitchen cabinet? How about a bandage on your arm from a recent vaccine, or prescription drugs? If you answered yes to any of these questions, there’s a chance that you have a product that was made using human fetal cells. While it’s not a universal practice, certain brands in the cosmetics, food, and medical industries use fetal cells for a variety of purposes, from testing and production to inclusion in the final product.


These cells have a number of applications. Researchers discovered that the cell line derived from the skin of a fourteen-week-old male fetus aborted in Switzerland had restorative properties for skin. Originally, it was used to treat ulcers, burns, and scars. Eventually the skincare brand Neocutis realized that the same properties that healed injured skin could be used to rejuvenate wrinkled skin. They incorporate cells from that fetal line as a proprietary ingredient in some of their anti-aging products.

In the food and beverage industry, biotech company Senomyx uses the cell line HEK-293 for research and development of new flavor additives. To be clear, they are not adding fetal cells into food or beverages. Rather, they use the flavor receptors in the kidney cells of a female fetus aborted in the 1970s as tireless taste testers. This allows Senomyx to efficiently test new formulations of flavor or scent additives, to produce the most flavor with the least amount of sugar and salt. Companies that have developed products with Senomyx include Ajinomoto, Nestle, and Firmenich. Other companies — such as Kraft, Solae, Campbell Soup, and Pepsi — have changed or cancelled their contracts with Senomyx to ensure that no fetal cells were used to develop their products.*

Fetal cell lines are used most extensively in the medical industry, in testing, production, and treatment. Fetal cells have been used to test treatments for some degenerative conditions, such as Parkinson’s disease. Human fetal cells are also used to grow the viruses that are used in certain vaccines, since viruses cannot easily be replicated without a cell to host them. The vaccines for chicken pox, rubella, and shingles are examples of vaccines that use fetal cells in their production process. Not all vaccines are produced in this way, and there are some ethical alternatives that don’t use these cell lines in their creation. Some prescription medications, such as Enbrel and Pulmozyme, actually contain fetal cells as an ingredient. The implantation of fetal cells into the body, similar to the process of transplanting an organ, is being explored as a potential cure for ailments such as retinitis pigmentosa.

Despite this type of work going on for decades, not many people know about it. The use of fetal tissue came into the spotlight in recent years when the controversial videos by the Center for Medical Progress — which revealed Planned Parenthood executives discussing the procurement and sale of fetal tissue — were released. But the attention brought to this practice by the videos was still not enough to make it a well-known issue; this is partly due to the fact that the range of its use is not clearly advertised. For example, the FDA does not always require cosmetics companies to include a list of their ingredients, though Neocutis freely admits to their use of fetal cells. Similarly, when the flavor enhancers developed by Senomyx are added to foods, they are in a low enough concentration that they can be labelled as “artificial flavors.” This means that consumers cannot easily trace which foods include those additives. Vaccines manufacturers provide a list of their ingredients, but not all patients read through the ingredient list before getting a shot — and when these ingredients are listed, the cell lines are referred to by their alphanumeric name. If you don’t know what you’re looking for, you might never realize exactly what it means.

*In 2018 Firmenich bought out Senomyx.

This article is quite interesting. The website is trying to help anti-vaxxers feel comfortable taking many of the meds on this list of drugs.

14 Medicines Fr. Matthew Schneider Claimed Use Aborted Fetal Cell Lines – But Do Not

Fr. Matthew Schneider on meds and fetal cell line research.
If any drug tested on hek-293 is immoral, goodbye modern medicine.

[Azastan]

Fr. Matthew Schneider on meds and fetal cell line research.
If any drug tested on hek-293 is immoral, goodbye modern medicine.

Fr. Schneider makes the point that although many older drugs have been around for years, research is still being done using HEK-293 cell lines to test medications and their effectiveness in vitro, allowing new drugs to be tested for safety and efficacy before subjecting actual human subjects to the drugs.

There's obviously a lot of tap dancing going on with the whole 'I have a religious objection', and the people using that as an excuse will tap dance away to justify taking Embrel, but not getting a vaccination for COVID-19.

Dance away!

[LM K]

Precursors of aspirin, such as willow leaves, were used in prehistory; preparations of willow bark in the 18th century (a 1763 paper to the Royal Society describes an English vicar's experiments with powdered willow bark), early 19th century chemists purified and identified the active ingredient, and at the end of the 19th century a less irritant form, acetylsalicylic acid (aspirin), was developed and patented in Germany. Not a cell culture in sight (no human cell cultures before the 20th century).

The discovery and isolation of a chemical compound is different from researching, formulating, and manufacturing the chemical compound for consumer consumption.

Yet according to this reasoning that gains disappointing traction here, a conscientious and consistent objector to the use of human cell cultures must deny him/herself aspirin because some later tests and experiments with aspirin (and there are many each year) use cell cultures?

Of course I don't support religious exemptions claimed inconsistently. I'm not a fan of religious exemptions generally. But neither do I enjoy overcooked arguments against those exemptions seemingly based on faulty reasoning and guilt by association.

I disagree. Those requesting a vax exemption because they don't want a fetal cell line researched drug in their body.

Why are they willing to ingest a different drug that was researched using fetal cell lines? That's a fair question.

Hospitals have for years required employees to receive flu shots. Most will give religious exemptions. All the sudden the covid vax is mandated and the number of fetal cell line based religious exemption requests skyrockets?

Most nursing schools require their students be vaxed for Measles and Hep B. Most nurses are vaxed for most diseases. Suddenly tens of thousands of nurses found religion and learned of fetal cell lines?

Folks have discovered a way to try to work the system.

For those whom have used a fetal cell line argument for other vaxes, fine. I do believe that some have an ethical issue with the use of fetal cell vaxes. But those requesting a religious exemption for that reason should actually believe their assertion.

[LM K]

Fr. Matthew Schneider on meds and fetal cell line research.
If any drug tested on hek-293 is immoral, goodbye modern medicine.

Fr. Schneider makes the point that although many older drugs have been around for years, research is still being done using HEK-293 cell lines to test medications and their effectiveness in vitro, allowing new drugs to be tested for safety and efficacy before subjecting actual human subjects to the drugs.

There's obviously a lot of tap dancing going on with the whole 'I have a religious objection', and the people using that as an excuse will tap dance away to justify taking Embrel, but not getting a vaccination for COVID-19.

Dance away!

Exactly. Covid exemption claims are based on politics not religion.

Pope Francis told his flock that they have a moral responsibility to protect each other from covid. The faithful need to vaccinate to save lives.

[Luke]

I'm betting she wouldn't have listened to it anyway.

We need that list again that had all the common products that used stem cell testing to prove safety and efficacy like Pepto Bismol and aspirin.

This story talked about how if someone wants a COFVID religious exemption at Conway Regional Health System in Arkansas, they also have to "swear off swear off extremely common medicines, such as Tylenol, Tums, and even Preparation H, to get the exemption". https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/09 ... exemption/

[keith]

Just sayin'...

Mechanism of Ivermectin Facilitation of Human P2X4 Receptor Channels

In the present study, the effects of IVM on the human P2X4 (hP2X4) receptor channel stably transfected in HEK293 cells