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Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

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Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#1

Post by raison de arizona »

“Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.” —John Adams
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#2

Post by Ben-Prime »

The complete pessimist in me says that they have the 5 votes and those five votes (Alito, Gorsuch, Thomas, Kavanaugh, and Coney Barrett) aren't going to change, and now it's all coming down to whether C.J. Roberts joins them and thereby writes a different majority opinion than whatever Alito wrote.

Either way, brace yourselves. Winter ain't got nothin' on what's coming.
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And justice shall be done.

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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#3

Post by bob »

Ben-Prime wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 12:53 am The complete pessimist in me says that they have the 5 votes and those five votes (Alito, Gorsuch, Thomas, Kavanaugh, and Coney Barrett) aren't going to change, and now it's all coming down to whether C.J. Roberts joins them and thereby writes a different majority opinion than whatever Alito wrote.
Yes: The Chief could assign himself the majority opinion, and write something very narrow. That won't obtain a majority of votes, and therefore wouldn't be binding.*

Then Alioto could write a concurring opinion that does receive a majority of votes. Under court precedent, it would be the court's holding.

If there are five votes to overturn Roe, they aren't going to give away the ballgame just to gain a sixth vote for a more narrow holding.


* "The CHIEF JUSTICE delivered the opinion of the court, which JUSTICES THOMAS, ALIOTO, GORSUCH, KAVANAUGH, and BARRETT join as to PARTS I [the facts] and V [the conclusion] only. JUSTICE ALIOTO delivered a concurring opinion, which JUSTICES THOMAS, GORSUCH, KAVANAUGH, and BARRETT join."
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#4

Post by AndyinPA »

I'm sure Roberts believes it should be overturned. It's "his court," so he just doesn't want his name attached to such a piece of crap that takes away rights.
"Choose your leaders with wisdom and forethought. To be led by a coward is to be controlled by all that the coward fears… To be led by a liar is to ask to be told lies." -Octavia E. Butler
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#5

Post by Slim Cognito »

Other than outrage, what was the point of leaking this? Will it affect the primaries? I can see it affecting the general.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#6

Post by bob »

Slim Cognito wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 12:23 pm Other than outrage, what was the point of leaking this? Will it affect the primaries?
The hope that widespread public outrage, threats to court-pack, etc., will cause one of the five to reconsider.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#7

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"Choose your leaders with wisdom and forethought. To be led by a coward is to be controlled by all that the coward fears… To be led by a liar is to ask to be told lies." -Octavia E. Butler
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#8

Post by raison de arizona »

Data Broker Is Selling Location Data of People Who Visit Abortion Clinics
It costs just over $160 to get a week's worth of data on where people who visited Planned Parenthood came from, and where they went afterwards.

A location data firm is selling information related to visits to clinics that provide abortions including Planned Parenthood facilities, showing where groups of people visiting the locations came from, how long they stayed there, and where they then went afterwards, according to sets of the data purchased by Motherboard.

The data sale is obviously more important in the context of a leaked Supreme Court draft opinion in which Justice Alito indicated that the court is ready to repeal the decision in Roe v. Wade, the decades-old precedent that has provided federal protections to those seeking an abortion. If that draft does become a formal decision, it would immediately fully or partly ban abortion rights in at least 13 states.

How data collecting intersects with abortion rights, or the lack thereof, is likely to gather more attention in the wake of the draft. The country may also see an increase in vigilante activity or forms of surveillance and harassment against those seeking or providing abortions. With this aggregated location data available to anyone on the open market, customers could include anti-abortion vigilantes as well. Anti-abortion groups are already fairly adept at using novel technology for their goals. In 2016, an advertising CEO who worked with anti-abortion and Christian groups sent targeted advertisements to women sitting in Planned Parenthood clinics in an attempt to change their decision around getting an abortion. The sale of the location data raises questions around why companies are selling data based on abortion clinics specifically, and whether they should introduce more safeguards around the purchase of that information, if be selling it at all.

“It's bonkers dangerous to have abortion clinics and then let someone buy the census tracks where people are coming from to visit that abortion clinic,” Zach Edwards, a cybersecurity researcher who closely tracks the data selling marketplace, told Motherboard in an online chat after reviewing the data. “This is how you dox someone traveling across state lines for abortions—how you dox clinics providing this service.”
:snippity:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/m7vzjb/ ... parenthood
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#9

Post by Foggy »

I am too angry and horrified to comment without raging and ranting.
I'll wait for the final opinion of the Court to be released.
I'm trying to be a nicer person.
But they make it hard. :mad:
Out from under. :thumbsup:
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#10

Post by Kendra »


Please God, let it be Clarence and Ginni Thomas. I will never ask you for anything again. Amen.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#11

Post by Uninformed »

If you can't lie to yourself, who can you lie to?
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#12

Post by Patagoniagirl »

Anyone notice in this video, he has a wire hanger behind him on the shelf?
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#13

Post by neeneko »

Slim Cognito wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 12:23 pm Other than outrage, what was the point of leaking this? Will it affect the primaries? I can see it affecting the general.
That is a really interesting question. I could see either side of the issue believing they would benefit from such a release, and I could also see how a 3rd party could see using it as, say, a distraction from a certain war.

Though comically, I did actually see someone suggesting it was part of a plot to distract from Hunter Biden's laptop.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#14

Post by Kendra »


I clerked at the Supreme Court. Last night, I assumed a liberal clerk leaked the draft opinion overturning Roe. Now I think MUCH more likely it was leaked by a conservative fanatically committed to every word of Alito’s monstrous opinion. **🧵**
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#15

Post by neeneko »

Kendra wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 1:30 pm
Please God, let it be Clarence and Ginni Thomas. I will never ask you for anything again. Amen.
Thomas is actually my top guess for who leaked it. Here is someone close to leaving, stands to benefit from discord/distrust, and it could potentially force the hand of justices who were doubting if this was the right move since it kinda commits them.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#16

Post by Whatever4 »

neeneko wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 2:26 pm
Slim Cognito wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 12:23 pm Other than outrage, what was the point of leaking this? Will it affect the primaries? I can see it affecting the general.
That is a really interesting question. I could see either side of the issue believing they would benefit from such a release, and I could also see how a 3rd party could see using it as, say, a distraction from a certain war.

Though comically, I did actually see someone suggesting it was part of a plot to distract from Hunter Biden's laptop.
I think the link was from a conservative clerk, possibly with a nod from their justice. The leak pretty much locks in the draft positions. Normally, there’d be some horse trading going on. Perhaps CJ Roberts would order it toned down in order to get his vote. Now such a change would be obvious.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#17

Post by Kendra »


"Presumably" is doing a huge amount of work here. It could also be a conservative clerk trying to lock in anti-abortion votes.
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#18

Post by Phoenix520 »

Re: reason for it to be a Thomas:

Thé neener neener factor.

They both seem to be petty people.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#19

Post by Phoenix520 »

Off Topic
id love to see some group like Meidas Touch or even Lincoln Project institute a weekly Award for Performative Politics. Best Outrage, Best Disappointed, Best Hypocrite, etc. They could be called The Marjies (or…name your least favorite). You’d have to limit the number of awards a politician wins in a given month or Cruz would win every category, every week.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#20

Post by raison de arizona »

neeneko wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 2:26 pm Though comically, I did actually see someone suggesting it was part of a plot to distract from Hunter Biden's laptop.
There is a decent amount of discussion on Truth ( :lol: ) that it was leaked by a left wing activist in order to distract from the release of convicted felon Dinesh D'Souza's 2000 Mules movie, which provides concrete proof that the 2020 election was stolen.

:roll:
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#21

Post by Volkonski »

“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.” ― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#22

Post by raison de arizona »

Well I'm not taking that bet. :(
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#23

Post by Patagoniagirl »

Foggy wrote: Tue May 03, 2022 1:19 pm I am too angry and horrified to comment without raging and ranting.
I'll wait for the final opinion of the Court to be released.
I'm trying to be a nicer person.
But they make it hard. :mad:
:cussing:

I should take this good advice. I feel angry, sad, defeated. I will refrain from banshee screeching for now.
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#24

Post by raison de arizona »

Kyle Griffin @kylegriffin1 wrote: Sen. Lisa Murkowski: "Roe is still the law of the land, we don't know the direction that this decision will ultimately take, but if it goes in the direction that this leaked copy has indicated, I will just tell you that it rocks my confidence in the court right now."
Murkowski voted no on Kavanaugh, but yes on Gorsuch and Barrett.
“Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.” —John Adams
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Re: Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

#25

Post by Uninformed »

If you can't lie to yourself, who can you lie to?
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