Roe vs. Wade, American abortion rights

[raison de arizona]

Frankly, I don't give a shit about the leak. But I am curious as to whether it was actually criminal or not, because I haven't seen anything other than breathless MAGA reporting saying that it is. No statutes, no laws, nothing. And as Dan Rather says...

The story is the end of Roe and the radicalism it represents. The leak is a plot point. We can’t lose track of the big picture.

[bob]

But- I haven't seen anyone specify a law that was broken or what the leaker would be prosecuted for. I'm not saying that the leak wasn't against the law, I don't know. But is anyone aware of or has heard anything regarding an actual criminal law that the leaker would be prosecuted and jailed under?

The consensus is there isn't one. The closest would probably be federal theft:

Whoever embezzles, steals, purloins, or knowingly converts to his use or the use of another, or without authority, sells, conveys or disposes of any record, voucher, money, or thing of value of the United States or of any department or agency thereof, or any property made or being made under contract for the United States or any department or agency thereof . . . [shall] be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; but if the value of such property in the aggregate, combining amounts from all the counts for which the defendant is convicted in a single case, does not exceed the sum of $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

I would expect, however, any defense lawyer to argue a draft of an opinion isn't a "record" (or "thing of value"). Nor was leaking it "conveying" or "disposing" of it.

Cf. Foogy's bud, JAGhunter Fitzpatrick, was charged with the state crime of tampering with government records when he stole the grand juror list.

[raison de arizona]

Thx bob- yeah I'm not sure it is of "value" either- "The word “value” means face, par, or market value, or cost price, either wholesale or retail, whichever is greater."

Providing the leaker didn't financially gain from the leak - did Politico pay them? - it seems like quite a stretch.

[Jim]

Please join me in support of...

Mother's Day Strike: Threat to Roe v. Wade sparks call for no work, no shopping and 'no more tolerating being treated like guests in our own bodies'

By the time they hopped off Instagram Live around four hours later, they had their answer — with a domain name secured and a website already up and running. Meet the Mother's Day Strike, a week-long call to action that kicks off on Sunday, May 8 — Mother's Day — and runs through May 15. In between, there will be, per the website Kolarik set up, "no work. No unpaid labor. No shopping. No restaurants. No more tolerating being treated like guests in our own bodies."

The threat to the landmark 1973 abortion rights decision has already given rise to demonstrations across the country. While Kolarik is a firm believer in the right to protest, they felt that the Supreme Court news called for a different, more drastic approach — one that would have economic repercussions and "hit 'em in the bank."

No economic activity 5/8-5/15 for me. Everything I'll need for the week, I'll already have. Even my bills are all paid up.

[bob]

Thx bob- yeah I'm not sure it is of "value" either- "The word “value” means face, par, or market value, or cost price, either wholesale or retail, whichever is greater."

Cf. The Pelican Brief, in which justices were killed to shape the court's votes. While far-fetched (and a stupid book), there could be value in knowing an outcome before it public. If, for example, the draft was about some Google v. Facebook case, knowing the result early could lead to some creative stock manipulations; a person could profit off the information. In theory, knowing abortion was soon to be illegal in a large number of states could lead to the purchase of the stock of pharmaceutical companies that manufacture medical abortion pills.

Too also: Foogy's bud, JAGhunter Fitzpatrick, was charged with the state crime of tampering with government records when he stole the grand juror list.

[poplove]

There's also discussions about how the reversal will affect military women since there's been a rise in sexual assaults.

[DrIrvingFinegarten]

Though comically, I did actually see someone suggesting it was part of a plot to distract from Hunter Biden's laptop.

There is a decent amount of discussion on Truth ( ) that it was leaked by a left wing activist in order to distract from the release of convicted felon Dinesh D'Souza's 2000 Mules movie, which provides concrete proof that the 2020 election was stolen.

Everything is a distraction from something else.

[raison de arizona]

[Slim Cognito]

Ima steal that

[sad-cafe]

Love Leslie Jones


she called it in 2019

[AndyinPA]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/05/politics ... index.html

Sen. Susan Collins, a rare GOP supporter of abortion rights who is under scrutiny for her key role in confirming Brett Kavanaugh to the Supreme Court amid fears that Roe v. Wade may soon be overturned, signaled to reporters on Thursday that she would oppose a bill that Democrats plan to bring to the Senate floor next week to codify abortion rights.

The bill, known as the the Women’s Health Protection Act, is on track to fail in the Senate with or without support from the Maine Republican, but the swing vote senator’s likely opposition underscores how difficult it is to reach bipartisan consensus on the contentious issue of abortion and comes as Democrats face enormous pressure to take action after a Supreme Court draft opinion to strike down Roe v. Wade leaked this week.

Collins voted in support of both Neil Gorsuch’s and Kavanaugh’s confirmations and has previously said Kavanaugh told her he agreed that Roe v. Wade is settled law. The senator said on Tuesday that the draft opinion to overturn Roe v. Wade was “completely inconsistent” with what Gorsuch and Kavanaugh “said in their hearings and in our meetings in my office.” She did not go so far as to say, though, that she had been misled by Kavanaugh. When asked that question by CNN, she said, “My statement speaks for itself.”

Collins has introduced her own bill with Republican Sen. Lisa Murkowski of Alaska to codify abortion rights established by Roe v. Wade. Collins argued on Thursday that the measure put forward by Democrats is too broad and raised concerns about the bill not including a so-called conscience clause, which would allow providers to refuse to perform abortions for religious or moral reasons.

[pipistrelle]

“I agree it is settled law.

”I’m here to unsettle it.”

[Kriselda Gray]

Off Topic

id love to see some group like Meidas Touch or even Lincoln Project institute a weekly Award for Performative Politics. Best Outrage, Best Disappointed, Best Hypocrite, etc. They could be called The Marjies (or…name your least favorite). You’d have to limit the number of awards a politician wins in a given month or Cruz would win every category, every week.

[Ben-Prime]

Off Topic

id love to see some group like Meidas Touch or even Lincoln Project institute a weekly Award for Performative Politics. Best Outrage, Best Disappointed, Best Hypocrite, etc. They could be called The Marjies (or…name your least favorite). You’d have to limit the number of awards a politician wins in a given month or Cruz would win every category, every week.

I mean, why not us? Why not a Fogbow arm? We would likely have to file a disclaimer that there will be no honorary retroactive lifetime achievement awards for a few people, lest they be jealous, but.

[Kriselda Gray]

My concern is that they'll write bills barring people from going out of state to have an abortion that are modelled on the Texas abortion ban bill, where the state itself is barred from enforcing the law and instead must be enforced by private citizens suing a woman who has an abortion or anyone who helps her in obtaining one. It would be easy to write a similar law prohibiting someone from leaving the state for the purpose of getting an abortion, barring the state from enforcing it, and turning it over to citizens to enforce via civil suit of the woman or anyone who helps her get to the state line. As of right now, the courts have held that such a law is unreviewable by the courts because the state is forbidden to act on enforcing it.

Frankly, I'm concerned about the proliferation of bills like this forbidding all sorts of acts, preventing the state from enforcing it and turning it over to citizens to sue for violations of the law. I could see it being used for purposes from restricting gay and trans rights to removing civil rights for various groups. It's a pretty scary monster if you think about it much...

[Lani]

They don't have functioning organs. They don't have functioning hearts, just like human embryoids don't. When we are in early into pregancy, and the doctors tell us to hear a heartbeat, it's not a heartbeat. It's the the activity to form the organs. Not kidding. At that early stage, there isn't a heatbeat.

[raison de arizona]

They amended the Louisiana law to ensure it covered ectopic pregnancies. It may deserve its own thread. In the meantime, let's take this opportunity to point out that under this bill a woman with an ectopic pregnancy would face two scenarios: 1) death, or 2) prison (providing she could find a doctor willing to preform the procedure, who would also face prison.)

[AndyinPA]

[Phoenix520]

I’m sorry, how can it possibly be against the law to take steps to save one’s own life?

[bill_g]

A must read thread. File under whodathunkit - Men wanting to make a profit off others misery. Unheard of. (not)

[Volkonski]

[Chilidog]

There's also discussions about how the reversal will affect military women since there's been a rise in sexual assaults.

would it even effect military women? do state medical laws apply to military bases?

[poplove]

There's also discussions about how the reversal will affect military women since there's been a rise in sexual assaults.

would it even effect military women? do state medical laws apply to military bases?

I believe the military doesn't perform abortions unless medically necessary so the woman would have to get one from a civilian provider. Active duty women stationed in TX have to go to another state for care. The same for military dependents. And they become criminals for doing so. This article explains the problem: https://www.defenseone.com/policy/2022/ ... rn/366458/

[Volkonski]

[Volkonski]