What Happened?

John Thomas8
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What Happened?

#1

Post by John Thomas8 »

I've been getting run over by life for a while now, and got to navel gazing about weird things and it occurs to me that the "Great Depression" was a missed opportunity.

What it did was expose the stock-market-driven economy as a fraud. Of course, on it's surface it sounds good, public ownership of corporations can't be bad, can it? Diversity in corporate boards and executives accountable for their actions, awesome in theory. What didn't happen in 1930 was anything of note to stop the fraud. Bandaids were slapped here and there, two or three wrists were slapped, but the fundamentals of the system were for the most part left to regroup for the next mess.

But, our stock market driven economy in practice, it's fundamentally flawed. "Corporate ethics" is more of an oxymoron than "military intelligence", and the lack of the former I assert has done more damage than the latter. The "boom and bust" cycle isn't a natural phenomenon. No, it's a calculated, orchestrated method of keeping ownership from being held accountable. Not in a "Illuminati conspiracy theory" way, but more of a set of immoral people acting independently but in concert to roll things their way.

The missed opportunity, the last pitiful bit of an attempt died when Clinton signed off on killing Glass-Steagall, was doing something sincerely concrete about corporate governance. The mechanisms in place now are like bringing a gerbil to Kursk in 1943 expecting to stop the Wehrmacht single-handed. We have a DEA that is as violent a government entity as we've had but it's pointed at drug use and not actual crime, like stealing from the public by corporations.

An individual in charge of a company convicted of Medicare fraud was a state governor for 8 years and is currently sitting in the US Senate. That's obscene. The sitting prezinut has lost multiple fraud cases, up to 9 figure verdicts. There are no consequences for corporate malfeasance, executives resign with 8-figure golden parachutes and things keep rolling right along. Ship a product known to kill buyers? So what? Stock price is up after the latest layoffs, so we're all good. A company I was employed with behaved like Enron before Enron got caught and that CEO got lifetime access to a corporate jet and a 7 figure payout every year to go with it. 270,000 world-wide employees were kicked to the curb. A bank failed in 2007, took my retirement (saved over 40 years) with it because they wouldn't play with georgie.

At some point doesn't it have to be about people rather than profits?

Sigh.

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Addie
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Re: What Happened?

#2

Post by Addie »

Hugz :grouphug:

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#3

Post by John Thomas8 »

We all need hugs, the planet is being run into ruins by profits.

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Addie
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Re: What Happened?

#4

Post by Addie »

You won't get any argument from me, JT.
John Thomas8 wrote:
Thu Nov 07, 2019 9:10 pm
We all need hugs, the planet is being run into ruins by profits.

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#5

Post by John Thomas8 »


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NMgirl
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Re: What Happened?

#6

Post by NMgirl »

Thanks for sharing. :bighug:

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#7

Post by John Thomas8 »

I'm a little guy sitting in a home office in goofyville north carolina, just wondering why humans don't matter.

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Indigo
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Re: What Happened?

#8

Post by Indigo »

John Thomas8 wrote:
Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:06 pm
I'm a little guy sitting in a home office in goofyville north carolina, just wondering why humans don't matter.
But humans do matter, insofar as some sort of profit can be extracted from their existence.

Otherwise humans don't matter at all in practice. And human life has no intrinsic value or worth whatsoever, despite lofty claims made to the contrary by some.

Not that I agree with this situation. However, my consent is not required.
"I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully." --President George W. Bush

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Suranis
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Re: What Happened?

#9

Post by Suranis »

What happened basically is that people have forgotten what they believe and have turned over their opinion forming duties to "Opinion Formers." This isnt specific to any ideology, this is across the board. So without not having any internal logic to everything theu are thinking, things go into black and white, and eventually to "My team vs your team."

And when its My Team vs Your Team, everything I do is good, and everything you do is bad, whether its consistent with the meaningless values we mouth or not. Values are just a weapon to attack the other side.

Anyway your country has endured people pumping lies and poison into your political discourse for decades, and eventually its going to get sick. The first thin you are going to have to do is shut that down, otherwise you are treating the Symptoms while allowing the patient to mainline cyanide.

Also - Hugs and cheers for you :cheer:
The difference between the Middle Ages, and the Age of the Internet, is that in the Middle Ages no-one thought the Earth was flat.

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Re: What Happened?

#10

Post by John Thomas8 »

However, my consent is not required
But aren't we far enough along in human history when our consent should be required?

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Re: What Happened?

#11

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer »

:grouphug:
A 19th Amendment Centennial Moment:
The 19th Amendment was first introduced to Congress in 1878, yet it was not approved by Congress until 1919 – 41 years later.
- https://legaldictionary.net/19th-amendment/

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Re: What Happened?

#12

Post by voxpopuluxe »

Image

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“It was the worst of times, it was the worst of times.”
—Ali Smith, Autumn

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Slim Cognito
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Re: What Happened?

#13

Post by Slim Cognito »

hugz.jpg
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Indigo
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Re: What Happened?

#14

Post by Indigo »

John Thomas8 wrote:
Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:22 pm
However, my consent is not required
But aren't we far enough along in human history when our consent should be required?
Sadly, no. Even a cursory look at history confirms this.
"I know the human being and fish can coexist peacefully." --President George W. Bush

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Patagoniagirl
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Re: What Happened?

#15

Post by Patagoniagirl »

I've been lurking for some time, for no other reason than I have had nothing substantive to contribute. But this thread shook me. Spoke to me. And again, I have nothing to add because yes... What happened.

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Re: What Happened?

#16

Post by John Thomas8 »

And now we get to witness the end of the "Founding Fathers" vision.

The opposition party is so inept they can't count votes in an informal caucus.

The US Senate has abdicated morality.

I really really believe that the actual end started when Eisenhower was ignored:

...

As we peer into society's future, we – you and I, and our government – must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.

...

Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense. We have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security alone more than the net income of all United States corporations.

Now this conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence—economic, political, even spiritual—is felt in every city, every Statehouse, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet, we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources, and livelihood are all involved. So is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.


The kkkorporation took over. And then, about 11 years later, the US Congress failed abjectly to hold the office holder of US President accountable for the crimes he committed, instead allowing him to resign and enjoy his millions in obscurity. There's consequences for not prosecuting criminals and we're seeing the fruits of that with the farce of an impeachment "trial" conducted by a supporter of a foreign government over his own.

It was a good try, flawed as the start was, but the ideas Declaration of Independence are dead.

Long live the immoral pussy grabber.

Sigh.

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Re: What Happened?

#17

Post by Lani »

Many years ago, I realized that the US was failing. I was in a World History honors program and had a dual major in Economic Geography. It was very depressing.

And then I had a dream. I don't think dreams are magical. I think our brains sort out data while we sleep, and data stacks and falls into place. I had several dreams that were disturbing, and things have pretty much happened. Like the war against Iraq. I knew it was coming when Bush II was elected. Logic, not woo.

One of them that hasn't yet happened now seems more real. I was old, walking, limping, on a sidewalk, pulling an almost empty shopping cart behind me. Poor neighborhood. Polluted sky. Sad because I only was able to obtain a few groceries. Struggled to walk up to the 2nd floor. Bare apartment with a little boy playing with a couple of toys in the dim light from a window. He looked up and asked "did you find any food?" And as we ate what I found, he asked "tell me again what happened". And that's what I'm feeling now.

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Re: What Happened?

#18

Post by RoadScholar »

Biff Tannen became President.

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Re: What Happened?

#19

Post by SLQ »

RoadScholar wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 1:10 pm
Biff Tannen became President.


images.jpeg
:yeah:
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Re: What Happened?

#20

Post by Danraft »

Yes, depressing to hear oneself say, "I want to go home", when you are home. It just doesn't feel right-- like it is supposed to be something that is can't be anymore.

On the corporate greed angle... I am working on phrasing to get a large for-profit dialysis clinic chain to collaborate on a project for metabolic markers in people with diabetes.

The thing is they don't have a great reputation and have had to pay some hefty fines for putting patient needs first. Why would they want to possibly prevent people from getting diabetes and reduce the number of future clients? They wouldn't.

Point in fact, two studies have shown the mortality statistics are worse with for-profit clinics vs not-for-profit clinics. The difference? For-profit companies would not refer their patients for organ placement--because it would hurt their revenue stream.

So, I'm phrasing the "potential benefit" as longer lifespan and quality of life for dialysis patients and not focussing on the potential rescue from the need for extreme care at all.
Sickening.
The Mercury Project

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#21

Post by John Thomas8 »

Lani wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 2:39 am
Many years ago, I realized that the US was failing. I was in a World History honors program and had a dual major in Economic Geography. It was very depressing.

And then I had a dream. I don't think dreams are magical. I think our brains sort out data while we sleep, and data stacks and falls into place. I had several dreams that were disturbing, and things have pretty much happened. Like the war against Iraq. I knew it was coming when Bush II was elected. Logic, not woo.

One of them that hasn't yet happened now seems more real. I was old, walking, limping, on a sidewalk, pulling an almost empty shopping cart behind me. Poor neighborhood. Polluted sky. Sad because I only was able to obtain a few groceries. Struggled to walk up to the 2nd floor. Bare apartment with a little boy playing with a couple of toys in the dim light from a window. He looked up and asked "did you find any food?" And as we ate what I found, he asked "tell me again what happened". And that's what I'm feeling now.
That's the exact same thing I see, too. All this "wealth" and the humans in the country DO. NOT. GET. ANY. Only the morally bankrupt.

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#22

Post by John Thomas8 »

Danraft wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:21 pm
Yes, depressing to hear oneself say, "I want to go home", when you are home. It just doesn't feel right-- like it is supposed to be something that is can't be anymore.

On the corporate greed angle... I am working on phrasing to get a large for-profit dialysis clinic chain to collaborate on a project for metabolic markers in people with diabetes.

The thing is they don't have a great reputation and have had to pay some hefty fines for putting patient needs first. Why would they want to possibly prevent people from getting diabetes and reduce the number of future clients? They wouldn't.

Point in fact, two studies have shown the mortality statistics are worse with for-profit clinics vs not-for-profit clinics. The difference? For-profit companies would not refer their patients for organ placement--because it would hurt their revenue stream.

So, I'm phrasing the "potential benefit" as longer lifespan and quality of life for dialysis patients and not focussing on the potential rescue from the need for extreme care at all.
Sickening.
Outside of the "war machine" industy, for profit medical care in this country is the leading indicator of abject moral bankruptcy. Just before the public and celebrated lack of morals in the US Senate.

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Patagoniagirl
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Re: What Happened?

#23

Post by Patagoniagirl »

I don't think it's going to work out well.

John Thomas8
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Re: What Happened?

#24

Post by John Thomas8 »

It's not. The US Senate had the chance to sway the end game and they abdicated their morals and voted to screw every regular American.

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Re: What Happened?

#25

Post by p0rtia »

John Thomas8 wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 11:44 pm
Outside of the "war machine" industy, for profit medical care in this country is the leading indicator of abject moral bankruptcy. Just before the public and celebrated lack of morals in the US Senate.
I like this order. The AMB ranking. I think I'd switch for-profit medical care and war-machine industry, but that's a minor quibble. As always, I rank the media (old and new forms) fourth.
No matter where you go, there you are! :towel:
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