Falsehoods Unchallenged Only Fester and Grow
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A random internet troll knows more than law enforcement.andersweinstein wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 2:09 pmIt says that one Colorado report lumped their discussion of the Proud Boys together with others in a section on white supremacist violence
But again, that article also doesn't tell me what their racial ideology is
I also have a Philosophy degree. I'm not doing anything you say here. I genuinely don't understand the Proud Boys ideology. I would like to understand it *for myself* and understand for myself why it counts as white supremacist, something I know they deny. It would not be at all impossible to convince me they're white supremacists, just explain some of their ideology rather than giving me things to take on authority, why is that unreasonable?Suranis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 6:15 pmBut again, that article also doesn't tell me what their racial ideology is
Its basically using the technique of assuming an extremely high definition of the word "Knowledge" and then hiding behind that definition claim ignorance. Its a subtle attack on the whole concept that you can know something.
But, to dip into my Philosophy degree, if you want to play that game, the only thing you can absolutely 100% KNOW is that you exist. Everything else is based on assumptions, interpretation and conclusions based on sensory input. So, sorry, your definition falls flat as you cant claim anything based on anything if you cling to it.
Dave from down under wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 8:18 pm Their ideology is…
Pain
Hurt
Hate
Degradation
Humiliation
For anyone that isn’t them, and for the weaker ones of them.
Given that they are mostly white and support white supremacists
Can you make an informed judgement?
Or just defend the indefensible?
ChatGPT wrote:The label of "white supremacists" for the Proud Boys is supported by various actions and affiliations of the group, although they themselves deny being a white supremacist organization. Here are some points that contribute to this perception:
Rhetoric and Ideology: Proud Boys have promoted and espoused racist, anti-immigrant, and misogynistic rhetoric, which aligns with broader white supremacist ideologies.
Association with Extremist Groups: Members of the Proud Boys have been seen collaborating and participating in events with other extremist groups that hold openly white supremacist beliefs.
Participation in Racist Events: Proud Boys members have participated in events known for their racial tensions, such as the Unite the Right rally in Charlottesville in 2017, which was a gathering of various white supremacist groups.
Public Statements and Actions: Some leaders and members have made public statements or engaged in actions that are racist or white supremacist in nature.
Legal and Governmental Designation: While the U.S. government has not officially designated the Proud Boys as a white supremacist organization, they have been classified as an extremist group with ties to white nationalism by the FBI.
These points collectively contribute to the perception and allegations of the group's association with white supremacist activities and ideologies, despite their official stance against such labels.
It is unreasonable because sealioning is a form of trolling.It would not be at all impossible to convince me they're white supremacists, just explain some of their ideology rather than giving me things to take on authority, why is that unreasonable?
Suranis wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 6:15 pm
But, to dip into my Philosophy degree, if you want to play that game, the only thing you can absolutely 100% KNOW is that you exist. Everything else is based on assumptions, interpretation and conclusions based on sensory input. So, sorry, your definition falls flat as you cant claim anything based on anything if you cling to it.
bob wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 9:12 pmIt is unreasonable because [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning]sealioning is a form of trolling[/url].It would not be at all impossible to convince me they're white supremacists, just explain some of their ideology rather than giving me things to take on authority, why is that unreasonable?
That strikes me as a pretty good answer! As I read it, it acknowledges some nuance to the question. Like, the classification, which it notes the US government does not apply, sounds like it’s based mainly on the company they keep and their basically “walking like a duck, quacking like a duck, etc” in the eyes of people, rather than official ideology. “White Supremacist-adjacent” one might say.raison de arizona wrote: ↑Mon Jun 24, 2024 8:57 pm I was bored for a nanosecond so I asked ChatGPT for you, couldn't be bothered with writing it up myself!ChatGPT wrote:The label of "white supremacists" for the Proud Boys is supported by various actions and affiliations of the group, although they themselves deny being a white supremacist organization. Here are some points that contribute to this perception:
…
And the loon - the state bird of Minnesota - is neither a duck nor a goose.Dave from down under wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2024 12:30 am Duck is the common name for numerous species of waterfowl in the family Anatidae. Ducks are generally smaller and shorter-necked than swans and geese, which are members of the same family. Divided among several subfamilies, they are a form taxon; they do not represent a monophyletic group (the group of all descendants of a single common ancestral species), since swans and geese are not considered ducks. Ducks are mostly aquatic birds, and may be found in both fresh water and sea water.
But is it white?MN-Skeptic wrote: ↑Tue Jun 25, 2024 1:25 am And the loon - the state bird of Minnesota - is neither a duck nor a goose.