Falsehoods Unchallenged Only Fester and Grow
https://thefogbow.com/forum/
the “speech and debate” - iirc that only applies to speech held on the floor of Congress, not to other activities ?Exactly. Didn't Lindsey Graham find out the speech and debate clause doesn't apply to every word you ever say as long as you are elected to Congress? He was forced to testify in Georgia.
Even Cheney didn't go that far. It's just to bollocks things up.
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/02/1 ... n-00082637
A ‘first time’ argument
Roy Brownell, former counsel to Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and author of a prominent paper on vice presidential privilege, said that if Pence ultimately asserts “speech or debate” protections, it will be “the first time it’s ever been clearly expressed that the vice president is claiming his own constitutional privilege.”
Even when Dick Cheney sought to expand the powers of the vice presidency to a historically unprecedented degree — triggering numerous court battles — he never formally invoked the protection, Brownell noted.
Brownell also emphasized that court rulings have found that “speech or debate” protection applies to congressional officials performing “fact-finding” related to their jobs. Pence, he said, could characterize his pre-Jan. 6 conversations with Trump and others as research into how he might rule on matters related to the Electoral College.
It’s still unresolved whether the Jan. 6 session of Congress legally counts as “legislative” business, however. In addition, even if courts deem Pence’s role a legislative one, judges would still have to decide whether the “speech or debate” clause protects him from having to testify about his conversations with Trump world about the bid to upend the election.
It is beyond hokum and into bullshit territory.
Pence and his team say that serving as the former president of the Senate essentially makes him a member of the legislative branch and he would therefore be shielded from the subpoena under the “speech and debate” clause of the Constitution they are just making stuff up now.
Breaking: former WH chief of staff Mark Meadows has been subpoenaed by the special counsel investigating Trump’s role in January 6
Exclusive reporting from
@kaitlancollins
@CNNPolitics
Regarding AG & Andy, I found their first few podcasts to be amazing--but I've found my attention wandering in the more recent podcasts. AG spends a lot of time talking about how Garland is not to be criticized (mind you, I'm fine with her opinion on that topic--I just don't want to hear it again and again). I started out hanging on every one of Andy's words about his experiences and opinions, but he seems to have settled into giving standard comments about investigations and legal stuff.Phoenix520 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 12:49 am AG and Andy McCabe were just talking on their podcast about the fact there’s been no news about Meadows in a long time. I’m looking forward to the next pod where I hope the news will be bad for Meadows
Third Trump attorney appears before federal grand jury investigating Mar-a-Lago documents
By Paula Reid, Kaitlan Collins and Tierney Sneed, CNN
Published 5:18 PM EST, Tue February 14, 2023
CNN — Alina Habba, an attorney for former President Donald Trump, appeared last month before a federal grand jury investigating the mishandling of classified documents from his time in the White House, two sources familiar with the investigation told CNN.
Habba is the third Trump lawyer known to have been brought before the DC-based grand jury, which is investigating obstruction in addition to criminal violations of government records laws.
While Habba has not played the prominent role that other Trump attorneys have played in responding to the documents probe, which spilled out in public view with an August FBI search of Trump’s Mar-a-Lago resort in Florida, she has made notable TV appearances defending Trump and criticizing the federal documents probe.
https://edition.cnn.com/2023/02/14/poli ... index.html
Yeah, but I attribute it to the fact there’s just not a lot to talk about yet and like any yappers they just fill the void with happy talk. The first two episodes were ok, not great, but I don’t really care. I just want to hear what’s happening from them, specifically. They have good insights. I hope Jack himself does not disappoint.Just wondering if you had similar thoughts?
I think exactly the same thing. The first two or three episodes had lots of meat because there was all that information that came from Trump's attempt to use Judge Cannon to stop everything. There are no real leaks coming from the investigation, so now they have to find tangential things to talk about and whatever little may be coming from people who have appeared or are known to have appeared before the various grand juries. I do think the recent episodes are not as interesting as the first ones, but I'm still checking them out.Phoenix520 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 12:31 pmasJust wondering if you had similar thoughts?
Yeah, but I attribute it to the fact there’s just not a lot to talk about yet and like any yappers they just fill the void with happy talk. The first two episodes were ok, not great, but I don’t really care. I just want to hear what’s happening from them, specifically. They have good insights. I hope Jack himself does not disappoint.
I'm sort of thankful that not every single move they make becomes breathless "breaking news" that turns out to be a big nothingburger every time. Just a nice, calm, "here's our latest fuck-you-up action that has already taken place" is cool with me.Phoenix520 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 2:37 pm I dunno, you guys. McGonigal and two other NY FBIs were arrested, the Wagner group designated a TOC group, the ransomware arrests… he’s not sitting still.
Once again, Republicans have left a godawful mess for the Dem President to clean up and be berated by the press and the Republican Noise machine (and frustrated Dems) every second for not doing more. It’s all part of the plan, as you well know.
The bad guys are really good at what they do.
Thanks. That's about where I am. I thought the first two eps were great, because Andy dished inside stuff and his experience of being targeted by TFG.Phoenix520 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 16, 2023 12:31 pmYeah, but I attribute it to the fact there’s just not a lot to talk about yet and like any yappers they just fill the void with happy talk. The first two episodes were ok, not great, but I don’t really care. I just want to hear what’s happening from them, specifically. They have good insights. I hope Jack himself does not disappoint.Just wondering if you had similar thoughts?
At least three Arizona Republican state legislators have been subpoenaed by the U.S. Justice Department’s special counsel, Jack Smith, as part of the criminal investigation into former President Donald Trump and his efforts to reverse his 2020 election loss.
The federal grand jury subpoenas were issued to Senate President Warren Petersen, Sen. Sonny Borrelli and House Speaker Ben Toma. And at least one former state senator, Michelle Ugenti-Rita, who led the Senate’s Election Committee in 2021, received a subpoena. All four have been ordered to produce records and travel to Washington, D.C., to testify.
The Arizona Mirror obtained a copy of one of the subpoenas on the condition that it would not be published. In addition to the command to testify before the grand jury, the office of the special counsel is demanding any documents already provided to the congressional panel that investigated the Jan. 6 U.S. Capitol riot and any documents given to any other state or federal inquiry related to the 2020 presidential election.
The subpoena also seeks all communications with Trump or his campaign. It also specifies 18 different campaign employees, attorneys and surrogates: Kenneth Chesebro, Justin Clark, Joe DiGenova, John Eastman, Jenna Ellis, Boris Epshteyn, Rudy Giuliani, Bernard Kerik, Bruce Marks, Cleta Mitchell, Matthew Morgan, Kurt Olsen, William Olson, Sidney Powell, Bill Stepien, Victoria Toensing, James Troupis and L. Lin Wood.
Mike Schmidt is on Deadline WH right now discussing story.NEW: Kushner and Ivanka Trump subpoenaed by Jack Smith in connection with the J6 investigation
@nytmike
and me
Trump criminal probe: Special counsel asks judge to compel Mike Pence testimony, report says
PUBLISHED THU, FEB 23 20232:29 PM ESTUPDATED THU, FEB 23 20235:43 PM EST
Kevin Breuninger
KEY POINTSFederal prosecutors have asked a judge to compel Vice President Mike Pence to comply with a grand jury subpoena for his testimony in a criminal investigation of ex-President Donald Trump for efforts to overturn his 2020 election loss to President Joe Biden, a new report says.
- Prosecutors reportedly asked a judge to compel former Vice President Mike Pence to comply with a grand jury subpoena in a criminal probe of ex-President Donald Trump’s bid to overturn his election loss.
The sealed motion reportedly came after attorneys for Trump asserted executive privilege over Pence’s subpoena in U.S. District Court in Washington, D.C.
Special counsel Jack Smith is investigating efforts by Trump and his allies to reverse his defeat by President Joe Biden in 2020.
The sealed motion, filed in recent days with Chief Judge Beryl Howell in U.S. District Court in Washington, D.C., came after attorneys for Trump asserted executive privilege over Pence’s subpoena, CBS News reported Thursday.
https://www.cnbc.com/2023/02/23/trump-s ... imony.html
On her final day as the top judge in the District of Columbia on Friday afternoon—in her final act—Chief Judge Beryl A. Howell did more than grant the Justice Department permission to question former President Donald Trump’s personal attorney. She actually took the rare step of handing over the lawyer’s notes to federal prosecutors, according to a person familiar with the arrangement.
In doing so, Howell may have planted the seeds for a future constitutional challenge. But in the immediate term, she’s handed Justice Department Special Prosecutor Jack Smith a parting gift: what she deemed evidence of a crime involving the former president improperly hoarding classified documents after he left office.
M. Evan Corcoran, a former federal prosecutor, has represented Trump in that classified documents scandal. And while Corcoran already has his hands full as Trump’s lawyer, the probe now appears to have put Corcoran in legal jeopardy himself.
Judges who come to the conclusion that some legally protected and sensitive material must be turned over to an opposing side normally issue an order directing one side to do it, along with a deadline. Doing so gives the losing side the ability to appeal to a higher court—and prevent irreversible damage that could forever taint a case, according to two lawyers not involved in the case who spoke to The Daily Beast but asked not to be identified.
But Howell appears to have skipped that careful yet tedious approach—and just handed Smith a batch of documents that may show Trump and one of his lawyers planning a crime.
SCOOP: Meadows, other top Trump aides ordered to testify in Jan. 6 probe as judge rejects claims of executive privilege story w/
@KFaulders
@jonkarl
In a sealed order last week, Judge Beryl Howell rejected Trump's claim of executive privilege for Meadows and a number of others, including Trump's former Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe, his former national security adviser Robert O'Brien, former top aide Stephen Miller, and former deputy chief of staff and social media director Dan Scavino, according to sources familiar with the matter.
Former Trump aides Nick Luna and John McEntee, along with former top DHS official Ken Cuccinelli, were also included in the order, the sources said.