Fogbow

Lani wrote: ↑Mon Apr 19, 2021 10:40 pm An Aussie view about the judge & Maxine Waters. Sadly, about as bad as US press.

At a Black Lives Matter rally in Minnesota at the weekend, to protest the recent shooting of Daunte Wright by a police officer, Californian Democrat Maxine Waters further inflamed tensions.

“I hope we get a verdict that says guilty, guilty, guilty,” she said.

“If we don’t, we cannot go away. We’ve got to stay on the street. We get more active, we’ve got to get more confrontational. We’ve got to make sure that they know that we mean business.”

In his final remarks in the Chauvin trial on Monday, Hennepin County District Judge Peter Cahill said it was abhorrent of Ms Waters to tell protesters it would be unacceptable for the former officer to be acquitted of murdering George Floyd.

“I wish elected officials would stop talking about this case, especially in a manner that’s disrespectful to the rule of law and to the judicial branch and our function,” Judge Cahill said after dismissing jurors from the courtroom.

https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/world/u ... 2020210420

I am disturbed that so much of the media is getting this wrong. Maxine didn't threatened. “I hope we get a verdict that says guilty, guilty, guilty,” isn't a threat and isn't a demand that the jury vote that way. She did offer a path forward for advocates if the jury acquits.

Oops, I forgot. She's a scary Black woman....

Just saying "I hope we get a verdict that says guilty" would have been fine if she had stopped there. Adding "if we don't, we cannot go away..." sends it into threat territory.

Yes. And also, she was goaded into making additional statements, particularly the one that everyone is yammering about. She didn't make that statement until after the reporter kept egging her on. I think they know she is prone to going a little overboard when her statements aren't prepared, when she is answering questions on the fly. He just kept asking more and more and finally got her to say something that will piss off lots of people. That said, she should really learn not to allow reporters to goad her into making statements she hasn't thought through.

I blame it on her youth and inexperience. She's only 82 and has only been in Congress for 30 years.

In other words, Maxine needs to stop doing this shit.

A more detailed/balanced coverage from down under that doesn't focus of Maxine

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-04-20/ ... /100078554

For what it’s worth.

“George Floyd death: Three Americans assess Derek Chauvin trial”:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56810262

Uninformed wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:35 am For what it’s worth.

“George Floyd death: Three Americans assess Derek Chauvin trial”:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56810262

Retired cop essentially says cop can't possibly be guilty. Huh.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:43 pm I blame it on her youth and inexperience. She's only 82 and has only been in Congress for 30 years.

In other words, Maxine needs to stop doing this shit.

I don't think the judge should have said anything about Waters' comments.

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:34 am I don't think the judge should have said anything about Waters' comments.

Agreed. I doubt that he watched the whole clip. She should be smart enough to tell reporters "I've already said everything that I came here to say" instead of allowing them to ask her question after question after question once she's finished her remarks, knowing she will eventually step in it. Good grief, at 82 you would think she has learned. And especially since it happens every damn time she tries to show her support. Her prepared words are often fine. But damn if she can't keep her wits about her when being peppered with questions. Few people can. That's why it becomes important just to say I've already said what I came to say. Which would have been the truth.

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:34 am I don't think the judge should have said anything about Waters' comments.

Plus, he's likely wrong IMO.

Were the jurors in the room when it was said?

Slim Cognito wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:35 am Were the jurors in the room when it was said?

I don't think so. I think the prosecution would be having a fit if they were.

In a perfect world, Maxine Waters should have held back her comments about "confrontation" although I don't think "confrontation" equals "go commit violence."

But we don't live in a perfect world. I said I thought Judge Cahill overreacted when he went on his mini-rant because he certainly amplified her comments (however muddied they were). I read about them earlier yesterday because the awful Chris Cillizza wrote a hysterical piece on CNN's website.

I thought it was weird when Cahill went on to castigate her for "attacking a co-equal branch of government." I never think of a state judiciary as being a co-equal branch of the federal legislature. I think Cahill was angry and said some things that were disproportionate himself, and those words were immediately blasted all over the country.

If there is an acquittal, does anyone think there wouldn't have been massive protests absent comments from Maxine Waters? Does anyone believe people will only get violent because Waters told them to be more confrontational?

I think Cahill has done a pretty good job in this case, but I think he let his own emotions get the better of him yesterday.

Slim Cognito wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:35 am Were the jurors in the room when it was said?

No.

filly wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:38 am In a perfect world, Maxine Waters should have held back her comments about "confrontation" although I don't think "confrontation" equals "go commit violence."

The flip side of this is, of course, in a perfect world old white guys would use their power to single out WoC to 'be quiet and respectful'.
Her comments were far from unusual or out of line, even from an elected representative.... but sadly neither is the rather tilted reaction.

And of course we have conflicting pragmatisms here. The comments give ammunition to people who want the cop to go free or for PoC to be quiet about issues, but on the other hand making the comments is, well, a statement about NOT being quiet and normalizing pushback. They upset the right, who will be upset regardless so it is questionable if they really made things worse.... but they pleased many on the left, who are difficult to keep happy and engaged. So I see them as a net gain, at least on the high/abstract level.

I took it to mean that we have to confront the issue and the people behind it as long as Black people are being killed without cause. George Floyd was given a public execution for possibly passing a bad note. That has to be confronted. Cannot back down from that injustice.

pipistrelle wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:33 am I took it to mean that we have to confront the issue and the people behind it as long as Black people are being killed without cause. George Floyd was given a public execution for possibly passing a bad note. That has to be confronted. Cannot back down from that injustice.

Damn straight!!!!!

Kate520 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:39 pm

Off Topic

I was given a bad $20 in change at a store last summer. I wouldn’t have known except I tried to buy scratchers with it from the machine at the grocery store. The machine, which is pretty temperamental about bills, wouldn’t accept it so I asked a passing clerk if she could exchange it for a good one. She came back and told me it was counterfeit. My reaction surprised her and it surprised me: “No way!” with an ear splitting grin. “I’ve never had one of these!” I blurted. What am I, a child?

I think of this every time I think of George Floyd. It would never have been me.

Did not the owner/manager of the store have the clerk go outside to bring George back to replace the payment with good money? And when he wouldn't, that is when the police were called...

I've had a fake $20 and when I used it, the clerk caught it at the cash register. They kept the fake bill and I paid with a debit card. No police involved.

filly wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:38 am In a perfect world, Maxine Waters should have held back her comments about "confrontation" although I don't think "confrontation" equals "go commit violence."

But we don't live in a perfect world. I said I thought Judge Cahill overreacted when he went on his mini-rant because he certainly amplified her comments (however muddied they were). I read about them earlier yesterday because the awful Chris Cillizza wrote a hysterical piece on CNN's website.

I thought it was weird when Cahill went on to castigate her for "attacking a co-equal branch of government." I never think of a state judiciary as being a co-equal branch of the federal legislature. I think Cahill was angry and said some things that were disproportionate himself, and those words were immediately blasted all over the country.

If there is an acquittal, does anyone think there wouldn't have been massive protests absent comments from Maxine Waters? Does anyone believe people will only get violent because Waters told them to be more confrontational?

I think Cahill has done a pretty good job in this case, but I think he let his own emotions get the better of him yesterday.

If Chauvin is acquitted of 2nd and 3rd degree murder, Minneapolis is going to burn. Minnesota will burn. The chaos will be as bad as it was last May ... everywhere.

A manslaughter conviction isn't going to cut it. Nor should it.

We earned this chaos and violence. I absolutely do not support violent protests. At the same time,
I'm not surprised by the violence.

We earned this.

They have a verdict. We'll hear what it is in an hour to hour and a half.

What does Stern win?

The pundit class is pretty uniformly predicting a conviction (on at least one count). I am having flashbacks to the OJ case, where all the pundits predicted a guilty verdict.

I heard on the radio this morning that Ohio has sent 100 State Troopers to Minneapolis, just in case.

I hope they're not needed.