The dregs of birther remainders.

[bob]

Rasmussen ... extremely known for being extremely liberal.

[northland10]

Rasmussen is an extremely liberal poll now?

Funny thing, FOX has him at 47% approve. Another extreme liberal bias I guess.

[bob]

Rharon is really making a mistake here. Instead of continuing non-stop coverage of the Most Important Issue In America, Eligibility, it's almost all anti-vax now. Her audience is primarily made up of older people, most of whom all got vaxxed because they're high risk and not totally stupid (except the real Winners like Mario Apuzzo, but he can't subscribe anymore). Hardly anybody is commenting on these anti-vax stories, and as fabulous as Rharon's stenographer skillz are, she's not bringing anything new to the party. On birfering, nobody else was dumb enough to cover it. This topic is all over.

Rondeau must be listening because: P&E: Despite Popular Claims that George Floyd “Changed the World” When he was Murdered on May 25, 2020:

George Floyd did not purposefully, or even accidentally, “change the world.” What happened was a tragic set of circumstances which spiraled out of control. It was not something which was commonplace, and it was not something which necessarily was motivated by racism or wickedness. Convicted Minneapolis police officer Derek Chauvin also did nothing to change the world.

Is it possible that One-Note Arnold knows another song? NOPE!:

Maybe more so than anyone else in recent history, however, BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA is one individual who came close to “changing the world.” It is likely that Obama never personally killed anybody (although I think it is probable that he, in fact, conspired with others to do so, i.e., the CIA). What Obama did do, though, is STEAL the U.S. presidency and command of our men and women in the armed forces. HE WAS NOT CONSTITUTIONALLY ELIGIBLE TO RUN FOR OR BECOME ELECTED PRESIDENT (not a natural born American citizen per Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5 of the U.S. Constitution, which begs the question: “How could he possibly meet these qualifications when he was a citizen of three different countries and had allegiances to each one of them?”

Obama’s rise to the presidency was conceived of and brought about by the CIA, the Communist Party, the Muslim Brotherhood, the Democrat and Republican Parties, the U.S. Supreme Court in the person of Chief Justice John G. Roberts, the complicit “4th Estate” government-watchdog news media, and countless other co-conspirators. Obama was every bit a Manchurian Candidate. In my view, these facts and their consequences are no less than TREASONOUS. It all began in 2007-08, if not earlier, and has lasted to the present and beyond. Even CNN Senior Investigative Correspondent Drew Griffin recently stated in a television special titled, “Assault on Democracy: The Roots of Trump’s Insurrection” that our country’s current problems began in 2008. Evidently, Mr. Griffin didn’t know how right he was, although I suspect he did not intend to besmirch Obama. I, on the other hand, am convinced that BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA, in consort with others who opposed the American way of life, was the most instrumental individual in our constitutional democratic republic’s downfall.

Obama’s racist views, divisiveness, and efforts with his fellow travelers to transform our country, gave birth to virtually all of the serious and anti-American problems being experienced by our society today. These, then, are the people who arguably “changed the world!”

Let it be known that no one is above the law and that there is no statute of limitations on TREASON. At least, that’s the way things used to be before we in America began living a lie (the big, real lie).

[Luke]

Jiminy Cricket! Tom Arnold is smoking Sharon with her own Patented Rondeau Pivot®. That must really sting.

So, you ask, WHAT IS MY POINT? In short, it is that individuals do not change our country or the geopolitical world. Some have tried, but with all due respect to George Floyd and others, they have never succeeded by themselves.

Maybe more so than anyone else in recent history, however, BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA is one individual who came close to “changing the world.”

In the comments, at least James Carter has a fresh, refreshing new take:

James Carter says:
Wednesday, January 26, 2022 at 10:47 AM
In early 2008, after bloggers raised questions about Republican nominee Senator John Sidney McCain III’s status as a natural born citizen, the Democrat majority Senate formed a sub-committee to investigate. On April 10, 2008, the full Senate issued a resolution saying (paraphrasing for brevity’s sake) “John Sidney McCain, III, was born to American citizens on an American military base in the Panama Canal Zone in 1936, therefore be it resolved that John Sidney McCain, III is a natural born Citizen under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.”

Soon thereafter bloggers began raising questions about Democrat nominee Senator Barack Hussein Obama II’s status as a natural born citizen, but the Democrat majority Senate did not form a sub-committee to investigate. The full Senate never did issue a resolution saying Barack Hussein Obama II was a natural born Citizen under Article II, Section 1, of the Constitution of the United States.

Why the one born to and raised by cultural Americans but not the one born to or raised by non-cultural Americans?
Why the POW & Disabled Veteran but not the Pot Smoker & Community Organizer?
Why the multi-term Senator but not the first-term Senator?
Why the Republican but not the Democrat?

[bob]

In the comments, at least James Carter has a fresh, refreshing new take

"fresh, refreshing, and new" are some words.

The notion that birthering was payback for McCain's eligibility being questioned is chronologically challenged. That is, Carter is lying.

[W. Kevin Vicklund]

Maybe more so than anyone else in recent history, however, BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA is one individual who came close to “changing the world.” It is likely that Obama never personally killed anybody (although I think it is probable that he, in fact, conspired with others to do so, i.e., the CIA). What Obama did do, though, is STEAL the U.S. presidency and command of our men and women in the armed forces. HE WAS NOT CONSTITUTIONALLY ELIGIBLE TO RUN FOR OR BECOME ELECTED PRESIDENT (not a natural born American citizen per Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5 of the U.S. Constitution, which begs the question: “How could he possibly meet these qualifications when he was a citizen of three different countries and had allegiances to each one of them?”

A birther finally got "begging the question" right! That is a perfect example of begging the question.

[bob]

CBS 42 [AP]: Roy Moore gives combative testimony in defamation case:

A combative Roy Moore took the witness stand Thursday in a defamation case against him, insisting he did not know a woman who says he sexually molested her when she was 14.

Moore was called to testify by attorneys for Leigh Corfman in a trial dealing with dueling defamation lawsuits they filed against each other in the wake of a sexual misconduct allegation that rocked the 2017 U.S. Senate race in Alabama.

Corfman says the former Alabama judge and failed Senate candidate defamed her when he denied her accusations as false and malicious. Moore countersued.

“I never met that woman,” Moore said loudly, pointing at Corfman as she sat with her attorneys.

Bonus:

The presiding judge had to gently chide Moore multiple times Thursday to answer questions as they were asked.

[bob]

[bob]

P&E: Should Newsmax TV be Interpreting our Constitution?:

On Saturday evening, January 29, 2022, in Conroe, Texas, the 45th president of the United States, Donald J. Trump, held a large political rally. The rally was televised live by NEWSMAX TV. During the telecast NEWSMAX, as is its custom, displayed a number of brief messages on the TV screen re: other news stories, questions for the viewing audience, etc.

One such question this time asked if Donald Trump were to run again for president in 2024, who do you think he should consider for a running mate. NEWSMAX specifically listed three choices of the many available: Ron DeSantis, Ted Cruz, and Nikki Haley.

I ask you, readers of this editorial, WHAT IS WRONG WITH NEWSMAX? Do they think that the NATURAL BORN AMERICAN CITIZEN requirement in our constitution (Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5) regarding one’s eligibility to be president and vice-president doesn’t mean anything anymore? Do they think that the NBC matter is taboo to talk about publicly? Or could it be that NEWSMAX is not as informed or knowledgeable about newsworthy matters as it ought to be?

Rondeau's back with the program: birther fodder from and for the three remaining birthers.

Arnold, of course, objects to Cruz and Haley (and, as always, Obama). But, curiously, no complaints about DeSantis.

[bob]

P&E comment:

Certain trolls on this website would lose their shirts and quickly exit with their tails tucked between their legs and never return if they had to debate the Founding Framers* of the US Constitution.

I, for one, kicked some Founding Framer ass in the debate that occurred in my head.


* Founders founded the United States; Framers framed the U.S. Constitution. I guess a "Founding Framer" is someone who was both a Founder and a Framer?

[Ben-Prime]

P&E comment:

Certain trolls on this website would lose their shirts and quickly exit with their tails tucked between their legs and never return if they had to debate the Founding Framers* of the US Constitution.

I, for one, kicked some Founding Framer ass in the debate that occurred in my head.


* Founders founded the United States; Framers framed the U.S. Constitution. I guess a "Founding Framer" is someone who was both a Founder and a Framer?

Maybe he was misspelling Founding Farmers, as in the D.C.-area restaurant mini-chain? Man, I miss their weekend breakfast buffets right now.

[Foggy]

Off Topic

* Founders founded the United States; Framers framed the U.S. Constitution. I guess a "Founding Framer" is someone who was both a Founder and a Framer?

I am reading America's Founding Fathers, published by the Smithsonian Institution. It's the story of the Constitutional Convention in 1787. Not the Revolution, just the writing of the Constitution.

Were they Founders or Framers?

Because I'm with you, it should be America's Framing Fathers but then it sounds like they framed a person, not a document.

[Reality Check]

If I were in this mythical debate with the "Founding Framers" I would ask them:

• Do you own an English translation of de Vattel's The Law of Nations?
• Does it use the term "natural born citizen" any where?

Of course there would be no debate because they all knew what the term natural born meant from English common law.

[bob]

"Founding Fathers" was a term coined around a century ago. And there's no objective criteria used to define its membership. It isn't, for example, who signed the Declaration of Independence, as some notable people (e.g., Washington) didn't sign it.

"Founders" is the contemporary variant, as to not exclude non-menfolks' contributions.

Whereas "Framers" has an objective definition: The delegates to the Constitutional Convention. John Jay, he of the birthers' beloved "hint," wasn't at the Convention and therefore wasn't a Framer.

(And I refuse to mark as offtopic anything in a thread with "dregs" and "remainders" in its title )

[Foggy]

Yes on nothing off-topic.

I do think this book is misnamed. When I think of "the Founding Fathers" I think it encompasses, at the very least, the straight (as far as we know) white males who signed the Declaration of Independence, for starters. Just from the plain meaning of the English language, they declared that they were founding a new country for various reasons which they elucidated, and then they went out and did exactly what they said.

Thomas Jefferson was in France in the summer of 1787. If he's not one of America's Founding Fathers, the term becomes almost meaningless.

In the broadest sense, I'd include those who signed the Declaration, at least the leaders of those who served in the Continental Army, all those who served in the various Congresses up until 1787 under the Articles of Confederation, and the Framers of the Constitution. ALL of these helped create a new nation. All risked their lives and committed what the British considered treason. They're all Founding Fathers, and the Framers are a tiny subset, IMHO.

[Foggy]

... and while I say the leaders of the Army, how about these folks: The starving, bedraggled scarecrows who fought with George Washington at the battles of Trenton and Princeton at Christmastime 1776. Not the leaders, the guys rowing the boat when he crossed the Delaware.

Thomas Jefferson did a very good job of writing down the dream of the new nation we wanted to create, but those guys bleeding in the snow because their shoes had holes, they made his dream come true in a way that he never could (in fact, he fled from the Governor's mansion in Virginia once when he thought the Brits were approaching).

So who deserves the title Founding Fathers? My vote goes to the troops AND Thomas Jefferson. And a bunch of other folks, too. Big tent.

[bob]

A historian in the 70s declared these people the exhaustive list of Founders: John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, Alexander Hamilton, John Jay, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, and George Washington. But (to paraphrase the Dude) that's just, like, his opinion, man.


Objectively, these people signed at least three of the nation's foundational documents (the Continental Association, the Declaration of Independence, the Articles of Confederation, and the U.S. Constitution): Roger Sherman,* Samuel Adams, John Dickinson, Richard Henry Lee, Thomas McKean, Robert Morris, and George Read.

And here's who signed both the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution: Sherman, Morris, Read, George Clymer, Benjamin Franklin, and James Wilson.


* Only person to sign all four.

[Foggy]

Y'know, I said a couple posts up that I include people "in the broadest sense".

But if I was to include people as Founding Fathers in the most narrow sense, then I think his list is spot on, and anyone else I can think of could be considered "lesser lights" on one ground or another. So I agree that much. His names are certainly the most famous, with the possible exception of Jay.

'Course, I could get back up on the soapbox and tell you why the phrase Founding Fathers seriously should be interpreted in its broadest sense, not its most narrow. Sadly, I have a date with ol' Wifehorn at 3:30, we walk a few miles every afternoon, unless it's too cold, in which case she stands me up but I still walk, crying on the inside.

Later on ...

[Luke]

Rharon tried putting a fat toe in the "secure the vote" water, but those clever birfers learned the patented Rondeau Pivot all too well and weren't having any of that! You can always count on Tom Arnold and Bob68 to bring fresh, unique perspectives and information to the millions of P&E readers. As Tom puts it, "Sadly, few if any American citizens realize it or talk about it." He is so right, there's hardly been any discussion of birferism and the P&E has been so shy about discussing it. Maybe it's time for another BIRTHER SUMMIT!

Secure the Vote – Nothing is More Important!
1 day ago
by Kat Stansell, American Policy Center

Thomas Arnold says:
Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 12:38 AM
“Secure the Vote. Nothing is More Important.” Oh, really? WHAT ABOUT HONORING AND ABIDING BY OUR CONSTITUTION, WHICH STATES (Article 2, Section 1, Clause 5) THAT ONLY “NATURAL BORN AMERICAN CITIZENS” CAN RUN FOR OR HOLD THE OFFICES OF PRESIDENT AND VICE-PRESIDENT? Now there’s a voter fraud problem which, I am convinced, actually is a matter of great national security and which gave birth (in 2007-08) to the current decline of our country. Courtesy of Barack Hussein Obama, Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts (swears in presidents, apparently whether they are constitutionally eligible or not), our own CIA (chose Obama at an early age and groomed him to be a Manchurian Candidate), the Deep State and Swamp, traitors like George Soros, Democrat and Republican lawmakers who are not doing the jobs we elected them to do, etc, etc. Now, that’s what I call election/voter fraud at its worst! Sadly, few if any American citizens realize it or talk about it. It is the “OPEN SECRET” in Washington DC, and it is strictly “TABOO” in the complicit news media.

Reply
Bob68 says:
Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 11:24 AM
Thank you Tom Arnold. You just described why both political parties panicked when the planned, promised and much needed after Obama cover president of Hillary Clinton lost to Obama’s biggest nemesis, Donald Trump in 2016. Hillary’s loss to any other Republican candidate would have resulted in the usual Uniparty dog and pony show, but with President Trump they showed fear of the truth about Barry being fully released and acted on and kept President Trump under siege, beginning before he was sworn-in. This included repeatedly disproved Russian collusion B.S. resulting in failed impeachment attempts.

This was followed by a blatantly stolen election in 2020 in insure Trump did not get 4 more years to do what both parties fear he will do, which is to fully reveal and act on The Obama Fraud. America’s government and her military were effectively given to her enemies when both parties, as a minimum, ignored their sworn oath to protect the Constitution and allowed the Soros funded, CIA created Barack Hussein Obama to become America’s putative president. Hillary was not supposed to lose and when she did both parties revealed by their actions, inaction and words their part in the biggest criminal act against American citizens and her Constitution in history, as they try to protect themselves by protecting the race and ineligibility protected Barack Hussein Obama. Stealing the 2020 election gave the many complicit another member of the Obama administration as their after Obama cover president, and Obama his desired “third term” as a puppet-master for Biden/Harris. Problem for all complicit in the Obama Fraud is no one knows what Joe Biden may say and reveal at any moment, including Biden himself. It could be something even Psaki can’t “circle back” and fix…………….

This is not complicated in spite of efforts to make it seem that way……Obviously, Hillary was not supposed to lose…….

Elections won’t matter anymore without common sense election reform to insure one legitimate vote per one qualified America citizen voter……..

Bob 68+

Reply
Thomas Arnold says:
Wednesday, February 2, 2022 at 2:16 PM
Bob68: Great and spot-on summary, my friend. I agree totally and especially like and agree with “The biggest criminal act against American citizens and her Constitution in history.” And, that is the TRUTH, at least in modern history. Apparently, only a few of us mostly non-influential and for the most part powerless patriots realize and have the best interests of our country at heart, by trying to set the record straight and put an end to the ridiculous re-imagining and cancelling of our country’s history. The history which Bob68 so articulately and truthfully speaks.

SO, FOR GOD’S SAKE, LEAVE THE RECORDS AND STATUES OF MY ANCESTORS ALONE! WE CAN LEARN FROM OUR HISTORY, WHETHER IT IS “GOOD” OR “BAD.” THAT IS, SOME OF US SEEM TO BE ABLE TO LEARN FROM OUR PAST AND PROCEED AHEAD WITH PEACEFUL, RESPECTFUL, AND GOOD-NEIGHBORLY LIVES.
Anyway, congrats to Bob68 for his informative and totally true comments. It is my hope that the TRUTH will prevail.

See how Tom even slipped some bonus racism in there?

[keith]

"Founding Fathers" was a term coined around a century ago. And there's no objective criteria used to define its membership. It isn't, for example, who signed the Declaration of Independence, as some notable people (e.g., Washington) didn't sign it.

"Founders" is the contemporary variant, as to not exclude non-menfolks' contributions.

Whereas "Framers" has an objective definition: The delegates to the Constitutional Convention. John Jay, he of the birthers' beloved "hint," wasn't at the Convention and therefore wasn't a Framer.

(And I refuse to mark as offtopic anything in a thread with "dregs" and "remainders" in its title )

Nor was Jefferson

[keith]

... and while I say the leaders of the Army, how about these folks: The starving, bedraggled scarecrows who fought with George Washington at the battles of Trenton and Princeton at Christmastime 1776. Not the leaders, the guys rowing the boat when he crossed the Delaware.

Thomas Jefferson did a very good job of writing down the dream of the new nation we wanted to create, but those guys bleeding in the snow because their shoes had holes, they made his dream come true in a way that he never could (in fact, he fled from the Governor's mansion in Virginia once when he thought the Brits were approaching).

So who deserves the title Founding Fathers? My vote goes to the troops AND Thomas Jefferson. And a bunch of other folks, too. Big tent.

[Kriselda Gray]

You can always count on Tom Arnold and Bob68 to bring fresh, unique perspectives and information to the millions of P&E readers.

Is it safe to presume that this is NOT the Tom Arnold who was previously married to Roseanne Barr/Arnold/No-Last-Name?

[Foggy]

No, not.

[bob]

Nor was Jefferson

Correct, as explained in "Hamilton":


I mentioned Jay only because birthers lurve Jay, and I needed to remain on-topic.

* * *

Rharon tried putting a fat toe in the "secure the vote" water, but those clever birfers learned the patented Rondeau Pivot all too well and weren't having any of that! You can always count on Tom Arnold and Bob68 to bring fresh, unique perspectives and information to the millions of P&E readers. As Tom puts it, "Sadly, few if any American citizens realize it or talk about it." He is so right, there's hardly been any discussion of birferism and the P&E has been so shy about discussing it. Maybe it's time for another BIRTHER SUMMIT!

Rondeau needs to get with the program and have the endless all-birther-all-the-time thread.

Ironically:

Haven’t you said this already?

Now Rondeau is concerned with repetition?

[Luke]

Rondeau needs to get with the program and have the endless all-birther-all-the-time thread.

Hay, how about if The Fogbow sponsors that Megathread? I mean, we will have to save up, look at the blue chips she has already... understandable because the P&E's audience is exactly the demo that advertisers are desperate to reach. Might be hard to get space though, the P&E is backed up. But if FOGGY uses that legendary charm, maybe, just maybe...

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