trump (convicted felon, defamer, insurrectionist, contemnor, and rapist - $537M)

[Volkonski]

[Frater I*I]

He torched the place to collect on the insurance money....

[Volkonski]

He torched the place to collect on the insurance money....

A large number of Twitter commenters agree with you.

[Slim Cognito]

[Kendra]

Aha, I might have known Fox would cover it. I've had CNN on all afternoon and crickets about tfg.

https:// www.foxnews.com/politics/president-trump-nypd-run-2024

(broke the link in case the video auto plays like usual on Fox)

Former President Trump on Saturday hinted that he might run for president again in 2024 during a visit on the 20th anniversary of 9/11 to the New York Police Department's (NYPD) 17th precinct.

The former president, a New York native, spoke briefly about the Sept. 11, 2001, attack on the World Trade Center, the recent Afghanistan withdrawal and took questions from the police officers.

Trump called the 20th anniversary of 9/11 a "very sad day for a lot of reasons," referring to both the attack and the botched withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan in recent weeks, and praised the brave NYPD officers.

The former president also called Biden's withdrawal from Afghanistan "gross incompetence" and criticized other aspects of the U.S. withdrawal.

When asked by a NYPC officer whether he'd run for president a second time, Trump responded, "That's a tough question."

"Actually, for me, it's an easy question. I mean, I know what I'm going to do, but I'm not supposed to be talking about it yet from the standpoint of campaign finance laws, which, frankly, are ridiculous," said Trump.

[MN-Skeptic]

"Actually, for me, it's an easy question. I mean, I know what I'm going to do, but I'm not supposed to be talking about it yet from the standpoint of campaign finance laws, which, frankly, are ridiculous," said Trump.

On the other hand, could Trump use his declared candidacy to assert that he's being targeted in lawsuits?

[Volkonski]

[Kendra]

This is what Trump was doing around NYC today while Biden was dementia convalescing in Delaware.

[Suranis]

[Lani]

A dangerous trend among GOP candidates shows the Trump threat is here to stay
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... c=nl_ideas

He's not going away.

[Volkonski]

[Estiveo]

[Maybenaut]

Acknowledging that I’m bothered by everything Trump does just on general principle, I have to say — I’m not bothered at all by Trump’s decision to speak at the Unification Church, and I’m a little bothered by Parker Malloy’s characterization of it as “gross, ghoulish nonsense.” I’m a dyed-in-the-wool atheist, so I have little use for *any* church. But I do get that religion is an important part of life for the majority of people on the planet, and I’m a fervent believer in the First Amendment.

People call the Unification Church a cult. I don’t know how to tell the difference between a true religion and a cult. To the ancient Romans, Greeks, Jews, and Pagans, Christianity must have been viewed as a cult. To the 7th-century Meccans, Islam was a cult. To the 19th-century Americans, Mormonism was a cult. Perhaps informed by my cynical view of religion, it seems to me that the difference is in a church’s staying power - if it flames out, it was a cult; if it survives the death of its leader, it’s a religion. According to Wikipedia, the Unification Church has been around for over 67 years and has between one and two million adherents.

I don’t know … I guess I’m just bothered by your-god-isn’t-good-enough thinking. Parker Malloy can go fuck herself.

Hidden Content

This board requires you to be registered and logged-in to view hidden content.

[filly]

[Dave from down under]

This must have burned..

https://www.rawstory.com/amp/trumps-big ... ssion=true

"Okay, we're going to break away now, the is former president Donald Trump visiting the police station, the 17th precinct station in midtown Manhattan," she began.

"He didn't miss any opportunities to air grievances including claiming that the election was rigged, which it was not," she continued. "It has been proven in court multiple times. It has been proven that the election was not rigged by elected election officials, but it started out on a good note. President Trump, the former president saying that he grew up with the firefighters because he's from New York and he thanked them for their service."

[pipistrelle]

This must have burned..

https://www.rawstory.com/amp/trumps-big ... ssion=true

"Okay, we're going to break away now, the is former president Donald Trump visiting the police station, the 17th precinct station in midtown Manhattan," she began.

"He didn't miss any opportunities to air grievances including claiming that the election was rigged, which it was not," she continued. "It has been proven in court multiple times. It has been proven that the election was not rigged by elected election officials, but it started out on a good note. President Trump, the former president saying that he grew up with the firefighters because he's from New York and he thanked them for their service."

Nooooooo. I’ve been caught on camera.

Hidden Content

This board requires you to be registered and logged-in to view hidden content.

[Slim Cognito]

I was once advised, if it's not appropriate to tell someone how you feel about them publicly, just imagine yourself saying it to them but silently in your head. Your face will convey the message.

I see it works.

[Phoenix520]

That’s a good one, slim. I’m gonna try it out.

[Maybenaut]

That’s a good one, slim. I’m gonna try it out.

I did it by accident once.

[Kendra]

I was once advised, if it's not appropriate to tell someone how you feel about them publicly, just imagine yourself saying it to them but silently in your head. Your face will convey the message.

I see it works.

Remember tfg visiting the site of the Paradise Fire and the raking the forest nonsense? Soon to be former Governor Jerry Brown set the gold standard.

[SlimSloSlider]

t, I’m a fervent believer in the First Amendment.

People call the Unification Church a cult. I don’t know how to tell the difference between a true religion and a cult. To the ancient Romans, Greeks, Jews, and Pagans, Christianity must have been viewed as a cult. To the 7th-century Meccans, Islam was a cult. To the 19th-century Americans, Mormonism was a cult. Perhaps informed by my cynical view of religion, it seems to me that the difference is in a church’s staying power - if it flames out, it was a cult; if it survives the death of its leader, it’s a religion.

A little simplistic, surely?
High control groups that indulge in, for example human trafficking, slave labour or reckless disdain for the law?
How about worship of the leader as a deity (Sun Myung Moon, L. Ron Hubbard, Joseph Smith et al.) despite ample evidence that they were frauds?
Steve Hassan writes and speaks well on the Moonies - he was one and has gone on a remarkable journey since.
Alec Gibney’s “Going Clear” doc is worth a look, even if it only scratches the surface.
The First Amendment is excellent.
The abuse of the First by clever scams is not.

[Maybenaut]

t, I’m a fervent believer in the First Amendment.

People call the Unification Church a cult. I don’t know how to tell the difference between a true religion and a cult. To the ancient Romans, Greeks, Jews, and Pagans, Christianity must have been viewed as a cult. To the 7th-century Meccans, Islam was a cult. To the 19th-century Americans, Mormonism was a cult. Perhaps informed by my cynical view of religion, it seems to me that the difference is in a church’s staying power - if it flames out, it was a cult; if it survives the death of its leader, it’s a religion.

A little simplistic, surely?
High control groups that indulge in, for example human trafficking, slave labour or reckless disdain for the law?
How about worship of the leader as a deity (Sun Myung Moon, L. Ron Hubbard, Joseph Smith et al.) despite ample evidence that they were frauds?
Steve Hassan writes and speaks well on the Moonies - he was one and has gone on a remarkable journey since.
Alec Gibney’s “Going Clear” doc is worth a look, even if it only scratches the surface.
The First Amendment is excellent.
The abuse of the First by clever scams is not.

Sure. But how do you tell the difference between a true believer and someone who’s being scammed?

AFAIK, the Unification Church, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, and the Church of Scientology are all recognized by our government as real churches with the primary purpose of religion, earning them tax-exempt status.

And yeah, I agree that there’s ample evidence that Hubbard, Smith, and Moon were likely frauds. But so what? There are over 16 Million Mormons. Whether I like it or not, it’s a real church. Same goes for Scientology and Unification.

I guess what bothers me about all of this is the notion that trump could’ve spoken to some other church, and that would’ve been OK because those other churches are real churches and not cults. And it’s that comparison between religions, and the value judgment that some religions are “valid” while others are not, that I object to.

I mean, I’m on record - I don’t think any religion is valid. But I only get to make that call for myself. I just think it takes a staggering amount of hubris to say that some people’s belief system is valid but others’ is not.

[johnpcapitalist]

People call the Unification Church a cult. I don’t know how to tell the difference between a true religion and a cult. To the ancient Romans, Greeks, Jews, and Pagans, Christianity must have been viewed as a cult. To the 7th-century Meccans, Islam was a cult. To the 19th-century Americans, Mormonism was a cult. Perhaps informed by my cynical view of religion, it seems to me that the difference is in a church’s staying power - if it flames out, it was a cult; if it survives the death of its leader, it’s a religion. According to Wikipedia, the Unification Church has been around for over 67 years and has between one and two million adherents.

I don’t know … I guess I’m just bothered by your-god-isn’t-good-enough thinking.

I've spent many years in an intense study of cults, particularly Scientology. Current thinking about the definition of a cult has little to do with what they believe, and everything to do with control mechanisms that are in place to control behavior, and ultimately, the thoughts of members. Cults are high control groups, pure and simple. Yes, in the old days, cult = heretical group based on the content of the beliefs, as in the examples you cited, but no longer.

Steve Hassan's "BITE" model is a very helpful framework for determining whether a group is a cult or not. I'd highly recommend that. There are other respected cult assessment scorecards as well.

Scientology is clearly a cult, when one understands the extensive control mechanisms that the organization uses to get members to stay loyal to the group, to work long hours in the group's service, and to turn over extraordinary amounts of money to the organization. Transcendental Meditation is not a cult at the lowest levels but it can be at the more advanced levels, where people devote their lives to trying to fly using the power of their minds.

Organizations can move their position on the cult-or-not axis over time. The Mormons were a cult in the founding era, but the mainstream Mormon church is not controlling enough to qualify as a cult today. Offshoots like the FLDS church, however, are some of the most notorious cults out there.

I believe the Jehovah's Witnesses are rapidly becoming far more cult-like today than they were even a decade ago. Key indicators are increasing pressure to donate, increasing pressure to avoid interacting with non-members, increasingly militant characterization of everyone in the outside world as "the enemy," and pressure to avoid any sources of information other than church dogma.

I suspect that the deceleration of membership growth or actual declines in membership in some countries is causing executive management to panic -- the rapid growth of the group over the last 50 years has been a key selling point to new recruits: "we're growing so fast because we have the truth on our side." Along with a flat or declining membership in key markets, they're also in financial trouble. And only around 30% of children of members are continuing in the faith when they turn 18+, one of the lowest "conversion rates" of any Christian denomination. The only solution management can see is to become aggressively more cult-like.

Oddly enough, the Hare Krishnas seem to be far less cult-like than in their heyday in the 1970s, where a bunch of white kids donned saffron robes and annoyed the public at airports. Leadership recognized that sexual abuse scandals and their already poor image were existential threats that would soon bring them down. They dismantled most of the high-control behaviors that made it hard to leave the group, and they're now more or less just another Hindu sect. I've talked to a couple of cult exit consultants who say that they're not anything like in the old days from the point of view of professionals who help families get their kids out of these groups.

[bob]

P&E: Trump to Gateway Pundit: “I Do Believe They’re Going to Decertify This Election”:

"THE PRESS DOESN'T LIKE TALKING ABOUT IT"

In an interview Friday with The Gateway Pundit, 45th President of the United States Donald J. Trump said he believes the November 3, 2020 presidential election will be “decertified.”

He did not offer a time frame for when he believes that might occur.

Never; the timeframe is never.

[fierceredpanda]

Off Topic

If we can't call the Unification Church a cult, we shouldn't have called the Branch Dividians a cult either. IMO, that way madness lies. Sun Myung Moon was a certifiable lunatic and self-declared messiah.

However, I will take Maybenaut's point that distinguishing between a cult and a bona fide religion can be difficult. As an atheist, such advertising distinctions are not really my problem, as I regard them all as on equal footing vis a vis their truth value. That is to say, in my estimation, they are all equally untrue.