The Fake Electors

[raison de arizona]

Naughty, more at link.

Trump's alleged co-conspirator Kenneth Chesebro has a new perjury problem.

On left:

Chesebro testimony to Nevada grand jury that false electors scheme was contingent on winning litigation before Jan. 6.

On right:

Chesebro Dec. 8, 2020 confidential email saying it was not.

[poplove]

Trial for Nevada ‘fake electors’ delayed until January amid scheduling challenges

https://thenevadaindependent.com/articl ... il-january

[Rolodex]

What can they legally do to Chesebro? Would this negate his plea? Could he get new charges?

[RTH10260]

Settlement in Wisconsin fake elector case offers new details on the strategy by Trump lawyers
Two attorneys for then-President Donald Trump orchestrated a plan for fake electors to file paperwork falsely saying he won Wisconsin in a strategy to overturn Joe Biden’s 2020 victory there

SOPHIA TAREEN Associated Press
March 4, 2024, 5:25 PM

Two attorneys for then-President Donald Trump orchestrated a plan for fake electors to file paperwork falsely saying the Republican won Wisconsin in a strategy to overturn Joe Biden’s 2020 victory there and in other swing states, according to a lawsuit settlement reached Monday that makes public months of texts and emails.

Under their agreements, Kenneth Chesebro and Jim Troupis turned over more than 1,400 pages of documents, emails and text messages, along with photos and video, offering a detailed account of the scheme’s origins in Wisconsin. The communications show how they, with coordination from Trump campaign officials, replicated the strategy in six other states including Georgia, where Chesebro has already pleaded guilty to charges stemming from the 2020 election.

The agreements settle a civil lawsuit brought by Democrats in 2022 against the two attorneys and 10 Republicans in Wisconsin who posed as fake electors. The Republicans settled in December.

“Our democracy demands better than this,” said Scott Thompson, one of the plaintiffs' attorneys who helped negotiate the agreements. “That is why this lawsuit … consistently sought transparency, accountability and deterrence. We can’t let this happen again.”

There is no admission of wrongdoing or liability in the agreements in which Chesebro and Troupis promise to never participate in similar efforts involving future presidential campaigns. Troupis must also pay an undisclosed amount to the plaintiffs.

Troupis said Monday in an emailed statement that the “alternate elector ballots" were “a reasonable course of action” given that the 2020 results were appealable to the U.S. Supreme Court.



https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/set ... -107778239

[Slim Cognito]

That whole "no admission of wrong doing" makes my head

[Rolodex]

Ol' Kenny gonna have to find a new job.

[Sam the Centipede]

I imagine the suspension letter was more formal than the appropriate: "Hey Ken! You're too cheesy for us – now trump off out of our courtrooms. Regards, The Good Guys"

[raison de arizona]

Chesebro is a Bitcoin millionaire, fwiw.

[raison de arizona]

Pro-Trump fake electors in Arizona have pleaded the Fifth before grand jury
Requiring the targets of the probe to invoke their rights in front of grand jurors is an unusual tactic that raises a risk of bias, legal experts say.

Arizona Republicans who falsely posed as electors for Donald Trump in 2020 have appeared before a grand jury in recent days and invoked their Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination, as state prosecutors near a decision on potential criminal charges against those who helped Trump try to overturn his loss in the state.

The prosecutors’ decision to require these people to appear in person is the latest escalation of the long-running probe by the state’s attorney general, Kris Mayes, into election interference by Trump allies. The tactic is also highly unusual and risks biasing the grand jury against key targets of the probe, according to independent legal experts who have worked as both prosecutors and defense lawyers.

If the grand jury charges them, it could even provide a longshot basis for the targets to challenge the indictment.

https://www.politico.com/news/2024/03/2 ... h-00149605

[Sam the Centipede]

The tactic is also highly unusual and risks biasing the grand jury against key targets of the probe, according to independent legal experts who have worked as both prosecutors and defense lawyers.

I get the right to not self-incriminate (although why it is super-sacrosanct escapes me) but that reasoning seems odd at first reading, creating a "Get Out Of Jail Free" card. However (for similarly baffled non-leagles) the linked article clarifies the reasons why prosecutors usually avoid dragging reluctant witnesses in front of a grand juries.

BUT! These are Trumpists. They would undoubtedly infer guilt and demand immediate imprisonment for any non-Trumpy (especially a Democrat or Black person) who used the Fifth.

As self-identifying Christians they should open their Trump Bibles and read Matthew 7:1-2:

Judge not, that ye be not judged.

For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

In my view, it is always fair to apply a person's own standards to them if they would use those standards to criticize or condemn others. A legal system that included that principle would have my support! Of course the inverse does not apply, it's not ok just because you think it's ok, there lies anarchy. But who likes hypocrisy?

Lock them up! Lock them up!

[Luke]

RDA, I'm asking Tom Ryan and Paul (Arizona's Law) if they have any thoughts about this.

[bob]

[Rolodex]

Live stream of fake electors in Michigan hearing.

[Kendra]

https://abcnews.go.com/US/trump-giulian ... =109578220

Former President Donald Trump, his former chief of staff Mark Meadows, and Rudy Giuliani are unindicted co-conspirators in the Michigan attorney general's case against the state's so-called "fake electors" in the 2020 election, a state investigator revealed in court on Wednesday.

Michigan Attorney General Dana Nessel charged 16 Republicans last year with forgery and conspiracy to commit election forgery for allegedly attempting to replace Michigan's electoral votes for Joe Biden with electoral votes for Trump at the certification of the vote on Jan. 6, 2021.

MORE: 9 Michigan Republicans plead not guilty to acting as 'fake electors' in 2020
During Wednesday's hearing, which was part of preliminary examinations for the so-called fake electors, Howard Shock, a special agent for the attorney general's office, also testified that former Trump attorney Jenna Ellis is also an unindicted co-conspirator.

Shock's revelation was in response to questions from Duane Silverthorn, an attorney for Michele Lundgren, one of the so-called fake electors.

"Finally, former President Donald Trump?" asked Silverthorn.

[raison de arizona]

A state grand jury, made up of everyday, regular Arizonans, has handed down felony indictments in the ongoing investigation into the fake elector scheme in Arizona.

[Kendra]

Great news.

[Tiredretiredlawyer]

[raison de arizona]

The (redacted) indictment: https://www.azag.gov/sites/default/file ... ctment.pdf

[bob]

A state grand jury, made up of everyday, regular Arizonans, has handed down felony indictments in the ongoing investigation into the fake elector scheme in Arizona.

Interesting phraseology. Although accurate (and mundane), the dead-enders insist the (ob. "usurping") AG is driving this "vendetta." The choice of words deflects who made the decision to go forward.

[Slim Cognito]

[Kendra]

I'm watching CNN now. They're reporting that Roodles, Meadows and Boris E (too lazy to look up the spelling) are in the indictment. Not clear if they've figured out the redactions or if it's not redacted. Also reporting there's an unindicted conspirator #1 who sounds very much like tfg.

[raison de arizona]

tfg is unindicted coconspirator 1 in the indictment. Always the bridesmaid.

Well, not always.

[raison de arizona]

I'm watching CNN now. They're reporting that Roodles, Meadows and Boris E (too lazy to look up the spelling) are in the indictment. Not clear if they've figured out the redactions or if it's not redacted. Also reporting there's an unindicted conspirator #1 who sounds very much like tfg.

I haven't seen an unredacted copy yet, but it describes everyone on page 20, it's pretty obvious who they are.

Rudy Giuliani
Mark Meadows
John Eastman
Boris Epshteyn
Jenna Ellis
Christina Bobb
Mike Roman

[Kendra]

Point just made on CNN to remind us, these are STATE charges and if tfg gets elected again, it ain't going to be so easy to make them go away and/or pardon those convicted. Wonder if prosecutors will try for a cooperator or two to go higher up the food chain?

[Dave from down under]

The Don will Pravda that they need to stay strong or else..