Airline Industry

[MN-Skeptic]

A very long article from CNN Business -

Boeing was once known for safety and engineering. But critics say an emphasis on profits changed that

[northland10]

I had just read the same earlier today.

[RTH10260]

Boeing 737 Max-7/-10 Certification HALTED! 1 Feb 2024

blancolirio
1 Feb 2024

Engine Anti Ice Airworthiness Directive 8/25/2023

[RTH10260]

Cleanup underway at Bush Intercontinental Airport after fire suppression foam leak

KPRC 2 Click2Houston
2 Feb 2024

A cleanup operation is currently in progress at Bush Intercontinental Airport in Houston following an incident where fire suppression foam filled a hangar and spilled onto a nearby road.

[Frater I*I]

Cleanup underway at Bush Intercontinental Airport after fire suppression foam leak

KPRC 2 Click2Houston
2 Feb 2024

A cleanup operation is currently in progress at Bush Intercontinental Airport in Houston following an incident where fire suppression foam filled a hangar and spilled onto a nearby road.

Awwww...It happened to United...here's my sadz face for them...

[RTH10260]

Boeing back in the news

Exclusive: New quality glitch to delay some Boeing 737 MAX deliveries

By Tim Hepher and Valerie Insinna
February 5, 20243:52 AM GMT+1Updated 4 hours ago

Feb 4 (Reuters) - Boeing Co (BA.N), opens new tab said on Sunday it will have to do more work on about 50 undelivered 737 MAX airplanes, potentially delaying some near-term deliveries, after its supplier Spirit AeroSystems (SPR.N), opens new tab discovered two mis-drilled holes on some fuselages.

Boeing confirmed the findings in response to a Reuters query after industry sources said an "edge margin", or spacing problem, had been found in holes drilled on a window frame on some jets.

Boeing, which has been under fire from regulators and airlines since the Jan. 5 blowout of a door plug on a 737 MAX 9, said safety was unaffected and existing 737s could keep flying.

"This past Thursday, a supplier notified us of a non-conformance in some 737 fuselages. I want to thank an employee at the supplier who flagged to his manager that two holes may not have been drilled exactly to our requirements," Boeing Commercial Airplanes CEO Stan Deal said in a letter to staff referring to Spirit, which is the sole 737 fuselage supplier.

"While this potential condition is not an immediate flight safety issue and all 737s can continue operating safely, we currently believe we will have to perform rework on about 50 undelivered airplanes," Deal said in the letter, first reported by Reuters.

Spirit spokesperson Joe Buccino told Reuters that as part of its 360-degree quality management program, a member of its team identified an issue that did not conform to engineering standards.

"We are in close communication with Boeing on this matter," he said.

Deal said Boeing plans to devote several "factory days" this week at the Renton 737 plant outside Seattle to work on the mis-aligned holes and finish off other outstanding work. Such days allow teams to pause work without shutting the entire line.


https://www.reuters.com/business/aerosp ... 024-02-05/

[Frater I*I]

Boeing back in the news

Exclusive: New quality glitch to delay some Boeing 737 MAX deliveries



Boeing confirmed the findings in response to a Reuters query after industry sources said an "edge margin", or spacing problem, had been found in holes drilled on a window frame on some jets.

In industry terms "edge margin" is defined as the distance from the center of the fastener hole to the edge of the part. It is to be between 2X to 4X the shank diameter of the faster to be used, with the preferred being 2.5X....

[raison de arizona]

Oops.

Faulty door panel on Alaska Airlines flight had no bolts installed, NTSB says in preliminary report
The flight left Portland, Oregon, on Jan. 5 bound for Ontario International Airport in San Bernardino County, California, when the door plug blew off.

The door panel on an Alaska Airlines Boeing 737 that fell off midair had no bolts installed on the door plug, according to preliminary findings released Tuesday by the National Transportation Safety Board.

A picture of the plane in a factory in Renton, Washington, revealed the lack of bolts, the NTSB said.

"Photo documentation obtained from Boeing shows evidence of the left-hand MED plug closed with no retention hardware (bolts) in the three visible locations," the report said, using an acronym for the middle exit door.

However, it was not clear at what stage in the manufacturing process the plane was in when the photo was taken.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/fa ... rcna136416

[raison de arizona]

Good video.

Southwest Airlines unveiled a new cabin design that includes smaller and thinner seats.

They aren't alone: Airlines have cut an estimated 8 inches of legroom and two inches of seat width in the last two decades.

It's one of a handful of reasons flying sucks so much these days.

[Frater I*I]

Good video.

Southwest Airlines unveiled a new cabin design that includes smaller and thinner seats.

They aren't alone: Airlines have cut an estimated 8 inches of legroom and two inches of seat width in the last two decades.

It's one of a handful of reasons flying sucks so much these days.

Hence why we mechanics often refer to them as cattle cars...

[keith]

And why we passengers have called cattle class for decades.

[RTH10260]

Juan Browne comments on the preliminary accidenr report with some more details

[Slim Cognito]

And why we passengers have called cattle class for decades.

When it comes to flying, being short has its advantages.

[Frater I*I]

And why we passengers have called cattle class for decades.

When it comes to flying, being short has its advantages.

Plus always choose the aft over wing exit row...more leg room and the seats recline....

[raison de arizona]

Using airport wifi? Don't make stupid jokes, even if they are "private."

An 18-year-old from Britain faces a fine of 100 thousand pounds sterling because of a joke on Snapchat.

Before the flight, the guy joked in a chat with friends that as soon as they boarded the flight, he would blow up the plane.

Since the message was left over Wi-Fi at the airport, it was quickly intercepted by intelligence agencies. After takeoff, Air Force fighters scrambled behind the plane.

Story: https://airlive.net/news/2024/02/01/a-t ... hter-jets/

[RTH10260]

A Boeing 787 on a transatlantic flight turned around after 8 of its 9 bathrooms reportedly stopped working

Pete Syme
Feb 14, 2024, 1:33 PM GMT+1

• Several bathrooms on a Boeing 787 Dreamliner stopped working on a transatlantic flight.
  The pilots appeared to consider turning back after an hour but continued on before U-turning later.
  The KLM jet seems to have been repaired as it flew to Houston and back on Tuesday.

Several bathrooms on a Boeing 787 Dreamliner stopped working on a transatlantic flight, forcing the pilots to turn around, a KLM spokesperson told Business Insider.

Eight of the nine bathrooms stopped working on the jet carrying more than 200 passengers from Amsterdam to Los Angeles on Monday, Airlive.net reported.

Soon after takeoff, flight attendants realized that just one bathroom on the plane was working, per the outlet.

Data from Flightradar24 suggests the pilots first considered heading back to Amsterdam about an hour into the flight. The plane did a circle north of the UK before the pilots decided to continue.

But two hours later, the jet did a U-turn over Greenland and returned to Amsterdam Schiphol Airport — meaning passengers had a 6 ½-hour flight to nowhere.

KLM said in a statement shared with BI: "KL601 to Los Angeles returned to Amsterdam on Monday because it was discovered during the flight that the toilets were no longer functioning properly. This malfunction occurred after departure."

"Because the problem affected multiple toilets, it was decided to return to Schiphol," it added.

The airline then replaced the 787 with another one, KLM said. It departed from Amsterdam nine hours later than originally scheduled.



https://www.businessinsider.com/boeing- ... ing-2024-2

[raison de arizona]

Fun super bowl related animation.

525 private jets departing Las Vegas after the Super Bowl.

[RTH10260]

Canada

Air Canada ordered to refund passenger after ‘misleading’ conversation with site’s AI chatbot

By Social Links forAriel Zilber
Published Feb. 19, 2024, 12:24 p.m. ET

Air Canada was ordered to reimburse a passenger who was mistakenly promised a cheaper bereavement fare by the airline’s AI chatbot — a possible landmark decision as more companies turn to artificial intelligence for customer service.

Jack Moffat, a Vancouver resident, had asked the airline’s support chatbot whether it offered bereavement rates following the death of his grandmother in November 2022.

The chatbot responded by telling the grieving grandson he could claim the lower price up to 90 days after flying by filing a claim.

However, the airline’s actual bereavement policy, does not include a post-flight refund. It also says all discounts must first be approved.

Moffatt ended up booking a roundtrip flight to Toronto for the funeral for around $1,200 but when he contacted Air Canada for the refund he was told he wasn’t eligible, according to the court filing.

He sent numerous emails with the attached screenshots of his conversation with the chatbot to Air Canada in an attempt to retrieve the money, the complaint said.

But on Feb. 8, 2023, an Air Canada representative informed him that the chatbot provided “misleading words” and that the company’s bereavement policy did not apply discounts retroactively.

Moffatt was told by the airline that it would update the chatbot so that its messages would align with the information that was posted to the company website.

The peeved passenger then filed suit against the airline, which claimed in court that the chatbot was a “separate legal entity” and thus was responsible for its actions.

Last week, a Canadian tribunal sided with Moffatt and ordered Air Canada to issue a refund for roughly $600.

“While a chatbot has an interactive component, it is still just a part of Air Canada’s website. It should be obvious to Air Canada that it is responsible for all the information on its website,” wrote Christopher Rivers, a civil resolution tribunal member of the courts in British Columbia.



https://nypost.com/2024/02/19/business/ ... -messages/

[Rolodex]

Which is one of the main reasons I prefer text chat for customer service issues. I can screen shot the whole conversation. I wonder who else LOL'd when the airline said the chat bot isn't part of them and is responsible for its own actions.

[RTH10260]

wait a couple of years an SCOTUS will provide chatbots personality rights just "cause tehy behave so humanlike", ye kow - just like embryos that can speak and respond

[MN-Skeptic]

My niece is auditioning with her cello at five grad schools. Her mom has been flying with her. Right now they've just boarded the airplane to fly home from Boston. My sister-in-law texted me that the flight attendant stopped my niece as she was going down the aisle with her cello and exclaimed: "Ma'am! That's not going to fit in the overhead bin!"



Yeah. That's why they've bought a ticket for the cello.

My sister-in-law is surprised at the lack of knowledge of so many of the Delta employees - phone agents, counter agents, gate agents, stewards... when it comes to flying with a cello. But she did discover, the other day, that Delta has a group of employees called Red Coats who are more knowledgeable and help out when questions arise.

[chancery]

There's a literature about the problems of flying with a cello, including tickets for cellos being dishonored. I dimly recall that Yo-Yo Ma has had occasional problems.

And more recently Annie McGee, an Australian musician who had checked her cello on a flight to play at a festival in Brazil, reported the following unhappy experience:

I am so enraged by my experience travelling LATAM Airlines that I thought I should share.

My flights have been delayed, staff have refused to make themselves available to speak with, I’ve missed connecting flights, I’ve queued in line for four hours to arrange new flights, I’ve been given measly food vouchers as compensation that aren’t accepted by the airport, I’ve had to stay at the airport gates overnight rather than in a hotel. The list goes on.

I would have put up with all of that, no complaint, had they not lost my luggage – my suitcase and my cello. Only with the help of my gorgeous Brazilian friend on the phone could I communicate with airport staff in São Paulo to complete a lost baggage form.

After they informed me my luggage had been located in Santiago and would be on the next flight to São Paulo and delivered to my accommodation, I calmed down a little. Alas, after 30 hours here in São Paulo my luggage status is now ‘missing’. After initially saying they would get in touch with me, customer service says I should call back after 36 hours as there’s nothing they can do for me before then. Otherwise I should just keep checking online using my luggage reference number. No apology for the inconvenience has yet been given.

I’ve come to Brazil to play in a music festival with fabulous musicians, teachers and conductors. I arrived a week early to adjust to the time zone and continue preparing some very difficult repertoire. Now I’m in doubt whether I will receive my cello before the festival and even get a chance to play.

https://slippedisc.com/2018/01/now-airl ... s-a-cello/

I couldn't find out whether the cello was returned in time.

[MN-Skeptic]

I was there when my niece bought her cello. The cello, bow, and case came to $51K. She will NOT be putting that in baggage. Besides being an expensive instrument, you do not want to subject the cello to the changes in temperature in the hold.

My sister-in-law did a lot of research before she booked their flights. So far she's only booked on Delta flights. She has learned that she can either book the cello as cabin baggage or as an extra seat for her daughter. If she books it as an extra seat, then the cello counts as one of her two carry-on pieces. If the cello is booked as cabin baggage, then my niece can also have two carry-on pieces. My sister-in-law and niece have also gotten to the airports 2 hours before the flights so that they can deal with any issues.

[Maybenaut]

In 1982 American Airlines lost my guitar. I wanted to bring it in the cabin and they forced me to check it at the gate. Non-stop flight from Honolulu to San Francisco. I had a window seat, and saw it get loaded on the plane. It didn’t come off. I waited at the airport as long as I could, but the Coast Guard driver came to pick me up so I had to go.

The airline called and said they found it and contracted UPS to deliver it to the CG base the next day. It never showed. UPS said they never got it. This was before online tracking, and the Airline and UPS pointed at each other.

[northland10]

I got tired trying to squeeze a 4000 pipe pipe organ, and the console into the overhead so now I just travel with my organ shoes.