Kyle Rittenhouse, previous owner of a Smith & Wesson M&P15

[MN-Skeptic]

Rittenhouse killed and maimed, cried crocodile tears, and expressed no remorse.

And now he's trying to profit off of it with his book.

[raison de arizona]

It is quite frankly profoundly disgusting.

Rittenhouse killed and maimed, cried crocodile tears, and expressed no remorse.

Correct. And I still feel a bit for this young man. He was a kid and then the RW machine consumed him.
I can't fix it now. What he did was wrong.
He would have much more sympathy if he had owned up to it then.

His backstory explains, but doesn't excuse.

[RVInit]

It is quite frankly profoundly disgusting.

Rittenhouse killed and maimed, cried crocodile tears, and expressed no remorse.

Correct. And I still feel a bit for this young man. He was a kid and then the RW machine consumed him.
I can't fix it now. What he did was wrong.
He would have much more sympathy if he had owned up to it then.

I agree with all of this. So, OK, he got away with outright murder, IMO. The least he could have done is express remorse for lives lost. You don't even have to admit to being guilty of murder to express remorse for the fact that two of your fellow human beings ended up dead and one was severely maimed.

None of that had to happen. Kyle was running away from someone he KNEW was not armed. If he ran that far without being shot in the back then he KNEW the guy was just a blunderbuss and no actual threat. All he had to do was keep running like he started to do. But, I guess when you live in certain places you know damn well the other rwnj gun worshippers and will allow you to get away with it.

And some will troll forums to keep spewing the same crap that said forum has already rejected.

[raison de arizona]

And some will troll forums to keep spewing the same crap that said forum has already rejected.

I don't think Anders is a troll. He brings facts and information to the forum that I don't see elsewhere, and I appreciate that. I disagree with his opinion, and it is pointless to argue it with him at this point. But I appreciate the tidbits of info he brings, and I believe the forum is richer not only for those, but also for having a differing viewpoints that are civilly expressed. It can be frustrating, but who wants an echo chamber all the time?

[RVInit]

And some will troll forums to keep spewing the same crap that said forum has already rejected.

I don't think Anders is a troll. He brings facts and information to the forum that I don't see elsewhere, and I appreciate that. I disagree with his opinion, and it is pointless to argue it with him at this point. But I appreciate the tidbits of info he brings, and I believe the forum is richer not only for those, but also for having a differing viewpoints that are civilly expressed. It can be frustrating, but who wants an echo chamber all the time?

I haven't read his posts beyond the original posting he used to write after the trial. Maybe he is bringing new information now, but he was doing nothing but trolling back in the day. And much of what he offered was flat out BS. Could be he's changed, but I'm not wasting my time on his posts.

[raison de arizona]

And some will troll forums to keep spewing the same crap that said forum has already rejected.

I don't think Anders is a troll. He brings facts and information to the forum that I don't see elsewhere, and I appreciate that. I disagree with his opinion, and it is pointless to argue it with him at this point. But I appreciate the tidbits of info he brings, and I believe the forum is richer not only for those, but also for having a differing viewpoints that are civilly expressed. It can be frustrating, but who wants an echo chamber all the time?

I haven't read his posts beyond the original posting he used to write after the trial. Maybe he is bringing new information now, but he was doing nothing but trolling back in the day. And much of what he offered was flat out BS. Could be he's changed, but I'm not wasting my time on his posts.

I'm referring to posts such as this one from a few days ago:

Possibly of interest: Then Rittenhouse family advisor David Hancock tweeted recollections about prepping KR for testimony. [Wrapped in a spoiler simply because of its length.]

► Show Spoiler

Kyle is trainable. Getting the script takes him a while, but he is trainable. This story might explain why @thisiskyler sounded like a robot during today's interview with @piersmorgan

In the beginning, we were all very nervous about Kyle testifying. During the first session, to prepare Kyle for cross-examination, Corey asked Kyle about the purpose of putting people on the roof of Carsource.

Kyle's reply shocked all of us who were in the room.

Kyle stated, "We put SNIPERS on the roof so they could shoot down to stop any threats."

WHAT? WHOAAAA? We all looked at each other in disbelief that he would ACTUALLY say that out loud.

At that moment, everyone knew prepping Kyle for cross-examination would take serious work. Over the following several months, Kyle participated in hours upon hours of preparation for his potential cross-examination. The script was pounded into him day in and day out. He never seemed to get it and oftentimes went rogue with an answer that had the potential to send his defense strategy off the rails. At the time, there wasn't enough money to afford the full breadth of the jury consultant's services, specifically the MUCH NEEDED mock trials. I told Mark that it was vital that Kyle had every available asset, especially the mock trials. I took out a personal loan and paid the first installment myself. I hoped we could raise enough to pay the balance once the trial had begun. We did.

So you see, his robotic comments and commitment to the strategic narrative result from the hundreds of hours of preparation and research that went into preparing Kyle for his cross-examination, which itself cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Still, I can tell you that everyone in the courthouse who knew better was extremely nervous when the day came for Kyle to take the oath. We weren't sure whether he would go rogue yet again.

I know what it took to train Kyle for his day on the stand. I know Kyle's actual state of mind that evening in Kenosha. This is one of the primary reasons I pushed Kyle so hard to keep his head down and go to school. I'm not saying that he wasn't attacked. I'm not saying he didn't defend himself if you take the events in isolation. I am saying that Kyle lacks even the most basic form of self-awareness which prevents him from reflecting honestly on his role in the entire incident.

I believed that he needed time to process the events that had just occurred and reflect on the reality that they wouldn't have happened without a string of bad decisions he made in the months leading up to the incident in Kenosha. Kyle appears to have forgotten that he put himself in that position, and his own words support the conclusion that he didn't do it for the sole purpose of providing medical care.

Publishing that book was a dangerous and stupid thing to do at this point, given the upcoming civil proceedings. If there is a legal strategy to place all the blame on others, attack those who supported you the most, and complain about your childhood as if it absolves you of any responsibility, then I clearly don't see it.

We shall see. The run-up to the civil proceedings next year will be interesting, to say the least.

Source: https://x.com/DaveHan06/status/1730015247212364234

[Volkonski]

Kyle Rittenhouse's New Book Bombs on Kindle

https://www.newsweek.com/kyle-rittenhou ... le-1849647

Rittenhouse may be disappointed because according to figures from Amazon, the work is sitting at #9,569 in the Kindle Store sector as of Tuesday. It also ranks 510 in Nonfiction in the Kindle store.

[neonzx]

Kyle Rittenhouse's New Book Bombs on Kindle

Didn't he have a game app too awhile back that ended as a crash burn venture?

Oh, that is right.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/video-ga ... efamation/

Kyle Rittenhouse, who shot and killed two people and wounded a third during a protest in Kenosha, Wis., in 2020, announced Thursday plans to release a video game, with proceeds going toward funding defamation lawsuits against the media. In the game, players control Rittenhouse, who, equipped with a cartoonish orange gun, shoots turkeys labeled “fake news” and “MSDNC.”

“The media is nothing but a bunch of turkeys with nothing better to do than to push their lying agenda and destroy innocent people’s lives,” Rittenhouse says in a trailer for the game.

The game, “Kyle Rittenhouse’s Turkey Shoot,” is not currently available. On its website, users can preorder the title for $9.99. The site does not say when the game will be released, though it notes that the game will “aid Kyle’s legal defense against the fake news.”

[Rolodex]

He fancies himself a "combat medic." He should join the military. Maybe he could earn a real living instead of sponging off donations.
OTOH, the military does have problems with racists and nationalists, so while Kyle could find fellow travelers there, it's not a good thing for our military.

[Estiveo]

He wouldn't last a week in basic.

[andersweinstein]

But this is the point I have been trying to make and to which I think you have been either non-receptive or willfully blind: His original pre-coaching testimony would have showed a state of mind that he wasn't thinking of himself as a combat zone *medic* at all, but as a full combat participant, and the medic story was meant to soften the edges.

When a kid is willing to blurt out his true reaction on the stand and it includes having snipers on the roof, most reasonable people would not associate this with the state of mind of someone engaging in defensive, supportive, operations involving combat zone medical first response. By making it clear what was in his head, Kyle would have with lack of coaching to polish up his act revealed his unvarnished thoughts which showed a more lethal combat oriented intent. It is only the coaching which kept that state-of-mind evidence from the jury.

I guess I don't see it as damning as you do even to think of himself as in something like full combat situation. It was a dangerous area, there were many people with guns, there were rioters among the crowd intent on burning things or smashing property. So, it can still just express the idea that they're going into a dangerous area and need to be prepared if needed. He makes the unseemly reference to "snipers" on the roof in case of threats -- he's not suggesting they have some offensive role to pick off the enemy.

For comparison, read Ryan Balch's Facebook post shortly after the incident. He's ex-military and it's sprinkled with formulations framing it as some kind of military operation. He "infiltrated" Kenosha with some "unaligned observers", saw "lack of leadership on the ground" so "inserted himself into a tactical advisement role", he refers to "MHT - militia held territory" vs "PHT - police held territory" and "NML-No Man's Land", and of course "maintained a perimeter". Several others also had military service, and I have no doubt they spoke in terms like this. But they seemed mature adults and none of them shoot anybody.

So I think that the kid thought it was cool to frame things that way, that the guys on the roof were "snipers" etc. I mentioned him shouting up "I need cover, I need cover" before starting to help a wounded protestor. It was an adventure for him in which he was acting out a fantasy of himself (as a police officer, as an EMT, as a combat medic, maybe all of these). Sure, the lawyers would be like, my god, don't let the jurors hear you thought of them as "snipers". And they want to spin things to present him in the best possible light. But it just doesn't seem to me strong evidence he was looking to hunt or kill anyone, any more than quasi-military framing does from the more mature adults in the group.

[Dave from down under]

His fantasy was to shoot people.

He was very specific about that before he went and did that.

Means
Motive
Opportunity

2 dead
1 maimed

He got away with murder

[Rolodex]

He wouldn't last a week in basic.

But how wonderful to watch him wash out.

[Estiveo]

He wouldn't last a week in basic.

But how wonderful to watch him wash out.

You could definitely sell tickets.

[Frater I*I]

He wouldn't last a week in basic.

He wouldn't last a day at Parris Island...

[RVInit]

I don't think Anders is a troll. He brings facts and information to the forum that I don't see elsewhere, and I appreciate that. I disagree with his opinion, and it is pointless to argue it with him at this point. But I appreciate the tidbits of info he brings, and I believe the forum is richer not only for those, but also for having a differing viewpoints that are civilly expressed. It can be frustrating, but who wants an echo chamber all the time?

I haven't read his posts beyond the original posting he used to write after the trial. Maybe he is bringing new information now, but he was doing nothing but trolling back in the day. And much of what he offered was flat out BS. Could be he's changed, but I'm not wasting my time on his posts.

I'm referring to posts such as this one from a few days ago:

Possibly of interest: Then Rittenhouse family advisor David Hancock tweeted recollections about prepping KR for testimony. [Wrapped in a spoiler simply because of its length.]

► Show Spoiler

Kyle is trainable. Getting the script takes him a while, but he is trainable. This story might explain why @thisiskyler sounded like a robot during today's interview with @piersmorgan

In the beginning, we were all very nervous about Kyle testifying. During the first session, to prepare Kyle for cross-examination, Corey asked Kyle about the purpose of putting people on the roof of Carsource.

Kyle's reply shocked all of us who were in the room.

Kyle stated, "We put SNIPERS on the roof so they could shoot down to stop any threats."

WHAT? WHOAAAA? We all looked at each other in disbelief that he would ACTUALLY say that out loud.

At that moment, everyone knew prepping Kyle for cross-examination would take serious work. Over the following several months, Kyle participated in hours upon hours of preparation for his potential cross-examination. The script was pounded into him day in and day out. He never seemed to get it and oftentimes went rogue with an answer that had the potential to send his defense strategy off the rails. At the time, there wasn't enough money to afford the full breadth of the jury consultant's services, specifically the MUCH NEEDED mock trials. I told Mark that it was vital that Kyle had every available asset, especially the mock trials. I took out a personal loan and paid the first installment myself. I hoped we could raise enough to pay the balance once the trial had begun. We did.

So you see, his robotic comments and commitment to the strategic narrative result from the hundreds of hours of preparation and research that went into preparing Kyle for his cross-examination, which itself cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Still, I can tell you that everyone in the courthouse who knew better was extremely nervous when the day came for Kyle to take the oath. We weren't sure whether he would go rogue yet again.

I know what it took to train Kyle for his day on the stand. I know Kyle's actual state of mind that evening in Kenosha. This is one of the primary reasons I pushed Kyle so hard to keep his head down and go to school. I'm not saying that he wasn't attacked. I'm not saying he didn't defend himself if you take the events in isolation. I am saying that Kyle lacks even the most basic form of self-awareness which prevents him from reflecting honestly on his role in the entire incident.

I believed that he needed time to process the events that had just occurred and reflect on the reality that they wouldn't have happened without a string of bad decisions he made in the months leading up to the incident in Kenosha. Kyle appears to have forgotten that he put himself in that position, and his own words support the conclusion that he didn't do it for the sole purpose of providing medical care.

Publishing that book was a dangerous and stupid thing to do at this point, given the upcoming civil proceedings. If there is a legal strategy to place all the blame on others, attack those who supported you the most, and complain about your childhood as if it absolves you of any responsibility, then I clearly don't see it.

We shall see. The run-up to the civil proceedings next year will be interesting, to say the least.

Source: https://x.com/DaveHan06/status/1730015247212364234

So he comes on here to post something that clearly shows Kyle's actual state of mind of being among a group of snipers and then continues to argue Kyle's innocence. OK.

[RVInit]

I haven't read his posts beyond the original posting he used to write after the trial. Maybe he is bringing new information now, but he was doing nothing but trolling back in the day. And much of what he offered was flat out BS. Could be he's changed, but I'm not wasting my time on his posts.

I'm referring to posts such as this one from a few days ago:

Possibly of interest: Then Rittenhouse family advisor David Hancock tweeted recollections about prepping KR for testimony. [Wrapped in a spoiler simply because of its length.]

► Show Spoiler

Kyle is trainable. Getting the script takes him a while, but he is trainable. This story might explain why @thisiskyler sounded like a robot during today's interview with @piersmorgan

In the beginning, we were all very nervous about Kyle testifying. During the first session, to prepare Kyle for cross-examination, Corey asked Kyle about the purpose of putting people on the roof of Carsource.

Kyle's reply shocked all of us who were in the room.

Kyle stated, "We put SNIPERS on the roof so they could shoot down to stop any threats."

WHAT? WHOAAAA? We all looked at each other in disbelief that he would ACTUALLY say that out loud.

At that moment, everyone knew prepping Kyle for cross-examination would take serious work. Over the following several months, Kyle participated in hours upon hours of preparation for his potential cross-examination. The script was pounded into him day in and day out. He never seemed to get it and oftentimes went rogue with an answer that had the potential to send his defense strategy off the rails. At the time, there wasn't enough money to afford the full breadth of the jury consultant's services, specifically the MUCH NEEDED mock trials. I told Mark that it was vital that Kyle had every available asset, especially the mock trials. I took out a personal loan and paid the first installment myself. I hoped we could raise enough to pay the balance once the trial had begun. We did.

So you see, his robotic comments and commitment to the strategic narrative result from the hundreds of hours of preparation and research that went into preparing Kyle for his cross-examination, which itself cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Still, I can tell you that everyone in the courthouse who knew better was extremely nervous when the day came for Kyle to take the oath. We weren't sure whether he would go rogue yet again.

I know what it took to train Kyle for his day on the stand. I know Kyle's actual state of mind that evening in Kenosha. This is one of the primary reasons I pushed Kyle so hard to keep his head down and go to school. I'm not saying that he wasn't attacked. I'm not saying he didn't defend himself if you take the events in isolation. I am saying that Kyle lacks even the most basic form of self-awareness which prevents him from reflecting honestly on his role in the entire incident.

I believed that he needed time to process the events that had just occurred and reflect on the reality that they wouldn't have happened without a string of bad decisions he made in the months leading up to the incident in Kenosha. Kyle appears to have forgotten that he put himself in that position, and his own words support the conclusion that he didn't do it for the sole purpose of providing medical care.

Publishing that book was a dangerous and stupid thing to do at this point, given the upcoming civil proceedings. If there is a legal strategy to place all the blame on others, attack those who supported you the most, and complain about your childhood as if it absolves you of any responsibility, then I clearly don't see it.

We shall see. The run-up to the civil proceedings next year will be interesting, to say the least.

Source: https://x.com/DaveHan06/status/1730015247212364234

So he comes on here to post something that clearly shows Kyle's actual state of mind of being among a group of snipers and then continues to argue Kyle's innocence. OK, I get why you are saying that this one time he actually posted something of interest. But I don't particularly think it was done in good faith, given he knew how we would react and used it as just one more opportunity to spout nonsense.

[andersweinstein]

A thank you gift to raison de arizona: More damaging revelations from David Hancock's Twitter feed. Hancock says he has photos of texts from KRs phone. No way to verify, but don't have reason to doubt it. He says the DA failed in first attempt to download the phone data and didn't pursue help for whatever reason, but expects damaging stuff from it to come out in the civil trial. I think these are referring to the CVS incident, but Hancock is not always clear about the context. Go to town:

► Show Spoiler

Source Tweets:
https://x.com/DaveHan06/status/1729226962055712949
https://x.com/DaveHan06/status/1730220125339652295

ETA: Today Hancock has all of 52 followers on Twitter (I'm one). Someday some journalist will pick this stuff up. We can expect he'll be called in the civil trial. I'm curious what Rittenhouse's lawyers think of what he's doing. He is a man with a grudge and his own agenda, but also tremendous inside perspective.

ETA2: some of this stuff does give me pause.

[neeneko]

So he comes on here to post something that clearly shows Kyle's actual state of mind of being among a group of snipers and then continues to argue Kyle's innocence. OK, I get why you are saying that this one time he actually posted something of interest. But I don't particularly think it was done in good faith, given he knew how we would react and used it as just one more opportunity to spout nonsense.

Eh, I strongly disagree with andersweinstein's take on the legally and neuconce of the situation, I have never gotten the impression that they are arguing in bad faith. To be blunt, everyone here seems to have magical insight (and I include myself in this) into Rittenhouse's mind, and I think we are all being a little overconfident in what we think we know regarding the internal states of the various actors involved.

[Dave from down under]

See above post from Anders

If true

It gives a very good insight into Kyle’s attitude to others.

We already had his statement that he would shoot people.

As to his state of mind… I try to keep out of sewers.

He killed 2 and maimed one.

[Baidn]

It is quite frankly profoundly disgusting.

Rittenhouse killed and maimed, cried crocodile tears, and expressed no remorse.

Correct. And I still feel a bit for this young man. He was a kid and then the RW machine consumed him.
I can't fix it now. What he did was wrong.
He would have much more sympathy if he had owned up to it then.

I was fully willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially. I said here and other places that if he was being honest about trying to just move on with his life he should be allowed to, even that if he was feeling genuine remorse learning and moving on that's the best that could be hoped for. Unfortunately he did the opposite of that, he became another Zimmerman. No one can see directly into the mind of another and it doesn't really even matter at this point since nothing will undo what he did and the system found him innocent HOWEVER his actions since make any defense of him unwarranted. Whatever his feelings at the moment were his goals now are to capitalize on the pain and deaths of others and work to encourage further violence. Any defense of Rittenhouse that does not address this fact is not made in good faith.

[andersweinstein]

I was fully willing to give him the benefit of the doubt initially. I said here and other places that if he was being honest about trying to just move on with his life he should be allowed to, even that if he was feeling genuine remorse learning and moving on that's the best that could be hoped for. Unfortunately he did the opposite of that, he became another Zimmerman. No one can see directly into the mind of another and it doesn't really even matter at this point since nothing will undo what he did and the system found him innocent HOWEVER his actions since make any defense of him unwarranted. Whatever his feelings at the moment were his goals now are to capitalize on the pain and deaths of others and work to encourage further violence. Any defense of Rittenhouse that does not address this fact is not made in good faith.

I've never defended Rittenhouse in that sense. My thesis is only that he had a good self-defense case.

[neeneko]

I've never defended Rittenhouse in that sense. My thesis is only that he had a good self-defense case.

Unfortunately, good self defense cases still tend to be pretty sketchy. There is the legal question, and the moral question.. and the law protects a lot of stuff that it morally should not and fails to protect a lot of stuff it morally should.

[pipistrelle]

I agree with Maybenaut. Jury nullification. Everyone’s a wannabe Rambo.

[neeneko]

I agree with Maybenaut. Jury nullification. Everyone’s a wannabe Rambo.

Yep. This is one of the underlying flaws of self defence arguments.. what jourists are more likely to see themselves in the place of the patriotic white kid than those evil protesters or people who couldn't afford to avoid having a criminal record.. so are more likely to picture themselves doing the shooting than being shot at.