State of New York vs Trump, et al - the civil fraud case against the Trump Organization

[Reality Check]

So will Trump pay real estate taxes based on his inflated values?

I thought that was the problem. The Trump Organization kept two sets of books. One set they showed the banks to secure favorable loan terms. The other set they used for paying taxes.

[Volkonski]

So will Trump pay real estate taxes based on his inflated values?

I thought that was the problem. The Trump Organization kept two sets of books. One set they showed the banks to secure favorable loan terms. The other set they used for not paying taxes.

[Reality Check]

or avoiding taxes ...

[Gregg]

or avoiding evading taxes ...

[humblescribe]

I would believe that if tRump loses this civil matter, any escape would become moot. The State is asking for zillions of dollars which will be more than sufficient to cover the deficiencies.

At this point I believe that any judgment, including prohibition of doing business in the State of New York for the life of any living heir of Charles III plus twenty-one years, will be more than enough to make everyone happy and drive tfg off the deep end.

And then there are those niggling potential criminal matters that are circling overhead like vultures......

[raison de arizona]

Trumps Fail To Turn Over Documents In Fraud Case, New York Attorney General Claims

Donald Trump, his three eldest children and the Trump Organization failed to turn over emails and other communications in a fraud lawsuit, the New York attorney general’s office claimed in a letter submitted in court last week. The office singled out “an unexplained drop-off in emails for Ivanka Trump” as one of the more significant issues.

The refusal to provide material goes back to the investigation into the Trumps’ business practices that preceded the lawsuit, the letter notes. In May 2022, the former president paid a $110,000 fine after Judge Arthur Engoron found Trump in contempt for failing to comply with a subpoena from the attorney general’s office. “For years, Mr. Trump and the Trump Organization have tried to thwart our lawful investigation, but today’s decision makes clear that no one can evade accountability,” Attorney General Letitia James said when a judge ordered Trump ordered to pay the fine last year.

The attorney general’s office is now saying the Trumps’ evasiveness has continued into the discovery process of the $250 million lawsuit, which alleges Donald Trump, his children, the Trump Organization and some of its top executives inflated property values to obtain economic benefits, such as securing cheaper loans. The defendants have denied the charges.

Last week, the attorney general’s office asked Engoron to intervene, saying the Trumps had started turning over documents but have not provided a timeline for when they will hand over everything. According to the attorney general, the Trumps also have not answered questions about how they are collecting the materials.

The letter notes a significant decline in emails turned over from Ivanka Trump, dropping from an average of 1,200 emails per month in the first nine months of 2014 to just 37 emails a month in 2016. The attorney general’s office asked Ivanka’s lawyers about the issue and was unimpressed by their response. “Not only have defendants failed to offer any substantive response to this inquiry, but there have been no documents produced by Ms. Trump,” the attorney general’s office told the judge on Friday.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/zacheverso ... al-claims/

[Kendra]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/30/politics ... index.html

Donald Trump inflated his net worth by as much as $2.2 billion in one year, lawyers for the New York attorney general’s office alleged as part of their civil fraud lawsuit against the former president, his adult sons and the Trump Organization.

Over a 10-year period, the attorney general’s office said that when it corrects the Trump financial statements for alleged misvaluations it “reduces Mr. Trump’s net worth by between 17-39% in each year, or between $812 million to $2.2 billion, depending on the year.” The $2.2 billion disparity came in 2014, the state said.

The new allegations were made in a partial summary judgment motion made public Wednesday by New York Attorney General Letitia James, a Democrat.

“Based on the undisputed evidence, no trial is required for the court to determine that defendants presented grossly and materially inflated asset values in the (statements of financial condition) and then used those SFCs repeatedly in business transactions to defraud banks and insurers,” the attorney general’s office wrote. “Notwithstanding defendants’ horde of 13 experts, at the end of the day, this is a documents case, and the documents leave no shred of doubt that Mr. Trump’s SFCs do not even remotely reflect the ‘estimated current value’ of his assets as they would trade between well-informed market participants.”

The attorney general’s office said their valuation and accounting experts determined that “Mr. Trump’s net worth in any year between 2011 and 2021 would be no more than $2.6 billion, rather than the stated net worth of up to $6.1 billion, and likely considerably less if his properties were actually valued in full blown professional appraisals.”

CNN has reached out to the Trump Organization for comment.

James’ office is asking the judge to find that Trump and others made false or misleading financial statements from 2011-2021 and benefited from inflating his assets by receiving favorable loan terms and insurance rates.

[Greatgrey]

Transcript of ShitGibbon’s April deposition. Almost 500 pages.

He saved us from nuclear war, so he should be excused for lying about his finances. (Page 29)

And this gem, he can’t name the person installed as trustee when he took office. If I remember correctly, he was claiming he was worth over 4 billion. If I had 4 billion I’d sure as hell know who was in charge of it. (Pg 22)

IMG_9555.jpeg (317.79 KiB) Viewed 1703 times

https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/ ... s__859.pdf

[NewMexGirl]

Ooh, love to see the kids get their just desserts. I am greedy; they all gotta go down.

[somerset]

Transcript of ShitGibbon’s April deposition. Almost 500 pages.

He saved us from nuclear war, so he should be excused for lying about his finances. (Page 29)

And this gem, he can’t name the person installed as trustee when he took office. If I remember correctly, he was claiming he was worth over 4 billion. If I had 4 billion I’d sure as hell know who was in charge of it. (Pg 22) IMG_9555.jpeg


https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/ ... s__859.pdf

Thanks, GG. This guy is so full of shit

[p0rtia]

I working my way through the NY Depo. About a third of theh way through. Gag me.

As an editor I am qualified to trim off the extraneous words. Here is my version of what I've read so far. Dedicated readers will note some familiar refrains:

Everything property I own is top ten. Maybe top one.
Everyone says everything I do is amazing.
I don't remember anyone's name or really know anyone.
Many people have told me if I ever decide to sell MAL or Turnberry, they would buy them for billions. Who? Rich people. I don't remember their names.
Banks beg me to take their money.
But now I prefer to pay cash. I have 400 mill in cash on hand.
The value of my properties is based on what I think at the time they will be worth in future years.
Property is like the Mona Lisa, which hangs on a wall. It has "glamor value."
Alan prepared the statements. I never read them, I just signed them.
Anyone who thought those statements were meaningful is a fool, because "worthless clause." (See the attached lengthy screen cap)

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[p0rtia]

Moar:

[p0rtia]

And finally:

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[p0rtia]

My impressions, sans gag-factor and sarcasm:

He is fucked. Evasive, repetitive (unbelievably -- the Mona Lisa bit appears 3 times in the first 100 pages), buffoon-like in his self-praise, illiterate, and obnoxious (gets in digs at this weeks Biden sins). But above all, he is confirming that the valuing of his properties is just his opinion. He says that; that it's his "opinion" and not backed up by documentation, and that he included "glamor value" when he wants a number to be high.

[Tiredretiredlawyer]

You have earned …drum roll…. the Fogbow Medal of Valor!!!!!! Congratulations, p0rtia, for your bravery!!!!!!

[pipistrelle]

I LOLed.

2023-08-31 07.36.30.jpeg (119.6 KiB) Viewed 1544 times

[Slim Cognito]

Soooo....."I have my own opinion on how bigly valuable my property is but if you want an accuate number, find it yourself."

[jemcanada2]

After Allen Weisselberg went to jail after refusing to flip on tfg, tfg throws him under the bus? I’m shocked! Shocked, I tell you.

“Allen prepared the documents. I didn’t read them. I just signed them.”

[pipistrelle]

After Allen Weisselberg went to jail after refusing to flip on tfg, tfg throws him under the bus? I’m shocked! Shocked, I tell you.

“Allen prepared the documents. I didn’t read them. I just signed them.”

In the real business world, the CEO/president is responsible.

[RTH10260]

I working my way through the NY Depo. About a third of theh way through. Gag me.

As an editor I am qualified to trim off the extraneous words. Here is my version of what I've read so far. Dedicated readers will note some familiar refrains:

Everything property I own is top ten. Maybe top one.
Everyone says everything I do is amazing.
I don't remember anyone's name or really know anyone.
Many people have told me if I ever decide to sell MAL or Turnberry, they would buy them for billions. Who? Rich people. I don't remember their names.
Banks beg me to take their money.
But now I prefer to pay cash. I have 400 mill in cash on hand.
The value of my properties is based on what I think at the time they will be worth in future years.
Property is like the Mona Lisa, which hangs on a wall. It has "glamor value."
Alan prepared the statements. I never read them, I just signed them.
Anyone who thought those statements were meaningful is a fool, because "worthless clause." (See the attached lengthy screen cap)


Screenshot 01 2023-08-31 at 6.55.25 AM.png

Screenshot 02 2023-08-31 at 7.06.42 AM.png

Screenshot 03 2023-08-31 at 7.07.14 AM.png

Screenshot 04 2023-08-31 at 7.13.43 AM.png

His lawyers and creditors will like to take a bite of this

[p0rtia]

It didn't come across in my shorthand notes, but the State did ask him if he has had banks asking to give him money "lately". He admitted not. (no kidding) The implication was clear that he was retconning the fact that the banks haven't wanted to business with him for almost a decade to "I prefer to use cash."

When asked when he would use banks, he gave a long answer mentioning "deals" he'd done in the 1990s and 2000s.

Another point: I think it is implied in the text that the agreement the State struck w fuckhead's lawyers was that he (fuckhead) would be allowed to give lengthy answers, i.e., to speak as much as he wanted. That at least explains why he is not interrupted in ANY of his one or two page rambling, off topic, content-less responses.

The opposing sides got real snippy at one point, when Kise made a couple of speaking objections, and even answered for fuckhead once. This morphed into a back and forth about the time allowed for the depo (7 hours), with the State complaining about fuckhead's "eight minute answers" and Kise responding (idiotically, if you read the transcript) that the problem was the the State's questions were poor and too vague.

Calling a big BS on that.

[jemcanada2]

After Allen Weisselberg went to jail after refusing to flip on tfg, tfg throws him under the bus? I’m shocked! Shocked, I tell you.

“Allen prepared the documents. I didn’t read them. I just signed them.”

In the real business world, the CEO/president is responsible.

In Trumplandia, Trump doesn’t “take responsibility at all.”

[johnpcapitalist]

The value of my properties is based on what I think at the time they will be worth in future years.

Depending on the exact wording and on the exact nature of the financial statements he submitted, he could have conceivably confessed right here. No wonder the government is letting him ramble in his answers.

Under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, you value properties at current market value when preparing financial statements, not what you think they'll be worth when you sell them. There are plenty of arcane rules about valuation in GAAP, but this is not one of them. It's pretty much common sense.

Of course, Trump is also continuing to throw Alan Wesselberg under the bus by saying it's all his fault. But if he signed the loan apps that declared that the statements were prepared under GAAP, then this statement could well come back to haunt him.

[p0rtia]

The value of my properties is based on what I think at the time they will be worth in future years.

Depending on the exact wording and on the exact nature of the financial statements he submitted, he could have conceivably confessed right here. No wonder the government is letting him ramble in his answers.

Under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, you value properties at current market value when preparing financial statements, not what you think they'll be worth when you sell them. There are plenty of arcane rules about valuation in GAAP, but this is not one of them. It's pretty much common sense.

Of course, Trump is also continuing to throw Alan Wesselberg under the bus by saying it's all his fault. But if he signed the loan apps that declared that the statements were prepared under GAAP, then this statement could well come back to haunt him.

Yes, I took it as an unintentional confession. He was trying to cover it by saying that his "worthless clause" made it all okay, but he said it outright several times, that he overvalued his properties based on what they would be worth at a later date, or because of what he called "glamour value." He brought up the ridiculous NFT's he made as an example of how things inflate in values; how a $99 NFT had sold (so he says) for 4,000... or 8,000... or 28,000. Just. Amazing. BS.

[much ado]

The value of my properties is based on what I think at the time they will be worth in future years.

Depending on the exact wording and on the exact nature of the financial statements he submitted, he could have conceivably confessed right here. No wonder the government is letting him ramble in his answers.

Under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles, you value properties at current market value when preparing financial statements, not what you think they'll be worth when you sell them. There are plenty of arcane rules about valuation in GAAP, but this is not one of them. It's pretty much common sense.

Of course, Trump is also continuing to throw Alan Wesselberg under the bus by saying it's all his fault. But if he signed the loan apps that declared that the statements were prepared under GAAP, then this statement could well come back to haunt him.

Yes, I took it as an unintentional confession. He was trying to cover it by saying that his "worthless clause" made it all okay, but he said it outright several times, that he overvalued his properties based on what they would be worth at a later date, or because of what he called "glamour value." He brought up the ridiculous NFT's he made as an example of how things inflate in values; how a $99 NFT had sold (so he says) for 4,000... or 8,000... or 28,000. Just. Amazing. BS.

He is so stupid and arrogant. He doesn't care about GAAP, because he thinks he doesn't have to. He almost certainly signed something that the valuations were prepared under GAAP, and then provides sworn testimony that they were not. He thinks he can blame Wesselberg, and that all he did was sign the documents. He really seems to have no idea how all this works.

He is about be educated. I think it will be painful for him. He will not believe that they can really do this to him. He will squawk without end, but no one will help him.