School related violence

[neeneko]

I dunno, but initial reports were that the shooter had a handgun and an AR15. Later, they said that he only had two AR15s. Speculation is that a child was shot with a handgun, which couldn't have been the suspect because he didn't actually have one, only the officers responding did. Dunno.

Well, there is always the moronic domain of the AR15 handguns.

[Volkonski]

This week there have been about half a dozen threats by Long Island students to shoot up their schools.

Students have been arrested but so far none of those arrested actually had guns.

[Volkonski]

[raison de arizona]

How can they live with themselves seeing this? How can they sentence more children to die this way?

FIRST ON FOX: “He said goodnight and he started shooting everybody.” 10 year old Khloie Torres was inside of the classroom with the gunman at Robb Elementary School. She tells us about the horrific moments when she saw 19 of her classmates and 2 her teachers be shot and killed.

Also, worst Twitter handle ever.

[Frater I*I]

How can they live with themselves seeing this? How can they sentence more children to die this way?

Power, that nut job base combined with that single issue voters gives them power.

No amount of lives sacrificed are too much to get to the brass ring of minority-majority rule absolute power that they seek...

[Volkonski]

[Atticus Finch]

If Trump wins in 2024, let's hope he has the police chief as head of his security detail in the White House.

[raison de arizona]

The handcuffed mom that jumped the fence and retrieved her children had law enforcement attempt to violate her probation for speaking out to the media. Because of course they did. I try to give law enforcement the benefit of the doubt, because it is undoubtedly a hard job, but they are really trying me. Glad the judge wasn't in their pocket. Fuckers.

wait wait wait, so the mom who ran fucking circles around a whole ass swat team to save her sons was threatened with a probation violation for talking to the media & dragged in front of a judge? thank god the judge saw sense, but who made this threat?

P.S. She is screwed. She has a target on her back now. The PD is undoubtedly going to make her life a living hell. She needs to move.

[Volkonski]

[raison de arizona]

0C438A9E-6F02-40D2-96B2-B7A78210AB6A.jpeg (138.11 KiB) Viewed 843 times

[Volkonski]

I understand the reason not to return to that school.

However they will need alternative school space by midAugust. Not going to be easy to find.

I suppose they could get portable buildings. Mrs. V was in a portable classroom for a couple of years.

Not sure how they would manage meals, toilets, etc.

Still, school districts manage somehow after tornadoes and hurricanes so it can be done.

[Slim Cognito]

Does FEMA have trailers suitable for classrooms? Years ago, Hubs drove for Star Suites, which provided dressing room trailers for movie locations. In addition to the dressing room trailers, they had trailers with multiple stalls for the crew to use.

[Volkonski]

Does FEMA have trailers suitable for classrooms? Years ago, Hubs drove for Star Suites, which provided dressing room trailers for movie locations. In addition to the dressing room trailers, they had trailers with multiple stalls for the crew to use.

Don't know about FEMA. Classroom size ones are commonly available since schools use them to handle overflow while school bond issues await approval. In this context they are less than ideal since the have flimsy locks and the doors open to the outdoors.

[Kendra]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/poor- ... 25436eba5a

The lack of direct and clear communication complicated the response to the mass shooting that left 19 fourth-graders and two teachers dead, said a U.S. official with knowledge of the investigation. For over an hour, law enforcement waited in a hallway, instructed not to rush into a classroom in which the gunman had barricaded himself, while children inside were calling 911 pleading for help.

Ultimately, 19 children and two teachers were shot to death in the classroom on May 24 before federal agents from a Border Patrol tactical team known as Bortac breached the doors and killed the shooter.

Exactly what happened with police radio transmissions is part of ongoing investigations by state and federal law enforcement, the U.S. official said.

Forrest Anderson, an emergency-management employee for Uvalde County who oversaw installation of the local police radio system nearly 20 years ago, said the low-frequency radios that are best for the terrain in the area don’t work well in buildings with thick walls and metal roofs like Robb Elementary School, where the shooting took place. Furthermore, the more people try to use the radios at the same time, the less likely they are to work well, he said.

Is this another shoe dropping, or more moving of the goal posts?

[sugar magnolia]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/poor- ... 25436eba5a

The lack of direct and clear communication complicated the response to the mass shooting that left 19 fourth-graders and two teachers dead, said a U.S. official with knowledge of the investigation. For over an hour, law enforcement waited in a hallway, instructed not to rush into a classroom in which the gunman had barricaded himself, while children inside were calling 911 pleading for help.

Ultimately, 19 children and two teachers were shot to death in the classroom on May 24 before federal agents from a Border Patrol tactical team known as Bortac breached the doors and killed the shooter.

Exactly what happened with police radio transmissions is part of ongoing investigations by state and federal law enforcement, the U.S. official said.

Forrest Anderson, an emergency-management employee for Uvalde County who oversaw installation of the local police radio system nearly 20 years ago, said the low-frequency radios that are best for the terrain in the area don’t work well in buildings with thick walls and metal roofs like Robb Elementary School, where the shooting took place. Furthermore, the more people try to use the radios at the same time, the less likely they are to work well, he said.

Is this another shoe dropping, or more moving of the goal posts?

That's a pretty standard issue even with depts on digital systems. Police radios here often don't work from inside the local Walmart or the hospitals. That being said, even 40 years ago on the dinky Highway Patrol channels I worked we had our regular low band frequency for comms between dispatch and the troopers, but we also had the statewide high band frequency that municipal, state, EMS, MEMA, any govermental agency, had access to. I worked dispatch an on-duty officer death one time and had ambulance, state, county and municipal LE units all on the same channel by switching to high band. I can't imagine that Uvalde doesn't also have that capability even if they aren't up and running on FirstNet yet. The fact that the channels were overloaded and depts weren't communicating with each other leads me to believe they were on low band the whole time.

The most unforgivable thing though is the fact that the incident commander showed up without a radio and didn't bother to commandeer one from another officer. If he was without a radio he should have immediately passed control of the situation to someone else. As any cop will tell you, their radio is their lifeline and is more important even than their weapon. I have no idea how Uvalde handles things (badly, apparently) but most depts won't let an officer on the street without radio communication with dispatch. Even foot beat officers have radios.

[Tiredretiredlawyer]

Sugar, I really appreciate your sharing your expertise in police matters. I didn't know I didn't know.

[keith]

Something else is bothering me.

The Police Chief got elected to Cit Council and sworn in.

Does that mean he is now illegally double dipping?

Or did he resign?

[Volkonski]

It was reported that the ISD police chief did have a cell phone. However our experience is that cell phones work poorly or not at all in big box stores and other larger buildings.

Mrs. V and I and other members of our family use location sharing on our cell phones. When Mrs. V goes to Costco or similar places she disappears. Last week I went to the ophthalmologist. When I was done I tried to call Mrs. V to pick me up but my phone wouldn't work. Tried to use location sharing to see where she was but all the people I share with showed as being offline. As this included several people in several states that was unlikely. My phone had to be the problem. The ophthalmologist's building totally blocked my cell phone signals.

[bill_g]

The chief and his radio are a topic of discussion on the PS boards as well. Uvalde is on GATRRS (Greater Austin/Travis Regional Radio System). See also GATRRS.org.

It's a mix of 150/700/800 channels in a Motorola P25 digital Public Safety network. Uvalde PD is part of the P25 phase 2 system, but it's hard to tell if they are operating in the 150 band (high band as Sugar calls it) or 700/800 band. Radio signals in any band hate obstructions of any kind no matter whether it's a building, trees, mountains, etc. The denser the object is, the worse the radio coverage is on the other side of it. Factor in man-made noise from electronics, lighting, motors, etc, and public safety radios operate in unfriendly territory most of the time. The system design has to account for that, or at least accept it.

Murphy's Law applies very strongly here. The radios never seem to work when the officers need them just like traffic is never light when you're in a hurry. I don't know if it's actual hardware failure, known coverage issues in a localized area, the tension of the moment, or all of the above. But, I've made my bread and butter for almost four decades trying to answer that question, and I haven't done it yet.

As for the chief's radio, I think this is a mountain / mole hill problem. Without knowing how he manages his team, my first impression is that sounds correct to me. He let's the scene commander run the show. Subordinates keep him informed. He's probably in or near the command vehicle. He's probably within earshot of a radio at all times multiplied by however many people with radios on their belts are near him. For him to not be packing a radio is no big deal to me.

OTOH, him withholding information, him delaying the breach, him threatening parents, and now him disappearing is a big deal.

[pipistrelle]

I understand the reason not to return to that school.

However they will need alternative school space by midAugust. Not going to be easy to find.

I suppose they could get portable buildings. Mrs. V was in a portable classroom for a couple of years.

Not sure how they would manage meals, toilets, etc.

Still, school districts manage somehow after tornadoes and hurricanes so it can be done.

It looks like a nice school with some old-growth trees — the kind of place kids should have left having good memories of. Now it's a nightmare.

[Volkonski]

[bill_g]

Compare the timeline to presidential elections. Shootings are higher under GOP leadership.

[raison de arizona]

DeVos first mentions Parkland, but then goes on to imply that Covid is the cause of school shootings?

Trump’s Secretary of Education, Betsy DeVos, suggested “the toll all of these shutdowns” played a role in the Uvalde school shooting.

[Suranis]

No no no not Covid, the SHUTDOWNS!

Even though... uh... she was a member of the cabinet that did shutdowns...

[pipistrelle]

More making stuff up based on nothing. I don't think the shooter's motivation or whatever has been determined.

There was this:

I have talked to a few people that have known him and went to school with him. I talked to some parents of students who went to school with him, but that's about as far as it's gone," Uvalde Mayor Don McLaughlin told Fox News' Bill Hemmer. "They just said that when COVID hit, he kind of dropped out of school and just kind of pulled back to himself."

But that doesn't mean anything without the full story, including that he was working until recently. So Betsy, stop speculating and zip it.