State of New York vs Trump, et al - the civil fraud case against the Trump Organization

[Flatpoint High]

Jason Johnson was in for Ari Melber on MSNBC today. LOL he had Eli Mystal (sp?) on to talk about the DA and tfg's claims about racial bias and LOL Eli went on a rant about yeah, there's bias against an orange guy and I can't recall the rest, but worth watching. Jason couldn't keep a straight face.

I had a difficult time keeping a straight face as well. and the clip from The Beat hasn't been posted yet.

[Kendra]

Jason Johnson was in for Ari Melber on MSNBC today. LOL he had Eli Mystal (sp?) on to talk about the DA and tfg's claims about racial bias and LOL Eli went on a rant about yeah, there's bias against an orange guy and I can't recall the rest, but worth watching. Jason couldn't keep a straight face.

I had a difficult time keeping a straight face as well. and the clip from The Beat hasn't been posted yet.

I was dying...

Anyone sees the clip, please post here.

[Phoenix520]

Bob said:

But this particular phrasology does not appear to be in vernacular of many Earthlings.

Still cracking me up bob

[chancery]

Was the pile steaming?

In fairness to Trump's lawyers, New York courts have the strange (to me) practice of requiring as an attachment to every motion copies of the case pleadings (complaint, answer, etc.), as well as copies of prior motion papers, all of which are already on file in the docket. In a big case, copies of the original complaint might end up being refiled scores or even hundreds of times.

The custom arose at a time when it was time-consuming for judges' staff to retrieve papers from the central file, so having what amounted to a convenience copy of the contents of the court file attached to motions made things easier for the staff.

This practice should largely be obsolete with the advent of electronic filing, but the rules haven't fully caught up. Most of the bulk in Trump's application consisted of copies of previously filed papers, and hearing transcripts.

The brief and supporting affidavit might or might not be steaming, but I just barely skimmed them, so I couldn't tell you.

[Sam the Centipede]

Many thanks Chancery for looking it up and untangling the "he did she did" trail. It's good to see that Judge Engoron is on the ball.

It's interesting to get these softer insights into the workings of the judicial system as well as the drier "the rules/statutes/precedence says …" analysis.

[RTH10260]

Former Trump Org exec testified he accounted for multi-million dollar mansions not yet built when valuing a company at the request of Eric Trump
Hannah Getahun
Sat, October 7, 2023 at 8:04 AM GMT+2·2 min read

• Jeffrey McConney, a former Trump Organization controller, testified at Trump's fraud trial.
  He said Eric Trump directed him to account for unbuilt mansions to inflate the value of a property.
  McConney detailed other methods he used to make Trump properties appear more valuable.

A former Trump Organization controller testified that Eric Trump asked him to take into account homes not yet built by the company in order to inflate Trump's property values.

Jeffrey McConney, who took the stand Friday on the fifth day of former President Donald Trump's New York fraud trial, told the courtroom some of the properties he misrepresented were the same ones ruled fraudulent by state Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron in September, according to CNN.

"You have treated, for the purposes of this valuation, a profit of $23 million per home as if it were realized immediately?" Amer asked, per ABC News.

"Correct," McConney said on the stand.

McConney, questioned by the NY Attorney General's special counsel Andrew Amer, testified that when valuing Trump's Seven Springs development in Westchester County, New York, in 2011, seven mansions not yet built at the property were added to the calculations. McConney said he did this after a phone conversation with Eric Trump, who now serves as Executive Vice President for the Trump Organization.




https://www.yahoo.com/news/former-trump ... 07908.html
(original: INSIDER)

[Suranis]

Wow, thats suspiciously similar to what Enron did. They added the projected future profit of a contract to the profit of the company for the year, using mark to mark accounting.

[Sam the Centipede]

I'm no lawyer or accountant but McConney's actions don't look entirely proper. They seem almost … what's that word? … fraudulent.

Shame it's only a civil trial. Oh well, there are more long years of court appearances in prospect for the Trumpfia and its Dons about their scammo di tutti scammi.

[Tiredretiredlawyer]

“scammo di tutti scammo”

[realist]

“scammo di tutti scammo”

[p0rtia]

Alan Klasfed is doing yoeman's work today. Ridiculous that this is not being broadcast.

Read to the end for the date.

Screenshot 2023-10-10 at 10.52.30 AM.png (77.75 KiB) Viewed 1611 times

[Kendra]

Thanks portia!!

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1711 ... 25204.html

"All rise."

Justice Engoron presiding.

The government expects Allen Weisselberg's testimony will stretch the full day.
Michael Cohen's testimony is now anticipated to begin on Tuesday.
Justice Engoron to the lawyers: "I think we have some photographers who want to come and in take pictures. So look your best."

[northland10]

Alan Klasfed is doing yoeman's work today. Ridiculous that this is not being broadcast.

Not being broadcast will become more and more of a thing. TV/Cable news watchers are a shrinking demographic, and most of those who do are my age or older.

[p0rtia]

Alan Klasfed is doing yoeman's work today. Ridiculous that this is not being broadcast.

Not being broadcast will become more and more of a thing. TV/Cable news watchers are a shrinking demographic, and most of those who do are my age or older.

Agreed. However, I was using broadcast to try to include all means of dissemination. Bad choice of words.

[northland10]

Alan Klasfed is doing yoeman's work today. Ridiculous that this is not being broadcast.

Not being broadcast will become more and more of a thing. TV/Cable news watchers are a shrinking demographic, and most of those who do are my age or older.

Agreed. However, I was using broadcast to try to include all means of dissemination. Bad choice of words.

Understood. I probably just used your post as a moment to mention something on the shrinking TV demographic. Lazy responding by me.

[Kendra]

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1712 ... 85459.html

Adam is on it for us.

Testimony turns to "Covenants" on the bank's credit report on the loan.

Q: Were these covenants relevant to your decision to approve the loan?
A: Yes.

The first line obligated the Guarantor to provide annual financial statements.
Big:

One of the covenants in Deutsche's credit report for the 2011 loan stated: "Guarantor shall maintain a minimum net worth of $2.5 billion[...]."

NYAG says Trump's net worth that year was $1.6 billion.

[chancery]

https://twitter.com/frankrunyeon/status ... 7417655748

Frank G. Runyeon
@frankrunyeon

First thing, Judge clarifies a Q: "We’re having a nonjury trial because this is a nonjury case. "

AG "clearly checked off nonjury and there was no motion for a jury," Justice Engoron says. And "it would not have helped to make a motion. No one forget to check a box.”

Some thoughts.

(i) It's evident that the heat was getting to Alina Haba. The fact that Judge Engoron agreed to throw her a lifeline is consistent with the impression he's given of being a good egg.

(ii) I can't decide whether or not it was dweebish of Haba to make the request for a lifeline. It seems lame, but sometimes you have do do things in a litigation that aren't dignified but you do them anyway.

(iii) Judge Engoron is completely correct that there's no right to a jury trial for Count 1 of Executive Law § 63(12). However, it seems possible that Trump could have argued for a right to jury under the Seventh Amendment as to some aspects state's claim for damages under § 63(12). See viewtopic.php?p=213946#p213946 It would have been a distracting sideshow, including immediate appeals.

In the event that Engoron had been persuaded that some issues did need to be decided by a jury, it would have created a right clusterburach, with the possibility that the jury might make factual findings that were inconsistent with the judge's fact finding. IIRC, courts sometimes use this sort of consideration to deny the right to incidental damages issues that are entwined with clearly non-jury issues in a complicated statutory proceeding. But the analysis can be tricky.

This is the kind of hand grenade that a well-funded defendant with good lawyers will often lob into the middle of a proceeding that's dangerous to their clients, in the hopes of creating delay, immense confusion, and the real possibility that the judge under pressure might make a big mistake.

Delay and confusion would generally help Trump, so I'm surprised that his lawyers didn't try it. All I can think is that lawyers capable of handling a tricky issue like that in a constructive* fashion might be in short supply on his team, and they have more pressing tasks on their plates.

_____
* Constructive for Trump, destructive to orderly procedure.

[raison de arizona]

Today was the seventh day of our trial against Donald Trump and the Trump Organization.

For years, Trump evaded justice for his repeated fraud, and as we continue to present our case, we will show just how much he unfairly benefited.

[chancery]

https://twitter.com/KlasfeldReports/sta ... 254612469

Adam Klasfeld
@KlasfeldReports
That's because, under New York law and precedent, a request for the disgorgement of "ill-gotten gains" is equitable relief, rather than money damages.

This came up toward the start of trial and has been more clearly settled in the second week.

Sure, seems reasonable; it's not damages in the sense of an injury suffered by a party to the litigation. But even if there's a line of NY cases so holding, I would be surprised if it had ever been the subject of a well-financed analysis. The right to a jury trial is ultimately a question under the Seventh Amendment, and a biglaw firm worth its salt could make a run at it, with a couple of affidavits from legal historians about procedure in England and in the colonies. It would be expensive to do it right, and I'm not saying it would end up going anywhere, but it's the kind of thing one does when mounting an aggressive, full-court defense.

[Volkonski]

Ex-Trump Organization CFO Allen Weisselberg’s Testimony Abruptly Ended After Forbes Story Accused Him of Perjury
A source close to New York Attorney General Letitia James confirmed that her office is looking into the latest report about the former Trump CFO's testimony

https://themessenger.com/politics/allen ... es-perjury

The Trump Organization’s former chief financial officer Allen Weisselberg’s testimony reached an abrupt and unexpected end on Thursday afternoon, just hours after Forbes magazine accused the convicted tax cheat of perjuring himself during an earlier stint as a witness.

Weisselberg insisted on Tuesday from the witness stand that he “never focused” on calculating the square footage of the former president’s Trump Tower triplex, a three-floor penthouse in his namesake skyscraper.

Two days later, on Thursday, Forbes reported that emails not currently in the attorney general’s possession show otherwise.

A source close to New York Attorney General Letitia James confirmed that her office is looking into the latest Forbes report.

Hours after the publication of that story, Manhattan Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron convened a sidebar with attorneys for the state and defense, but the subject of their private huddle remains unknown. Weisselberg was excused for the day shortly after that conversation, as attorneys for both sides reserved the right to call him back.

[Sam the Centipede]

That's not good for Weisselberg, is it?

It seems reasonable to assume that Forbes doesn't make statements like that without serious evidential backup. Thay haz lawyaz.

So is Weisselberg stoat toast?

Fire up the barbie, grab a sesame bun, some piquant relish, and flame grill a weasel-burger!

[Foggy]

"Oh, he's an old man, he's already been to jail!"

You know what they say about poor people who have already been in jail once?

They didn't learn their lesson. They need a longer sentence the second time around.

[p0rtia]

Fuckhead made a big, big mistake when he attacked Forbes about the stupid 400 list. They've been going after him ever since.

[RTH10260]

re Weisselbergs testimony:
According to MTN Michael Popok reporting, Weisselberg was not keen answering straight forward questions by the prosecuting lawyer. The lawyer picked up a document and quoted from the separation deal with the T-org. He is receiving in monthly installments a separation sum valued at $1+ million, exactly the amount of his fine in the criminal trial. Conditioned that he not divulge details (volountary). For the court record Weisselberg was asked to confirm the quotes.

[Volkonski]

Michael Cohen health issue delays court showdown with Trump
Cohen had been expected to testify next week in a civil fraud case against Trump, who was planning to attend to hear testimony from his former attorney.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald ... rcna120405

Former Trump lawyer Michael Cohen will not testify next week in the $250 million civil fraud case against the former president because of a health-related issue, two sources confirmed to NBC News on Friday.

It was not immediately clear how long Cohen’s testimony would be delayed.

"Unfortunately I need to attend to a pre-existing medical condition that impedes my ability to testify this upcoming week. Rest assured, I will testify at the earliest opportunity," he told NBC in a statement Saturday.