Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

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pipistrelle
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1301

Post by pipistrelle » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:15 am

I still think what the Bundys are worried about is what plagued English gentry. When you have a lot of children (sons for the English), you can't leave all of them land. That quarter section postage stamp isn't going to do the Bundy boys any good. Cliven wants to divvy up the state of Nevada among the boys. At least that's my theory. :roll:

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1302

Post by RVInit » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:18 am

Nobody is going to buy desert because there is not much of a chance of making money by purchasing desert. It has great value environmentally and no commercial value. So, if it's purchased by anyone they would have to convert it into something else. Florida converted a great deal of it's very unique dry communities, scrub, into citrus groves and housing. I don't recommend Nevada to do the same, but we are no longer in an era where our government is interested in protecting our natural resources, or even willing to try to understand why that desert community is a vital natural resource. So, yeah, selling/converting it is probably absolutely on the table.
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pipistrelle
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1303

Post by pipistrelle » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:24 am

RVInit wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:18 am
Nobody is going to buy desert because there is not much of a chance of making money by purchasing desert. It has great value environmentally and no commercial value. So, if it's purchased by anyone they would have to convert it into something else. Florida converted a great deal of it's very unique dry communities, scrub, into citrus groves and housing. I don't recommend Nevada to do the same, but we are no longer in an era where our government is interested in protecting our natural resources, or even willing to try to understand why that desert community is a vital natural resource. So, yeah, selling/converting it is probably absolutely on the table.
You forget all the URANIUM that's on Cliven's postage stamp that Clinton so desperately wanted to personally hand to Putin.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1304

Post by RVInit » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:26 am

:lol:
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neeneko
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1305

Post by neeneko » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:30 am

pipistrelle wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:15 am
I still think what the Bundys are worried about is what plagued English gentry. When you have a lot of children (sons for the English), you can't leave all of them land. That quarter section postage stamp isn't going to do the Bundy boys any good. Cliven wants to divvy up the state of Nevada among the boys. At least that's my theory. :roll:
Well, at least cRyan was trying to stake a claim in Malheur, so I would not be surprised if 'I am personally out of land, so we need more land to give the children' is a major factor in there.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1306

Post by NMgirl » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:16 am

Cloven's melon patch is in a trust. I hope it is a generation-skipping trust, in which case the 160 acres of desert will be divided into 64 tiny bits and pieces. Each grandchild will profit enormously, receiving one melon per year as his or her share. :)

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1307

Post by Jerry Mander » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:38 pm

NMgirl wrote:
Wed Jan 10, 2018 6:23 pm
LVMPD reacts to Cloven's spewings:
LVMPD‏Verified account

The #LVMPD and @Sheriff_LVMPD respect the federal court’s decision in the Cliven Bundy case. Mr. Bundy has his own beliefs and has the right to express his opinion. The LVMPD will continue to follow the law and has no further comment on this case.
That’s the money quote for me.

When (real) journalist Vanessa Murphy pointed out to cRyan that his legal theories were not facts but opinions, he angrily told her to ‘Do your research, girl’. It’s on her twitter feed. CRyan is an arrogant, sexist asshole in addition to being a domestic terrorist.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1308

Post by NMgirl » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:40 pm

The Sltrib tears a strip off prosecutors, with a side scratch at the Bundy Crime Syndicate:
Cliven Bundy is Right: We're Not Done with This.
https://www.sltrib.com/opinion/editoria ... with-this/

I sometimes wonder how Ex-Mumpoot spouse, Michelle Quist, judges the Bundy standoffs. She is on the editorial staff at the Sltrib.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1309

Post by Flatpointhigh » Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:47 pm

pipistrelle wrote:
Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:15 am
I still think what the Bundys are worried about is what plagued English gentry. When you have a lot of children (sons for the English), you can't leave all of them land. That quarter section postage stamp isn't going to do the Bundy boys any good. Cliven wants to divvy up the state of Nevada among the boys. At least that's my theory. :roll:
I thought you were talking about the Enclosure Laws. :-

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1310

Post by NMgirl » Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:53 am

Maxine Bernstein:
BLM made serious mistake with show of force at Nevada standoff, retired agency officials say

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-stando ... _with.html

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1311

Post by NMgirl » Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:12 pm

JFC.
Congress expected to hold hearings on dismissal of Bundy case
https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/bund ... undy-case/

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1312

Post by pipistrelle » Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:18 pm

I have no words for Zinke. I gave him a fair chance, and he blew it out of the gate and continues to lower the bar. His fellow hunters feel the same way.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1313

Post by Flatpointhigh » Mon Jan 15, 2018 10:39 pm

pipistrelle wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:18 pm
I have no words for Zinke. I gave him a fair chance, and he blew it out of the gate and continues to lower the bar. His fellow hunters feel the same way.
he's a student of the former President of BTA Bank/Khazakstan who set up companies with no other purpose but to make himself money.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1314

Post by realist » Tue Jan 23, 2018 3:42 pm

Maxine updated her article on the mistrial with the full transcript of Judge Navarro's stinging rebuke of the prosecution.
Cliven Bundy standoff case thrown out in another stunning blow to government

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-stando ... e_thr.html
Document: Transcript of Judge's ruling: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents ... uling.html
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1315

Post by NMgirl » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:20 pm

I didn't see this one coming, that's for sure. Government asks Gloria to reconsider dismissal with prejudice. I'll try to post the document, but it's long.
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
DISTRICT OF NEVADA
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA,
Plaintiff,
v.

CLIVEN D. BUNDY,
RYAN C. BUNDY,
AMMON E. BUNDY, and
RYAN W. PAYNE,
Defendants.
2:16-CR-46-GMN-PAL
GOVERNMENT’S MOTION TO
RECONSIDER ORDERS DISMISSING
INDICTMENT WITH PREJUDICE

[ECF Nos. 3116, 3117, 3122]

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1316

Post by Jerry Mander » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:25 pm

Just in from JJ McNabb’s twitter:

The DOJ has asked the federal judge to reconsider her dismissal with prejudice of the Cliven Bundy Nevada criminal case:

Link to document here:

http://t.co/ru5ZSIXcWM

:smoking:

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1317

Post by NMgirl » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:48 pm

:?: I need some help with this filing. Is it at all likely that Judge Navarro would reverse her own ruling? Is this Motion to Reconsider therefore a necessary stepping stone to a 9th Circuit hearing on the matter :?: I've presented my question very poorly, but if any IAALs have thoughts/answers, I would be obliged. :bighug:

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1318

Post by Whip » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:52 pm

NMgirl wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:48 pm
:?: I need some help with this filing. Is it at all likely that Judge Navarro would reverse her own ruling? Is this Motion to Reconsider therefore a necessary stepping stone to a 9th Circuit hearing on the matter :?: I've presented my question very poorly, but if any IAALs have thoughts/answers, I would be obliged. :bighug:
can't speak to the motion but, at a minimum, it will get the poots tweaking.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1319

Post by bob » Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:13 pm

NMgirl wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:48 pm
Is it at all likely that Judge Navarro would reverse her own ruling? Is this Motion to Reconsider therefore a necessary stepping stone to a 9th Circuit hearing on the matter :?:
Possible but not probable that Navarro will reconsider (in the government's favor). Not strictly necessary for an appeal, but helpful in laying some groundwork.
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1320

Post by neeneko » Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:59 pm

bob wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:13 pm
Possible but not probable that Navarro will reconsider (in the government's favor). Not strictly necessary for an appeal, but helpful in laying some groundwork.
I was under the impression that such a dismissal could not be appealed, no?
(edited to add) ah, the document helpfully includes an example of just such a reversal.

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1321

Post by bob » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:07 pm

neeneko wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:59 pm
I was under the impression that such a dismissal could not be appealed, no?
The government can and sometimes does appeal case-ending rulings.

Having said that, and if the government does appeal, I fully expect from the Bundy side some sort of creative Double Jeopardy argument.
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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1322

Post by Dan1100 » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:11 pm

bob wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:07 pm
neeneko wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:59 pm
I was under the impression that such a dismissal could not be appealed, no?
The government can and sometimes does appeal case-ending rulings.

Having said that, and if the government does appeal, I fully expect from the Bundy side some sort of creative Double Jeopardy argument.
IIRC, an acquittal (either from the judge or jury) which finds there wasn't enough evidence to support a conviction cannot be appealed (i.e. a finding of "not guilty"). In this case, there was never a finding of "not guilty", but instead, their was a mistrial because of discovery violations and then a finding by the court that things were so screwed up that the defendants couldn't get a fair trial. That can be appealed.
"Devin Nunes is having a cow over this."

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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1323

Post by neeneko » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:27 pm

bob wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:07 pm
Having said that, and if the government does appeal, I fully expect from the Bundy side some sort of creative Double Jeopardy argument.
Huh.

Just went back and read the transcript from the dismissal, and Navarro directly addressed a claim of double jeopardy, so I guess a counter to that is already in place.

While I doubt this will go anywhere, I am picturing the poot drama if the dismissal is reversed, and it is entertaining, esp if it involves putting them back in jail for the trail.


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Re: Bundy Ranch Trial #2--The Big One: Cliven, Ammon, cRyan, Ryan Payne, Pete Santilli

#1325

Post by realist » Thu Feb 08, 2018 8:21 am

NMgirl wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2018 11:00 pm
Max is on it, as always.

http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-stando ... judge.html
From the link above:
Also Wednesday, federal prosecutors asked the judge to cancel the scheduled Feb. 26 trial for remaining defendants Mel Bundy, David Bundy, Joseph O'Shaughnessy and Jason Woods, and dismiss their case with prejudice, in light of the dismissal of the case against the lead defendants and the government's request that the judge reconsider that ruling.
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