Military Guarding Mexico border

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RTH10260
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#351

Post by RTH10260 » Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:22 pm

Addie wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 2:51 pm
WaPo
Pentagon set to expand military role along southern border

:snippity: Senior Defense Department officials have recommended that acting defense secretary Patrick Shanahan approve a new request from the Department of Homeland Security to provide military lawyers, cooks and drivers to assist with handling a surge of migrants along the southern border.

The move would require authorizing waivers for about 300 troops to a long-standing policy prohibiting military personnel from coming into contact with migrants.
:snippity:
As an outsider I don't see anything wrong that the military would provide drivers and possibly busses (not trucks) to transport immigrants to CPB camps, or between. Neither do I see anything speaking against the military providing kitchen facilities and cooking for immigrants under control of the CBP. Though I remember in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars they themselves outsourced at the base camps the Food&Beeverage functions to contractors.

On the other hand I cannot see that transfering a handful of military judges trained in military code and procedures will bring anything. They need a retraining in civil code and procedures and in a speciality of administrative law. I don't expect that the military justice system is overstaffed, so the military itself will suddenly find itself with a shortage of specialists.There is also a psychological aspect speaking against military judges: migrants coming from military dictatorships or nations where the military has strong influence on government may not believe in the impartiality of US courts.
PS. does the militar have extra finance provisions to pay for civilian clothing of military judges at civilian courts?

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#352

Post by Addie » Sat May 11, 2019 2:18 pm

Reuters
Acting U.S. defense chief in Texas as Pentagon eyes longer-term support on Mexico border

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Acting Defense Secretary Patrick Shanahan made his second trip to the U.S.-Mexico border on Saturday as the Pentagon looks to develop a longer-term plan to support President Donald Trump’s immigration policies.

Shanahan traveled to McAllen, Texas, to meet with officials on the border and visit a migrant processing facility and Border Patrol station, two days after the White House announced Trump’s intention to nominate the former Boeing Co executive as defense secretary.

He was accompanied by another acting secretary, Kevin McAleenan, who leads the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) after a shake-up instigated by Trump, whose hard-line immigration policies have not stemmed a rising tide of migrants.

On Friday, the Pentagon said Shanahan approved the transfer of $1.5 billion to build more than 80 miles (130 km) of barriers on the border with Mexico, part of a patchwork project as Trump has failed to secure funding from Congress for a complete border wall.

Trump has been eager to have the U.S. military play a larger role on the U.S.-Mexico border and, despite some criticism from lawmakers, Pentagon officials say they are looking to create a long-term plan for assistance.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#353

Post by Addie » Sun May 12, 2019 5:49 pm

Slate
Report: Missile System and Surveillance Plane Funding Will Go Towards the Border Wall ...

Acting Defense Secretary Patrick Shanahan told Congress on Friday that the Pentagon would be reprogramming money previously allotted for the war in Afghanistan and other military projects to help construct 80 miles of border barriers. Apart from this $1.5 billion, the Pentagon has also pledged $1 billion from Army personnel funds and $3.6 billion from other military construction projects to assist with border wall construction.

Shanahan said that the shift in funding would not affect the military’s readiness but did not specify the particular projects from which the Pentagon would be drawing the money. However, Washington Post reports that, based on internal documents, the department plans to delay an upgrade for its Minuteman II ballistic missile program, which is decades old. The Air Force has been testing a Minuteman III program in order to replace the nuclear intercontinental Minuteman II missiles.

The Pentagon also plans to delay an unspecified development in the Airborne Warning and Control System (AWACS). AWACS planes conduct surveillance and communicate with fighter planes. The Post notes that the Pentagon terminated a $76 million contract with Boeing due to development delays late in 2018.

The department will be shifting additionally funds from a “space test experiment” run by the Defense Advanced Projects Research Agency (DARPA), the Blended Retirement System for servicemembers, and “Overseas Contingency Operations” funds to assist coalition forces and the Afghan military.

The documents obtained by the Post do not specify the amount of money coming from each program, though the AP reported that $604 million would be coming from the Afghan Security Forces Fund, $251 million from a project to destroy chemical munitions, $344 million from miscellaneous Air Force programs, $244 million from a military retirement system, and $78 million from a fund for military coalition partners.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#354

Post by fierceredpanda » Mon May 13, 2019 7:05 am

The strategic missile program delays interest me less. ICBMs are really of very limited utility, and upgrades to the Minuteman III can wait. But the AWACS "developments" - and one really must assume that means a successor to the E-3, which is built around an outdated Boeing 707 airliner, and is probably much in need of replacement - are alarming. Good airborne radar coverage is essential to maintaining air superiority if we ever have an actual armed conflict with an adversary state who has an air force. That's a lot more important than missiles sitting in underground silos that every sane person on Earth hopes and prays never have to be used.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#355

Post by pipistrelle » Mon May 13, 2019 7:26 am

What concerns me is a large number of people employed in government pandering to whatever visions from movies and TV Miller is instilling into Individual-1's head so that they are output as terrible policies that risk national security for the sake of the self-stroking of ego through an endless series of tweets. DoD needs a leader, not a sycophant.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#356

Post by fierceredpanda » Mon May 13, 2019 7:50 am

pipistrelle wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 7:26 am
DoD needs a leader, not a sycophant.
True that, but therein lies the problem with civilian control of the military.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#357

Post by Gregg » Tue May 14, 2019 1:51 am

fierceredpanda wrote:
Mon May 13, 2019 7:05 am
The strategic missile program delays interest me less. ICBMs are really of very limited utility, and upgrades to the Minuteman III can wait. But the AWACS "developments" - and one really must assume that means a successor to the E-3, which is built around an outdated Boeing 707 airliner, and is probably much in need of replacement - are alarming. Good airborne radar coverage is essential to maintaining air superiority if we ever have an actual armed conflict with an adversary state who has an air force. That's a lot more important than missiles sitting in underground silos that every sane person on Earth hopes and prays never have to be used.
I'd mostly agree, except making it known that we're not updating ICBMs it could be argued makes the possibility of either a pre-emptive strike on them, or threat of being blackmailed to do so, greater. Sure, I doubt anyone's gonna fire the things, but you have to think Putin loves them being more vulnerable, and us announcing that they are, just to remove any doubts.

I'm telling ya, he's a stable genius.

I'm a lot pissed off about cutting what are where the pensions come from, the money we're spend to protect the troops we have in active war theaters and yeah, the money for allies, too. On that, a good deal of what we spend on allies comes back in orders for hardware. Foreign Military Aid has a pretty big jobs program built into it.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#358

Post by fierceredpanda » Tue May 14, 2019 7:59 am

Eh, given the very real concerns about the efficacy of Russia's ICBM arsenal, which is still heavily reliant on SS-18s and SS-19s that are every bit as old as our Minuteman II and IIIs, I'm still not particularly worried about a sudden lack of a serious deterrent. Truth be told, our land-based ICBMs are almost redundant given the accuracy of the Trident II submarine-launched missiles. Literally everyone knows where our Minuteman silos are. You can literally look on Wikipedia and find GPS coordinates for silos and launch control centers, not to mention looking at Google Earth and seeing the great big concrete slab in a fenced-off area surrounded by farms. US ballistic missile subs, on the other hand, could be basically anywhere, and the circular error probable on the Tridents is so small as to be negligible. And if that's not surgical enough, you could send in a B-2 bomber loaded with B-83 nuclear gravity bombs.

tl;dr: I'm not worried about our nuclear deterrent.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#359

Post by Volkonski » Wed May 15, 2019 8:15 am

And now the TSA.
CNN Breaking News

Verified account

@cnnbrk
3h3 hours ago
More
The Transportation Security Administration plans to send hundreds of officials to help with efforts to deal with migrant inflows on the southern border just as the busy summer travel season begins, according to an internal email obtained by CNN
https://www.cnn.com/2019/05/15/politics ... index.html
The task of the TSA workers, which a source said will include air marshals, will be to assist temporarily with immigration duties. TSA acknowledged in an internal email the "immediate need" comes with the acceptance of "some risk" of depleted resources in aviation security.

TSA plans for the deployments to involve up to 175 law enforcement officials and as many as "400 people from Security Ops," according to two sources and the email. At least initially, the efforts will not involve uniformed airport screeners, according to the email, which says that some parts of TSA would be asked to contribute "around 10%" of its workforce.

"There is now immediate need for more help from TSA at the SW border," a senior TSA official, Gary Renfrow, wrote in the email to agency regional management. "TSA has committed to support with 400 people from Security Ops" who will be deployed in waves "similar to support for past hurricanes."

"We also understand that we are accepting some risk as we enter a very busy summer," Renfrow wrote, calling this effort an "additional challenge."
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#360

Post by RTH10260 » Wed May 15, 2019 9:01 am

My best guess is that the TSA agents will be handling a lot of paperwork for the CBP cause they are not otherwise qualified on immigration.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#361

Post by fierceredpanda » Wed May 15, 2019 9:05 am

RTH10260 wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 9:01 am
My best guess is that the TSA agents will be handling a lot of paperwork for the CBP cause they are not otherwise qualified on immigration.
Given their failure rates in routine drills at airports, they're not really qualified to do airport security screens either.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#362

Post by Addie » Sat May 25, 2019 11:56 am

Slate - Elizabeth Goitein
Trump Is Considering Deputizing the Military as a Civilian Police Force. That Is Terrifying.

The Donald Trump presidency, marked by cruelty, corruption, and disdain for the rule of law, has been disastrous for our democracy. If there is one silver lining, it is this: Trump’s abuses have exposed weaknesses in our laws and institutions that were previously hidden and which we can now begin to try to fix. We learned about one such weakness in February, when Trump relied on the National Emergencies Act to commandeer funding Congress had specifically denied for the construction of a border wall. The latest such legal loophole is another emergency power that could enable the president to turn the military into his own immigration police force.

According to a report in the Daily Caller last week, the Trump administration is considering invoking the Insurrection Act to give federal troops the power to detain and remove undocumented immigrants in the United States, acting essentially as Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents. The White House, when asked about the option last week, refused to rule it out. ...

The Insurrection Act is an exception to the general rule, enshrined in the Posse Comitatus Act, that presidents may not use the military as a domestic police force. Posse comitatus, in the words of one former Defense Department official, reflects “one of the clearest political traditions in Anglo-American history: that using military power to enforce the civilian law is harmful to both civilian and military interests.” Deploying soldiers as police officers not only violates democratic sensibilities; it increases the risk that interactions with civilians could go disastrously wrong, as armed forces are not trained in conducting law enforcement activities. On the flip side, every soldier engaged in law enforcement is being pulled away from military priorities.

Despite this strong tradition, there are times when the law permits domestic use of the military. The Insurrection Act allows the president to deploy federal troops to suppress domestic uprisings and enforce the law when civilian law enforcement is impeded or overwhelmed. As its name suggests, Congress intended the law to be used only in the most extraordinary situations, and only where absolutely necessary to preserve civil order. For the most part, presidents have honored this intent. The law has not been invoked since 1992, when George H.W. Bush used it to help suppress riots in Los Angeles following the acquittal of police officers for the brutal beating of Rodney King.

It should go without saying that the presence of undocumented immigrants within the United States does not justify invocation of this potent emergency power. There is no uprising taking place, no breakdown of civil order. For better or for worse, immigration officers are fully capable of carrying out deportations—indeed, they are doing so at record-setting rates.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#363

Post by tek » Sat May 25, 2019 3:25 pm

This idea has Miller's fingerprints (and possibly something else of his) all over it.
There's no way back
from there to here

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#364

Post by RTH10260 » Sat May 25, 2019 4:58 pm

At first glance sounds to me as going down the drain at record speed when challenged in court. ACLU will already prepare for the emergency. Miller would think raising a middle finger an uprising in itself...

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#365

Post by Gregg » Sun May 26, 2019 3:38 am

tek wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 3:25 pm
This idea has Miller's fingerprints (and possibly something else of his) all over it.
He probably left some DNA on it as he was reading it. :toxic: :toxic: :yankyank: :toxic: :toxic:
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#366

Post by Addie » Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:01 pm

Associated Press
Official: Soldiers died by suicide at Arizona-Mexico border

TUCSON, Ariz. (AP) — A medical examiner says two soldiers helping secure the Mexico border in Arizona died by suicide.

Pima County Chief Medical Examiner Dr. Greg Hess said Thursday the soldiers died of self-inflicted gunshot wounds.

Officials say 20-year-old Pfc. Steven Hodges of Menifee, California, died June 1 near Nogales, and 21-year-old Pfc. Kevin Christian of Haslet, Texas, died Sunday in Ajo, about 200 miles (320 kilometers) from Nogales.

Both soldiers were assigned to the Southwest Border Support Mission.

Military officials say the circumstances of the deaths are under investigation.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#367

Post by Addie » Thu Jul 18, 2019 9:46 am

Politico: 2,100 more troops headed to the U.S.-Mexico border, Pentagon says

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#368

Post by Addie » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:07 pm

NBC News: Active-duty U.S. troops are now just feet away from migrants in Texas

The troops "monitor" migrants at a Texas facility. One congressman said they shouldn't be prison guards, and are close to breaking the posse comitatus law.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#369

Post by RTH10260 » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:16 pm

Addie wrote:
Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:07 pm
NBC News: Active-duty U.S. troops are now just feet away from migrants in Texas

The troops "monitor" migrants at a Texas facility. One congressman said they shouldn't be prison guards, and are close to breaking the posse comitatus law.
"It's not the role of the U.S. military to be a prison guard," he said. "This is certainly mission creep" and could put U.S. military service members "in a precarious legal situation."
Hmmm - does someone need to send a message about Nurnberg trials on the result of "I was just following orders" to those troops ?

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#370

Post by Gregg » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:43 pm

The Officers at the very least.
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#371

Post by Addie » Fri Jul 26, 2019 8:47 pm

WaPo
Supreme Court says Trump can proceed with plan to spend military funds for border wall construction


The Supreme Court Friday night on a 5 to 4 vote revived the Trump administration’s plan to use $2.5 billion in Pentagon funds to build part of the wall project along the southern border. The court’s conservatives set aside a U.S. Court of Appeals for the 9th Circuit ruling for the Sierra Club and a coalition of border communities that said a reallocation of the Defense Department money would violate federal law. The unsigned ruling by the Supreme Court said the government “made a sufficient showing at this stage” the groups did not have proper standing to challenge transfer of money.

In a 2-to-1 decision earlier this month, the 9th Circuit majority noted that a stalemate between Congress and President Trump over the issue prompted the longest government shutdown in history. The judges reasoned that Congress made its intentions clear by allocating only about $1.4 billion for enhanced border protection. The lower court said the public interest was “best served by respecting the Constitution’s assignment of the power of the purse to Congress, and by deferring to Congress’s understanding of the public interest as reflected in its repeated denial of more funding for border barrier construction.” After Congress’s decision earlier this year, Trump announced plans to use more than $6 billion allocated for other purposes to fund the wall, which was the signature promise of his presidential campaign. Environmentalists and the Southern Border Communities Coalition immediately filed suit to block the transfer of funds. Democrats in the House of Representatives filed a brief supporting them.

U.S. Solicitor General Noel Francisco told the Supreme Court that the 9th Circuit ruling was wrong. “The sole basis for the injunction — that the Acting Secretary exceeded his statutory authority in transferring the funds — rests on a misreading of the statutory text,” Francisco wrote. He was referring to Patrick M. Shanahan, who was acting secretary at the time. Francisco said that the challengers did not have proper legal standing to challenge the transfer of funds. He added that even if they did, their “interests in hiking, birdwatching, and fishing in designated drug-smuggling corridors do not outweigh the harm to the public from halting the government’s efforts to construct barriers to stanch the flow of illegal narcotics across the southern border.”

The money was transferred from DOD personnel funds in response to a request from the Department of Homeland Security. Federal law allows such transfers for “unforeseen” reasons and for expenditures not previously “denied by the Congress.” The administration contends that Congress did not reject the specific expenditures at issue, which would fund projects in California, New Mexico and Arizona. The challengers said Congress was clear. “Congress recently considered, and rejected, the same argument defendants [the government] make here: that a border wall is urgently needed to combat drugs,” said the brief from lawyers at the American Civil Liberties Union, which represented the groups. “If defendants were nonetheless permitted to obligate taxpayer funds and commence construction, the status quo would be radically and irrevocably altered.” The brief from the U.S. House of Representatives agreed.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#372

Post by Addie » Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:02 am

:doh:

Military.com
Troops Who Deployed to the US-Mexico Border Are Getting a Medal

Thousands of U.S. service members who've been sent to operate along the Mexico border will receive a military award reserved for troops who "encounter no foreign armed opposition or imminent hostile action."

The Pentagon has authorized troops who have deployed to the border to assist U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) since last April to receive the Armed Forces Service Medal. Details about the decision were included in a Marine Corps administrative message in response to authorization from the Defense Department.

There is no end date for the award since the operation remains ongoing.

"The Under Secretary of Defense has authorized the Armed Forces Service Medal to service members who have provided support to CBP, starting from April 7, 2018 [until a date to be determined]," said Army Lt. Col. Chris Mitchell, a Defense Department spokesman at the Pentagon.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#373

Post by Whatever4 » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:16 pm

Participation trophy?
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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#374

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:24 pm

Addie wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:02 am
:doh:

Military.com
Troops Who Deployed to the US-Mexico Border Are Getting a Medal

Thousands of U.S. service members who've been sent to operate along the Mexico border will receive a military award reserved for troops who "encounter no foreign armed opposition or imminent hostile action."

The Pentagon has authorized troops who have deployed to the border to assist U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) since last April to receive the Armed Forces Service Medal. Details about the decision were included in a Marine Corps administrative message in response to authorization from the Defense Department.

There is no end date for the award since the operation remains ongoing.

"The Under Secretary of Defense has authorized the Armed Forces Service Medal to service members who have provided support to CBP, starting from April 7, 2018 [until a date to be determined]," said Army Lt. Col. Chris Mitchell, a Defense Department spokesman at the Pentagon.
The Miller-Trump Keep America White Campaign Medal. It's all white with the name TRUMP in gold in the middle.

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Re: Military Guarding Mexico border

#375

Post by Sunrise » Tue Aug 20, 2019 7:18 pm

Sterngard Friegen wrote:
Tue Aug 20, 2019 6:24 pm

The Miller-Trump Keep America White Campaign Medal. It's all white with the name TRUMP in gold in the middle.
:fingerwag: :nope: It would haveta be Trump-Miller. Wussolini would neva accept his name in second place. :boxing:
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