Gun Control

[neeneko]

Something to keep in mind.. when talking about mass shootings (as opposed to other more common but less talked about gun violence).. these are not genius. These are not (generally) strategic thinkers who carefully go over their options and select the best tools for a job. They are dumb-shit meme-lords who are using a template they saw on TV... not creative thinkers, just people with a context who look through a cultural catalog of responses to that context and picking a popular one.

If you REALLY wanted to stop the trend, a solid solution would be a media blackout on reporting on such shootings. But that tends to make 1st amendment proponents uncomfortable for some very good reasons, but even if the comparison is flawed, reasons they should reflect on..

Now, if we are talking gun control for OTHER types of gun violence, the types that do not make big news but impact far more people on a daily basis, that is where a lot of these gun control measures start to really shine

[neonzx]

Well, yes, we need to grow up. This includes not describing something that brings joy, community, and fulfillment to millions of people as 'nothing but pain'. It is the same 'ah, look at that american hyperbole' we see with things like adult entertainment/sex work or (esp before they were covered by the first amendment) video games...'I only feel pain, so it is only pain'.

Maybe they might look for a new hobby to find "joy"? I dunno. Many countries get along very well without the mass guns in society and they have "joy" of their kids not being gunned down.

[neeneko]

Maybe they might look for a new hobby to find "joy"? I dunno. Many countries get along very well without the mass guns in society and they have "joy" of their kids not being gunned down.

Eh, I have been a member of too many communities over the years where people asked 'why can't you do something else, think of the children and let us ban you!'.. some of them not even having 1st/2nd amendment protection... for this to have anything other than a very icky feeling.

[sugar magnolia]

If the Constitution is the be-all and end-all of the gun regulation argument why don't we take those very words at face value? If you want to own a gun for anything other than home defense (if you're caught with it outside of your home that's a different ballgame) you have to join an official militia, have regular meetings for education and training, register your weapons through whichever militia you are a member of, have some sort of accountability within that militia, and the militias will be well-regulated through the government.

Not exactly what they have in mind?

[neeneko]

Not exactly what they have in mind?

I imagine a lot of them picture 'militia' as their self organized units rather than state controlled.

Personally, I think it would need to be carefully crafted since militias, like the police or military, would likely have various requirements that could result in redlining or ADA issues, but as a requirement for owning higher powered fire arms I think it makes a lot of sense. It would need careful oversight though since such gatekeeping can quickly become a tool of discrimination That gatekeeping though can always be addressed via other mechanisms for dealing with discrimination and equal access... however those tend to be slow, reactive, and expensive.

[sugar magnolia]

Not exactly what they have in mind?

I imagine a lot of them picture 'militia' as their self organized units rather than state controlled.

Personally, I think it would need to be carefully crafted since militias, like the police or military, would likely have various requirements that could result in redlining or ADA issues, but as a requirement for owning higher powered fire arms I think it makes a lot of sense. It would need careful oversight though since such gatekeeping can quickly become a tool of discrimination That gatekeeping though can always be addressed via other mechanisms for dealing with discrimination and equal access... however those tend to be slow, reactive, and expensive.

Slow, reactive, and expensive is better than.........nothing.

[neeneko]

Slow, reactive, and expensive is better than.........nothing.

This is true.

But I am thinking about current problems we are seeing with the military and issues like discrimination and sexual assault. Now imagine many little militaries with less training and oversight, acting as local gatekeepers to who can own what firearms. This could intersect with, say, communities of colour, or women, or even non-christians, in very messy ways.

On the other hand, if this was mostly being applied to high powered long guns and above, it matters a lot less with regards to having access to firearms. On the gripping hand, since I tend to see the handgun problem as bigger than the long gun problem, that would leave us pretty much where we started.

[neonzx]

If the Constitution is the be-all and end-all of the gun regulation argument why don't we take those very words at face value? If you want to own a gun for anything other than home defense (if you're caught with it outside of your home that's a different ballgame) you have to join an official militia, have regular meetings for education and training, register your weapons through whichever militia you are a member of, have some sort of accountability within that militia, and the militias will be well-regulated through the government.

"One weekend a month, two weeks a year" (you know the commercial)
Well regulated. National Guard.

That is who we sent -- thousands from various states to protect DC. Activated them, took them out of their jobs and away from their families. All good.

[Dave from down under]

So the US has a well regulated militia as specified in the 2A.

Therefore all other bearing arms is not a 2A right.

Aren’t a number of judges on the SCOTUS “originalists”, they should be happy to strip away all the “liberalism” that has perverted the original intent.

No?

Oh well then...
Regulate the 2A as Jim suggests..
http://www.stonekettle.com/2015/06/bang ... y.html?m=1

[neeneko]

Aren’t a number of judges on the SCOTUS “originalists”, they should be happy to strip away all the “liberalism” that has perverted the original intent.

Sadly, it was an originalist that spearheaded expanding the 2A to be a personal freedom for 'the home' in the first place. "originalism" is just a form of fundamentalism.. the sacred text demands whatever you say it does and anyone who suggests otherwise is 'changing it'.

[Gregg]

[Gregg]

[pipistrelle]

But in the mid-1970s, a faction in the NRA forced the organization away from sports and toward opposing “gun control.” It formed a political action committee (PAC) in 1975, and two years later elected an organization president who abandoned sporting culture and focused instead on “gun rights.”

This was the second thing that led us to where we are today: leaders of the NRA embraced the politics of Movement Conservatism, the political movement that rose to combat the business regulations and social welfare programs that both Democrats and Republicans embraced after World War Two. Movement Conservatives embraced the myth of the American cowboy as a white man standing against the “socialism” of the federal government as it sought to level the economic playing field between Black Americans and their white neighbors. Leaders like Arizona Senator Barry Goldwater personified the American cowboy, with his cowboy hat and opposition to government regulation, while television Westerns showed good guys putting down bad guys without the interference of the government.

https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.c ... ch-23-2021

[Dave from down under]

Worth a read
https://www.vox.com/2015/10/3/9444417/b ... merica-usa

The ABC (US) footage of a study into reactions is good

[Uninformed]

Thanks Dave. (One furriner to another).

[Chilidog]

[Dave from down under]

Insane

But we knew that..

[fierceredpanda]

The guy who quaked with fear at the mere thought of Donald Trump tweeting something mean about him is going to fight off an entire gang single-handed?

Please.

[sugar magnolia]

Doesn't he already have gangs protesting on his front lawn on occasion? Why isn't he shooting them?

[Gregg]

[Dave from down under]

If you want an AR-15 he has told everyone where to get it.

[Gregg]

[Dave from down under]

[Uninformed]

“He said he was going to watch cartoons. Instead, he opened his dad’s gun safe.”
“Every day in America, kids get their hands on lethal weapons, with disastrous consequences”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va ... e-excerpt/

[neeneko]

“He said he was going to watch cartoons. Instead, he opened his dad’s gun safe.”
“Every day in America, kids get their hands on lethal weapons, with disastrous consequences”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va ... e-excerpt/

Which, if the NRA was actually doing its job rather than what it has been doing, we might see less of....