Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

User avatar
Sugar Magnolia
Posts: 12026
Joined: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:44 am

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#251

Post by Sugar Magnolia »

I heard a new one from an anti-vaxxer yesterday. Her daughter "caught" autism from a vaccine. She has an actual autism diagnosis from a real doctor and receives some sort of public assistance check for it (SSI maybe?) for several years now. Her mother "cured" her with health food, essential oils and something she calls 'good gut' stuff. It is now time for her check up and she won't take the child in for fear the gov't will find out she cured her and cut off her checks. The crazy was real strong with this one.


User avatar
MN-Skeptic
Posts: 3998
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:36 pm
Location: Twin Cities

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#252

Post by MN-Skeptic »

The flu has certainly struck the school children in Minnesota. My brother had it last week. And now many folks will be traveling for the holidays, spreading germs far and wide.

Wash your hands and get lots of sleep!!!


Joe Biden: "Wearing masks is not a political statement. It's a scientific imperative."

It’s the pandemic, stupid!
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#253

Post by Volkonski »

Flu deaths up 65% in the new year: CDC
Children are particularly vulnerable to the flu and its complications.


https://abcnews.go.com/Health/1300-peop ... itter_abcn
Flu deaths are up more than 65% so far in 2020, with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reporting that 4,800 people had died and 87,000 people had been hospitalized during the 2019-2020 flu season, according to preliminary estimates the government agency released Friday.

Of those deaths, 32 were children, a group that's particularly vulnerable to the flu and its complications.

During recent past flu seasons, deaths among children have ranged from 37 to 187 fatalities.

While deaths are up, visits to health care providers for the flu decreased for the week ending Jan. 4. It's unclear whether that means the flu season has peaked or whether the holidays stopped people from seeking medical attention, according to the CDC.


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
Jeffrey
Posts: 2059
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#254

Post by Jeffrey »

The flu doesn't mess around:
(CNN)A 4-year-old girl in Iowa nearly died and is now blind because of the flu, and her parents have a message: Get your child vaccinated.
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/01/11/heal ... index.html


User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#255

Post by Volkonski »

The influenza B virus circulating now is especially dangerous to children. Much less so to us older folk.


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#256

Post by Volkonski »

Ashley Lopez
@AshLopezRadio
·
12m
Twice in one month now, Austin health officials have reported the first case of a vaccine-preventable disease in 20 years. First it was measles, now it's rubella.


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#257

Post by Volkonski »

KHOU 11 News Houston
@KHOU
·
8m
CDC warns flu vaccine does not match the virus hitting children especially hard https://khou.com/article/news/health/fl ... d4?Fb-KHOU #KHOU


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
User avatar
Hurtzi
Posts: 464
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:52 am

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#258

Post by Hurtzi »

Strict Vaccine Law Stumbles in N.J. Legislature
There were not enough votes in the State Senate to end religious exemptions to vaccine requirements for all students.
The bill in New Jersey was strongly opposed by thousands of anti-vaccine families from a wide variety of religious backgrounds, who have flooded the statehouse in recent days to express their objections. They had won the support of many lawmakers, including the Republican Assembly minority leader, Jon Bramnick of Union County. In floor debate before the bill’s passage, Mr. Bramnick called the bill overly broad. “To tell a doctor that they cannot use their ability, their expertise, to write an exemption handcuffs doctors,” he said, referring to language in the bill that also tightens the rules for granting medical exemptions.

Among those opposing the bill is the nation’s main ultra-Orthodox Jewish umbrella organization, Agudath Israel of America, which is taking a more active role in fighting the measure in New Jersey than it did in New York. New Jersey is home to the largest Orthodox yeshiva in the country, Beth Medrash Govoha, which is in Lakewood and has about 7,000 students.
While most Orthodox Jews vaccinate their children, many rabbinical authorities “are very concerned about this bill” because it mandates vaccines even in those cases where a rabbi may decide they are unwarranted, said Avi Schnall, the New Jersey director of Agudath Israel of America. Such a situation, he said, might arise in cases in which a family believes it has two children injured by vaccines, and is debating whether to vaccinate a third child. Most rabbis would rule that such a child should not be vaccinated, he said.
“There is a religious element to vaccines,” he said.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/16/nyre ... tions.html

Religious element to vaccines, so Rabbis have the last word. Good night, America.


The "water bear" is the first creature to live on the moon.
"From Not To Hot " is not my Favorite TV Show
User avatar
tek
Posts: 4963
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:02 pm
Location: Lake Humidity, FL
Occupation: Damned if I know

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#259

Post by tek »

d-2.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


There's no way back
from there to here
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#260

Post by Volkonski »

tek wrote: Fri Jan 17, 2020 4:13 pmd-2.jpg
:rotflmao:


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
User avatar
Hurtzi
Posts: 464
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:52 am

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#261

Post by Hurtzi »



The "water bear" is the first creature to live on the moon.
"From Not To Hot " is not my Favorite TV Show
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#262

Post by Volkonski »

:( :( :( :( :roll:
CBS News
@CBSNews
·
5m
Ohio pediatrician receives threats after her pro-vaccine TikTok video goes viral https://cbsn.ws/2uoHJFi


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
Jeffrey
Posts: 2059
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#263

Post by Jeffrey »

Some positive health news to cleanse the palate:
"10 years after vaccination was introduced, we detected no HPV16/18 infections in 16-18 yearolds (0% of n=584)"
Sekrit Stuffs!


User avatar
Danraft
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:45 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#264

Post by Danraft »

To touch on a point, though. I don’t believe it is helpful that many that seem to represent the medical community do not acknowledge that there are vaccine related complications. Some do die as a result of vaccinations or have other health concerns. But, the overall statistics do support immunization— both when calculated on an individual or as a herd immunity metric.

HPV vaccines in Asia were highly controversial in part because there were problems and it had to be reformulated. The end result is that the HPV vaccination used in Asia is actually superior to what is used in the West because it provides broader protection across the virus sub-types.

Make no mistake about it—China, South Korea, Japan, etc are doing excellent research work and it is poised to surpass “Western” countries in achieving measurable increases in human health.

Yes, there is a lot of “Woo-medicine” based on alternative/Chinese herbal holistic and non-traditional health interventions, but there is also seriously qualified research. (And in general framing of scientific expertise— I sometimes remind people that China has a manned space program—and it could be argued that the US does not)

In some areas, and I am in hypothesizing-mode, I would guess that genetic differences based on the presence (or lack thereof) of Neanderthal genes (for instance) could, in some cases, cause a stratification of sub-population response to a medication.

If that seems excessively couched in conditionals— well it is. Neanderthal genes that were conserved are important in antigen/allergies and not all populations have that gene set.

Anyway, anti-vaxxers do not hate their children.
I have long held that the best response to anti-vaxxers would be a public service ad campaign that showed medical doctors, NIH researchers, Big Pharma execs, etc getting their children vaccinated. If they are being painted as evil greedy or whatever the incidental attack is—show that they walk the walk and vaccinate. It would deflate just about any anti-Vaxxer argument.


The Mercury Project
TexasFilly
Posts: 20514
Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 12:52 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#265

Post by TexasFilly »

I suggest you watch the Netflix Pandemic series. There are anti-vaxers there who insist they have superior knowledge to medical professionals (who do acknowledge that a very small number of people have adverse reactions to vaccines). The anti-vaxers whine about their kids not having the "freedom" to go to some schools, play on sports teams, etc. The absolute worst part shows a public hearing in Oregon where parents of immune-compromised children beg these people to vaccinate their kids so the children fighting cancer don't have to be exposed to diseases like measles which could kill them. The anti-vax parents are unmoved by the plight of other children and pound the table about their "freedom."

The far superior parents who are anti-vaxers think scientists, doctors, vaccine manufacturers etc. are part of a cabal to poison their children for profit. They are as intentionally ignorant and as smug as Trump supporters.


I love the poorly educated!!!

Kevin McCarthy: Paul Ryan playing with a head injury -- Jon Lovett
User avatar
Danraft
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:45 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#266

Post by Danraft »

Fight the belief not the person.


The Mercury Project
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#267

Post by Volkonski »

So far this season over 8000 people in the USA have died from the flu. This is normal. :(

We need scare headlines about this. Then maybe more people would get vaccinated.


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
User avatar
RTH10260
Posts: 29091
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 8:52 am
Location: Near the Swiss Alps

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#268

Post by RTH10260 »

How many cannot afford a simple vaccination? Or take time off from work to go to a doctor? Any clinics open 24/7 to provide for flu shots?

To note: not all vaccines are able to target variants of a flu, so there is always the chance to be meet the wrong bug.


User avatar
pipistrelle
Posts: 10345
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:26 am

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#269

Post by pipistrelle »

RTH10260 wrote: Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:43 pm How many cannot afford a simple vaccination? Or take time off from work to go to a doctor? Any clinics open 24/7 to provide for flu shots?

To note: not all vaccines are able to target variants of a flu, so there is always the chance to be meet the wrong bug.
Many major drugstores have flu shot clinics.


User avatar
AndyinPA
Posts: 6370
Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:00 pm
Location: Pittsburgh PA

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#270

Post by AndyinPA »

I am always surprised at the number of people I know who don't get a flu shot. We have friends who never do and often get the flu. They then use the drug for people who get the flu instead. They are old enough to be in serious trouble with the flu. And they have a grandchild who has fought cancer more than once. Another couple has a grandchild with cystic fibrosis and don't get flu shots. I just don't understand it. How can you be around people, especially children, who are immune comprised and not do everything you can to protect them?


"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." -- Thomas Paine
User avatar
ZekeB
Posts: 17975
Joined: Mon Oct 12, 2009 10:07 pm
Location: The nuttiest congressional district of a nut job state.

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#271

Post by ZekeB »

RTH10260 wrote: Tue Jan 28, 2020 4:43 pm How many cannot afford a simple vaccination? Or take time off from work to go to a doctor? Any clinics open 24/7 to provide for flu shots?

To note: not all vaccines are able to target variants of a flu, so there is always the chance to be meet the wrong bug.
If they think a chicken pox vaccination is expensive they need to look at the price of the two shingles shots their kids will eventually need.


Trump: Er hat eine größere Ente als ich.

Putin: Du bist kleiner als ich.
User avatar
AndyinPA
Posts: 6370
Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2017 1:00 pm
Location: Pittsburgh PA

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#272

Post by AndyinPA »

:like:


"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." -- Thomas Paine
User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 32502
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texoma and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer
Contact:

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#273

Post by Volkonski »

Flu season continues, with H1N1 diagnoses picking up, CDC says
10,000 people have died of the flu this season, including 64 children.


https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-n ... d_nn_tw_ma
More than 19 million cases of the flu have been diagnosed in the U.S. this season, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Friday.

After a dip in the first few weeks of 2020, flu activity has once again picked up, with no signs the season has peaked. Widespread activity was reported in every state, except Hawaii.

Overall, the CDC estimates that the flu has lead to 180,000 hospitalizations this season. Sixty-eight children have died.

Flu season had an odd start, with an unprecedented early surge in a B strain the virus. Flu B generally hits younger people harder. But now increasingly, cases of a flu A strain — H1N1 — have been diagnosed.


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace
Jeffrey
Posts: 2059
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#274

Post by Jeffrey »

On Facebook, anti-vaxxers urged a mom not to give her son Tamiflu. He later died.
https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-med ... u-n1131936


User avatar
Danraft
Posts: 1014
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:45 pm

Re: Vaccines for All - Vaxers vs Antivaxers

#275

Post by Danraft »

Meh... Low hanging fruit, "Getting a flu-shot can be a pain..."

At a recent NIH seminar I met the lab manager for Dr Roger Newton (creator of the statin-drug Lipitor)-- his team was doing work on a novel oral vaccine for H1N1 that was successful in pigs and were hoping to start human trials in a few years.

Also, it happened that they were beginning a grant proposal to study Diabetes 1 in mice (non-production of insulin). After I took a moment to write out my concerns (regarding the scientific frailties of using mice) and suggested their wet-lab could produce results more applicable to humans using rats, by the end of the seminar I was thanked and believe they have changed research animal.

Also (2), <heh-heh> I note that Lipitor was some pretty poor science (in the middle of the HMG-CoA pathway (for which I "wax" poetic (sorry, sticky-sweet geek-humor (oops, did it again))) which led to severe adverse effects with my father ( if you are taking statins (a class of medications which has yet to be fully exploited), I might be so bold as to suggest taking CoQ10 or Ubiquinol).


The Mercury Project
Post Reply

Return to “Science & Technology”