US v. Trump - Espionage Act - (9:23-cr-80101) District Court, S.D. Florida

[realist]

I doubt it comes up in today's hearing on the motions to dismiss, but he's so stupid... Shocking revelation, I know.

While Donald Trump’s legal team prepared to make arguments attempting to dismiss his classified documents criminal case, Trump was working on a new angle of his own.

In a pre-recorded interview that aired Wednesday, Trump effortlessly unraveled the work of his defense team, telling Newsmax’s Greg Kelly point blank that he actually did take the classified documents, describing the process of shamelessly packing them away while leaving office.

“I took ‘em very legally,” Trump said. “And I wasn’t hiding them.”

“We had boxes on the front of the—and a lot of those boxes had clothing and a lot of—we were moving out, okay? Unfortunately, we were moving out of the White House. And because we’re moving out of the White House our country is going to hell.”

“But um, we weren’t hiding anything. He was,” he added, referring to President Joe Biden having kept a box with a handful of classified documents in his garage—compared to the 11,000 records seized by the FBI at Mar-a-Lago.

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-makes-idio ... 06604.html

[Rolodex]

Very legally

He has the weirdest phraseology I've ever heard. I've never experience a conversation - even with people for whom English is not their first language - who uses such odd descriptions. I volunteer at a program for folks with dementia and even they don't talk this way.

[raison de arizona]

His belief that as long as he commits crimes in plain sight, they aren't really crimes is astonishing.

[Suranis]

Very legally

He has the weirdest phraseology I've ever heard. I've never experience a conversation - even with people for whom English is not their first language - who uses such odd descriptions. I volunteer at a program for folks with dementia and even they don't talk this way.

It's because he is trying to convince you. Narcissists continually try to cover up the fact that they are small losers, and their terror is that people see through the act. So by saying "VERY legal" he is trying to cover up his own inadequacies and saying "it really was legal!! I'm not being full of shit! PLEASE BELIEVE ME!!"

[Maybenaut]

I doubt it comes up in today's hearing on the motions to dismiss, but he's so stupid... Shocking revelation, I know.

While Donald Trump’s legal team prepared to make arguments attempting to dismiss his classified documents criminal case, Trump was working on a new angle of his own.

In a pre-recorded interview that aired Wednesday, Trump effortlessly unraveled the work of his defense team, telling Newsmax’s Greg Kelly point blank that he actually did take the classified documents, describing the process of shamelessly packing them away while leaving office.

“I took ‘em very legally,” Trump said. “And I wasn’t hiding them.”

“We had boxes on the front of the—and a lot of those boxes had clothing and a lot of—we were moving out, okay? Unfortunately, we were moving out of the White House. And because we’re moving out of the White House our country is going to hell.”

“But um, we weren’t hiding anything. He was,” he added, referring to President Joe Biden having kept a box with a handful of classified documents in his garage—compared to the 11,000 records seized by the FBI at Mar-a-Lago.

https://news.yahoo.com/trump-makes-idio ... 06604.html

With the possible exception of his claim that they weren't hiding the documents, I don't think there's anything new here. I don't think he ever denied taking the documents. His argument has always been that he was legally entitled to have them.

He may have said before that they weren't hiding them. I don't recall. It's pretty clear, though, that he was trying to hide them, what with his having his staff move them around when he knew the FBI was looking for them.

[Suranis]

With the possible exception of his claim that they weren't hiding the documents, I don't think there's anything new here. I don't think he ever denied taking the documents. His argument has always been that he was legally entitled to have them.

He may have said before that they weren't hiding them. I don't recall. It's pretty clear, though, that he was trying to hide them, what with his having his staff move them around when he knew the FBI was looking for them.

He actually kinda did. For 3 days after the raid, he was still denying that there was anything there. Then someone on Twitter suggested the novel legal strategy that Nixon took documents and due to the Presidential Records act Trump was entitled, and suddenly Turnip "remembered" that he was totally entitled and they were his property.

BEFORE that he denied he had taken documents, then he gave some back and insisted through his lawyer that was everything and he had absolutely no documents left. Then the Raid happened and the lawyer had serious egg on her face as she had unwittingly or wittingly committed perjury.

I know, it's hard to remember when you are exposed to wall to wall trump propaganda, but that's the rough timetable.

But the key is that for 3 days he was floundering around trying to invent a justification, and when someone else suggested one he adopted it. Thats the key point that shows he is lying.

[SuzieC]

Tom Fitten, head of Judicial Watch, gave Trump that idea. Fitten is not a lawyer.

[andersweinstein]

Newsflash, Aileen Cannon expresses anti-Trump view:

Cannon seems skeptical of defense's argument on the Presidential Records Act

With court back in session, Cannon gave Trump attorney Todd Blanche the chance to lay out the argument for their second motion of the day — dismissal based on the Presidential Records Act.

Blanche said that “presidents since George Washington have taken materials out of the White House” at “their own discretion.”

Cannon, however, seemed skeptical of the defense’s argument: “It’s difficult to see how this gets you to the dismissal of an indictment.” She added that the line of argument seems better suited in trial or during jury instructions but that this motion is where their argument begins to “falter.”

Source

[Rolodex]

Very legally

He has the weirdest phraseology I've ever heard. I've never experience a conversation - even with people for whom English is not their first language - who uses such odd descriptions. I volunteer at a program for folks with dementia and even they don't talk this way.

It's because he is trying to convince you. Narcissists continually try to cover up the fact that they are small losers, and their terror is that people see through the act. So by saying "VERY legal" he is trying to cover up his own inadequacies and saying "it really was legal!! I'm not being full of shit! PLEASE BELIEVE ME!!"

No disagreement. But it's the use of "VERY" legal that's so weird. I think most people would say "totally" legal or even "absolutely" or "completely" legal...but "very"? Just such an odd choice of words. And he has tons of those.

[bob]

I recall someone once floated the notion that a government employee packed the boxes, and that he had no personal knowledge of their contents.

[Dr. Ken]

I recall someone once floated the notion that a government employee packed the boxes, and that he had no personal knowledge of their contents.

Yeah that was for a hot minute until people started saying trump oversaw the packing

[Rolodex]

In his interview last night (I think - some weirdo RW outlet) he said it was all personal stuff! If he can't discern between personal stuff and classified docs, he's unfit for employment beyond parking golf carts. Not that that's not a dignified job.

[raison de arizona]

In his interview last night (I think - some weirdo RW outlet) he said it was all personal stuff! If he can't discern between personal stuff and classified docs, he's unfit for employment beyond parking golf carts. Not that that's not a dignified job.

He considers the classified documents his personal property.

Also, don't forget that he declassified them.

With his mind!

Such as it is.

[Rolodex]

Such a shame that president doesn't have access to counsel or lawyers or any staff that knows about anything to do with official documents. OTOH, he's trying that Advice of Counsel Lite™ in the hush money case so maybe this a crude attempt at the same thing here.

[bob]

[Slim Cognito]

Ok, I can finally exhale...this once.


Aaaannnnndddd breathe in.

[p0rtia]

Now do immunity, Aileen.

I won't wait.

[Maybenaut]

The tweet says, “In other words, she punted the decision to later.”

I don’t think that’s quite right. Trump would have to make another motion, otherwise she’s leaving it up to the jury.

[Suranis]

No disagreement. But it's the use of "VERY" legal that's so weird. I think most people would say "totally" legal or even "absolutely" or "completely" legal...but "very"? Just such an odd choice of words. And he has tons of those.

You have a very good point. At a guess, I would postulate it's because "VERY" has an implication of size, so its BIG/BIGGER serious legal.

It's just like he used to say "Big League" a lot, but his pronunciation is so mangled that everyone thought he was saying "bigly." I dunno if he still says it. People laughing at him for saying it might have been enough to stop him.

[chancery]

You gotta give Judge Cannon credit this opinion about whether the counts against Trump are void for vagueness is itself completely inscrutable to a native english speaker

Also, from a short NBC News snippet by Alec Hernández:

“It’s difficult to see how this gets you to the dismissal of an indictment.” She added that the line of argument seems better suited in trial or during jury instructions but that this motion is where their argument begins to “falter.”

Right, lots of legal arguments worthy of "serious consideration," so let's let the jury sort out the statutory definitions.

https://twitter.com/ASFleischman/status ... 9626636382

Andrew Fleischman
@ASFleischman
Sometimes people who shouldn't be judges slip through the cracks and Cannon should probably do something else.

[RVInit]

Quite a long time ago I had posted a story that contains photos of boxes being loaded onto Trump's private plane headed to Bedminster prior to the FBI coming to Mar-a-Lago to collect any remaining classified documents. Many of us believed those boxes may have contained classified documents. A Mar-a-Lago employee confirmed that he was enlisted to assist in getting those boxes out of Mar-a-Lago and onto the plane and he contends that yes, they did contain classified documents. He also confirmed other details of wrongdoing related to classified information and how various people used their proximity to Trump to obtain, or try to obtain, information.

Here is a video about this case and also contains excerpts from an interview with "Employee #5", Brian Butler from the classified documents indictment with Kaitlin Collins of CNN.

[Rolodex]

I still want to know why they didn't search or get a warrant to search Bedminster? It's old news that those boxes were headed there.

[RVInit]

I still want to know why they didn't search or get a warrant to search Bedminster? It's old news that those boxes were headed there.

Yes, photos showing these boxes being loaded into the plane were all over the internet, several stories were being written about it. I don't know what was so hard about this. By this time Trump had already exhibited behavior indicating that he absolutely was NOT going to return the documents. They already had evidence that he was deliberately hiding it. They already knew the kind of boxes he was storing these documents in. He was actively engaged in giving NARA and the FBI and the DOJ the run-around. And then 15-18 boxes that look exactly the same as the boxes he was storing classified documents in were loaded into a plane the same day he took that plane to Bedminster. These were indeed his "Beautiful Mind" boxes, full of stuff he valued above all else.

And remember who he was rubbing elbows with at Bedminster? His favorite Saudis. And don't even try to make me think that at least half of the members of Mar-a-Lago and his other clubs aren't Russian assets. Putin plays the long game, he likely had all kinds of assets next to Trump starting the day after he came down that elevator. Trump is exactly the kind of target Russia goes after - needs money and is susceptible to the least little bit of flattery.

[p0rtia]

I still want to know why they didn't search or get a warrant to search Bedminster? It's old news that those boxes were headed there.

Add it to the long list of fuckhead crimes, and crimes committed by members of Congress, that Main Justice and SDNY took a pass on. Starting with, "Oh, Georgia? Election Interference? Nah...."

[RTH10260]

re boxes on the plane: it's my understanding that the former guy has this fetish that certain boxes must always travel with him. I infer that in this case no boxes were left behind at Bedford but returned to his office and the now famous bathroom at M-a-L. So no need to search the Bedford property.