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Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 12:25 am
by raison de arizona
I expect there will be a lot of confusion. Nate Silver with another one of his classic takes, simply ignoring basic things like flight crews, how viruses spread, and completely missing that there is a lot more to public transportation than just planes.
Nate Silver @NateSilver538 wrote:
The average American spends something like 5 hours per year on a plane. The mask mandate might be good or bad at the margin, but it is very unlikely to make a major difference in the overall course of the coronavirus.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 12:40 am
by Lani
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 12:48 am
by raison de arizona
Daniel Walters @DanielEWalters_ wrote:
I can't believe how obtuse the statutory analysis in this air travel mask mandate case is. I can think of at least 2 other plausible readings at every turn, and yet I'm told this is the "ordinary" meaning of the statute. Whether false certainty or bad faith, this is ridiculous.
The opinion spends pages agonizing over whether the mask mandate is a santitation method in the sense that it "cleanses" or "keeps clean"--the two possibilities identified in a dictionary. If you have any objective reason why one of these is better than the other, shoot.
But on top of that, this isn't even the right question. The relevant statute doesn't give power to CDC just to regulate sanitation measures. It gives CDC the power to enact "other measures, as in his judgment may be necessary." Opinion glosses right over that.
And on top of that, it isn't even clear that the statute limits the CDC to doing anything in the list plus other necessary measures. Read plainly, the statue gives CDC the power to enact these measures to carry out and enforce "regulations" which are necessary to prevent disease.
I'm not even an a textualist and I feel abused by this opinion's lack of care.
It actually gets worse. The court says subsection (a) can't allow for individual regs because only subsections (b)-(d) reference individuals. But this ignores the fact that subsections (b)-(d) explicitly refer to the power to issue regs "under this Section." Not subsection. Doh.
https://twitter.com/danielewalters_/st ... 5949588483
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:16 am
by raison de arizona
Delta declares Covid “an ordinary seasonal virus.”
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:03 am
by raison de arizona
NJ Transit has now decided to drop masks as well. Uber too. A slew of airlines have dropped them, I’m actually not aware of one that is still requiring them.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:26 am
by pipistrelle
I’m disappointed about Amtrak. I’m going somewhere in June and was hoping the mandate would last until then.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:26 am
by RTH10260
Considering the general public backlash on mandates that is not surprising. Think of all the employees who would be confronted by angry stupid customers.
Now let's observe the statistics of rising infection number in two weeks. May be difficult cause reporting has been suuspended many places. Wait until services will suffer cause key employees report ill.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 12:47 pm
by AndyinPA
pipistrelle wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:26 am
I’m disappointed about Amtrak. I’m going somewhere in June and was hoping the mandate would last until then.
Me, too, although we're not traveling until July. I think what we probably have to do, though, is just get used to wearing one on our own terms, mandate or no mandate. That's not as good, but it's what we're left with.
And, unless this ticks up hard again, I don't think it would still have been in place in June, anyway.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:22 pm
by raison de arizona
White House says they are not going to appeal the ruling at this time.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:28 pm
by pipistrelle
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:22 pm
White House says they are not going to appeal the ruling at this time.
That’s too bad if only because, from what I’ve seen lawyers say, it’s an inept ruling from one of the “not qualified” appointees.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:26 pm
by AndyinPA
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:28 pm
by tek
pipistrelle wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:28 pm
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 3:22 pm
White House says they are not going to appeal the ruling at this time.
That’s too bad if only because, from what I’ve seen lawyers say, it’s an inept ruling from one of the “not qualified” appointees.
Under at least some readings, this ruling renders the CDC impotent.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 4:34 pm
by p0rtia
Life in a failed democracy.
This week has been an avalanche of evil, anti-democratic, anti-rule-of-law events. I see main stream media more and more adopting the horrific lies from the propagandists as the norm. It is terrifying.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:30 pm
by Volkonski
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:33 pm
by Volkonski
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:34 pm
by raison de arizona
whether they keep a mandate or not, this really seems like a necessary step.
The Justice Department will not, however, ask the court to stay the decision, meaning passengers will be able to continue traveling maskless while the decision is litigated.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:50 pm
by AndyinPA
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 6:53 pm
by p0rtia
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:02 pm
by sad-cafe
we are crusing in June
All passengers above the age of 12 have to be fully vaxxed
EVERY passenger has to have a neg test 2 days before sailing
I just wish the damn airlines would have kept the mask mandates because to get from our place to the pier will require 2 plans and a layover in Georgia
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2022 7:04 pm
by Dave from down under
If it is not successfully challenged then when the next variant of higher mortality (or other health risk requiring CDC action), comes along them people will die - needlessly and just because an unqualified political appointee of a failed dictator is stupid/evil.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:14 am
by bill_g
I knew there would be a thread on this.
On NPR a law prof said of the Trump appointed Fed Judge that her decision read like that of a first year law student - simplistic and naive. Prof dug into her (mis)interpretation of public sanitation code claiming sanitation is only cleaning that kills germs. Since masks don't kill the virus, they are not part of public sanitation.
Sounds like judge shopping to me, and that she was well prepared to hand down a favorable decision. This won't be the last we hear from this judge. It's a lifetime appointment. Time to send some guard dogs to keep an eye on her actions.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:05 am
by bill_g
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:16 am
Delta declares Covid “an ordinary seasonal virus.”
[img] https: //pbs.twimg.com/media/FQrQyWMakAM1P0A?format=jpg&name=medium[/img]
Yeah. Noticed that. Quite the diplomatic way to say "we know the dog bites, but not as hard as it used to."
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:36 am
by raison de arizona
bill_g wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:14 am
This won't be the last we hear from this judge. It's a lifetime appointment. Time to send some guard dogs to keep an eye on her actions.
Eggsactly.
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:46 am
by raison de arizona
bill_g wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:05 am
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Apr 19, 2022 1:16 am
Delta declares Covid “an ordinary seasonal virus.”
[img] https: //pbs.twimg.com/media/FQrQyWMakAM1P0A?format=jpg&name=medium[/img]
Yeah. Noticed that. Quite the diplomatic way to say "we know the dog bites, but not as hard as it used to."
Delta eventually backtracked.
I like that their new statement says, “other scientific measures to prevent serious illness.” Oh, you mean like… MASKS?!?
Re: COVID Vaccine Mandates
Posted: Wed Apr 20, 2022 11:00 am
by bill_g
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 9:36 am
bill_g wrote: ↑Wed Apr 20, 2022 8:14 am
This won't be the last we hear from this judge. It's a lifetime appointment. Time to send some guard dogs to keep an eye on her actions.
Eggsactly.
[img] https: //pbs.twimg.com/media/FQykIBTXEAEsxMy?format=jpg&name=large[/img]
We will see more judge shopping with her being the preferred destination for conservative issues.
