Fogbow

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:30 am**

A traveler's Delta flight was canceled, so he called the airline's number listed on Google. It led to a scammer — then he says he discovered more airlines with the same problem.

Monica Humphries
Updated Tue, July 18, 2023 at 1:11 PM GMT+2

A Twitter user said he was nearly scammed because of a canceled Delta Air Lines flight.
Shmuli Evers called a number listed on Google, but it turned out that he wasn't talking to Delta.
After the call, Evers said he found at least six other airlines with wrong numbers listed on Google.
The Twitter user Shmuli Evers shared a story of canceled flights, scammers, and plenty of red flags.

Under the username @Shmuli, Evers detailed a story that started with a canceled Delta Air Lines flight.

"My @delta flight got canceled from JFK. The customer service line was huge, so I google a Delta JFK phone number. The number was 1888-571-4869 Thinking I reached Delta, I started telling them about getting me on a new flight," he tweeted Sunday.

But that phone call led him to a scam, he said. And, after more digging, Evers said he discovered at least six other airlines with what he suspected were scam numbers listed on Google.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/travelers-de ... 21464.html
(original: INSIDER)

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am**

Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 11:22 am**

raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?

I'm not defending the scheme, but it's contract for carriage. If ya don't like the terms and conditions, don't buy the ticket.

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:11 pm**

raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?

The kid is the thief. It’s all about filling seats. As I understand it, airlines offer attractive prices on flights connecting through their hubs because it saves them money. By bailing on that second leg, a seat that might have been sold is now empty.

I got no sympathy. It’s people who do shit like this that drive the price up for the rest of us.

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:31 pm**

Horrifying.

Passengers aboard Las Vegas flight pass out while awaiting takeoff in triple digit temperatures
Atlanta-bound flight at Harry Reid International Airport in Las Vegas canceled again Tuesday

Multiple airline passengers awaiting takeoff fell ill in stifling triple-digit heat while taxiing behind more than a dozen other flights at Harry Reid International Airport in Las Vegas on Monday, according to Fox News field producer Krista Garvin, who was aboard the flight.

Passengers aboard a Delta Air Lines flight to Atlanta were waiting in 111-degree heat with no air conditioning when the pilot announced the plane had to return to the gate due to multiple emergencies, Garvin said.

The situation worsened and flight attendants were seen running up and down the aisles with oxygen tanks. Multiple passengers had passed out and some had soiled themselves.

Babies screamed as passengers were told to remain seated while they waited for paramedics to board the plane. Garvin said at least five people were seen being wheeled off the plane.

The pilot instructed passengers to "hit your call button if you’re having a medical emergency."

Passengers were then given a choice to exit the plane, according to Garvin, but were told that if they did, it may take days to get another flight to Atlanta.

Many passengers chose to stay on the plane, Garvin said, but temperatures inside began to rise again.

Temperatures at the airport fluctuated between 111 and 115 degrees on Monday afternoon, according to the National Weather Service.

After a total of four hours on the hot plane, Garvin said stretchers were wheeled onto the plane and passengers were asked to disembark back into the airport.

Passengers were later told that flight attendants had also fallen ill and the flight may not be able to take off. Garvin said one flight attendant was wheeled out on a stretcher with an oxygen mask on.

The flight was moved to 7 a.m. Tuesday. Passengers, however, awoke to find the flight had been canceled again.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/lifestyle/p ... mperatures

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:36 pm**

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 6:09 pm**

raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 2:31 pm Horrifying.
Passengers aboard Las Vegas flight pass out while awaiting takeoff in triple digit temperatures
Atlanta-bound flight at Harry Reid International Airport in Las Vegas canceled again Tuesday

Sounds like the PACS [pneumatic air cycling system] failed...

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 6:10 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:11 pm

The kid is the thief. It’s all about filling seats. As I understand it, airlines offer attractive prices on flights connecting through their hubs because it saves them money. By bailing on that second leg, a seat that might have been sold is now empty.

We called them cattle cars for a reason...

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:09 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:11 pm
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?
The kid is the thief. It’s all about filling seats. As I understand it, airlines offer attractive prices on flights connecting through their hubs because it saves them money. By bailing on that second leg, a seat that might have been sold is now empty.

I got no sympathy. It’s people who do shit like this that drive the price up for the rest of us.

I respectfully demur. It's at best a contract claim, on an economic playing field distorted by market power, regulatory capture, and extreme information asymmetry. I doubt that the carrier could prove damages under any ordinary rules.

Granted, the business of running an airline is difficult, with immense fixed costs and fickle revenues, but airlines want regulatory relief for their benefit only, with no consideration for the interests of passengers and the general public. Furthermore, there's something disgusting about the airlines' insistence on their "free market" freedom to employ the most aggressive possible forms of yield management pricing, including charging a premium to avoid deliberate infliction of discomfort, while insisting that passengers are "thieves" for taking legitimate advantage of market conditions.

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:19 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:11 pm
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?
The kid is the thief. It’s all about filling seats. As I understand it, airlines offer attractive prices on flights connecting through their hubs because it saves them money. By bailing on that second leg, a seat that might have been sold is now empty.

I got no sympathy. It’s people who do shit like this that drive the price up for the rest of us.

I disagree completely. The seat WAS sold at a pricethe airline found acceptable. The airline did not lose 1 cent if the buyer of that seat chose to not use the entire benefit of his purchase.

What is the end point here? You gonna have somebody arrested if they buy a Big Mac meal and neglicts to eat the fries? Those fries could have been sold to someone else too!

Posted: **Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:19 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 1:11 pm
raison de arizona wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 10:50 am Thievery? A ticket to NC is $400. A ticket to NY with a stop in NC is $150. 'Splain that. Who's the thief?
The kid is the thief. It’s all about filling seats. As I understand it, airlines offer attractive prices on flights connecting through their hubs because it saves them money. By bailing on that second leg, a seat that might have been sold is now empty.

I got no sympathy. It’s people who do shit like this that drive the price up for the rest of us.

I disagree completely. The seat WAS sold at a pricethe airline found acceptable. The airline did not lose 1 cent if the buyer of that seat chose to not use the entire benefit of his purchase.

What is the end point here? You gonna have somebody arrested if they buy a Big Mac meal and neglicts to eat the fries? Those fries could have been sold to someone else too!

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 9:01 am**

At 19, I was fending for myself even more miles from home.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 10:58 am**

keith wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:19 pm
I disagree completely. The seat WAS sold at a pricethe airline found acceptable. The airline did not lose 1 cent if the buyer of that seat chose to not use the entire benefit of his purchase.

What is the end point here? You gonna have somebody arrested if they buy a Big Mac meal and neglicts to eat the fries? Those fries could have been sold to someone else too!

I don’t expect anyone to agree with me.

I just think that if the airline decides that it is in its best economic interest to set higher prices for each leg of a flight flown by different passengers than for both legs flown by the same individual, I don’t get to unilaterally take that choice away from the airline. That is particularly so when they warn me that the price is only valid if I complete the entire trip, and I agree to that condition when I buy the ticket.

If this practice didn’t cost the airline money, they wouldn’t be cracking down.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 12:05 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 10:58 am
keith wrote: ↑Tue Jul 18, 2023 7:19 pm
I disagree completely. The seat WAS sold at a pricethe airline found acceptable. The airline did not lose 1 cent if the buyer of that seat chose to not use the entire benefit of his purchase.

What is the end point here? You gonna have somebody arrested if they buy a Big Mac meal and neglicts to eat the fries? Those fries could have been sold to someone else too!
I don’t expect anyone to agree with me.

I just think that if the airline decides that it is in its best economic interest to set higher prices for each leg of a flight flown by different passengers than for both legs flown by the same individual, I don’t get to unilaterally take that choice away from the airline. That is particularly so when they warn me that the price is only valid if I complete the entire trip, and I agree to that condition when I buy the ticket.

If this practice didn’t cost the airline money, they wouldn’t be cracking down.

As a rather frequent flyer, I agree with you. I do see the point others are making, but the air travel business isn't as simple as "longer flights should cost more and shorter flights should cost less, therefore I'm not hurting the airline when I get off the plane at an intermediate stop." Their business is getting people from point A to point B, and pricing for that service is now dictated by supply and demand for each origin/destination pair (as opposed to being regulated by the FAA, as it was many years ago). As Maybenaut mentions, the airlines have the demand formulae down to a science, and they provide capacity to meet that demand as closely as possible, combined with active fare pricing to fill seats as much as possible. Empty seats on one leg of a multi-leg flight means wasted capacity flying that route, which costs money.

No one has a right to fly. If you don't like the terms of the contract, don't fly with that carrier. But if you do decide to fly with a particular carrier, and the terms of the contract state that you must complete entire trip, then complete the entire trip. If you choose to violate the terms of the contract by leaving the trip at an intermediate airport, then don't be surprised if the carrier bills you for the cost of the flight you actually took, and don't be surprised when they tell you they no longer want your business.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:44 pm**

In two weeks, my son and I are taking the grandkids to Seattle to board a cruise ship to Alaska. To protect us the best I can, we are flying in two days ahead. We have an early morning flight, so I think that's safe on the way out. However, we have an 11 PM flight back, so odds of that flight being cancelled are above normal, I'd guess. We get off the ship probably 9-10 AM. With or without an ADHD child, I would not spend that much time waiting in an airport. I've done it once sitting all day in a nice comfortable flight lounge and could barely stand it. First, I was going to get a day room so that we could have a place to leave our luggage and comfortably wait out the day, but I ended up just booking the room for the night. We can stay in the room longer, and if our flight's cancelled, we have a room for the night.

Flying these days is a gruesome business. And, yes, I hate flying that much.

I was on a seven-hour late train last week. Other than being exhausted getting in so early in the morning, it was not a horrible experience. Comfortable seating, access to get off the train and walk around, air conditioning, and food readily available.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:52 pm**

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 10:58 am I don’t expect anyone to agree with me.

I do not yet have an opinion and have decided I don't want to spend the brainpower formulating an opinion at this time, so I will neither agree or disagree with you. Hope that works.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:53 pm**

northland10 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:52 pm
Maybenaut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 10:58 am I don’t expect anyone to agree with me.
I do not yet have an opinion and have decided I don't want to spend the brainpower formulating an opinion at this time, so I will neither agree or disagree with you. Hope that works.

Works for me.

Posted: **Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:55 pm**

northland10 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 1:52 pm
Maybenaut wrote: ↑Wed Jul 19, 2023 10:58 am I don’t expect anyone to agree with me.
I do not yet have an opinion and have decided I don't want to spend the brainpower formulating an opinion at this time, so I will neither agree or disagree with you. Hope that works.

It does!

Posted: **Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:08 pm**

https://onemileatatime.com/news/america ... ess-class/

American Airlines has started serving an Italian sparkling wine instead of a French champagne in Business Class.

Since I retired I no longer spend much time in Business Class on any airline. However even back then the wines served in Business Class were good but not great. I see no reason that a midpriced Italian sparkling wine might not be as good as a midpriced French champagne.

Posted: **Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:18 pm**

Volkonski wrote: ↑Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:08 pm https://onemileatatime.com/news/america ... ess-class/

American Airlines has started serving an Italian sparkling wine instead of a French champagne in Business Class.

Since I retired I no longer spend much time in Business Class on any airline. However even back then the wines served in Business Class were good but not great. I see no reason that a midpriced Italian sparkling wine might not be as good as a midpriced French champagne.

Tragic. You may get served Martini & Rossi instead of trademarked stuff from Champagne, France. Doubt anyone cares.

Posted: **Fri Aug 04, 2023 8:18 pm**

Airlines wine selection criteria are
1. Price
2. Can you deliver the quatity we want in little tiny bottles that don't explode at 10000 feet or whatever?
3. Price
4. Does it still taste like wine in a dry, pressurized cabin.
5. Every once in a while do something differenf from the co petition, subject to criteria 1 and 3.

Item number 4 is why Aussie wines were realy popular for awhile until the Europeans figured it out.

Posted: **Sat Aug 05, 2023 9:46 am**

Through no merit of my own, I once flew Air France from Paris to NYC on a corporate business class ticket that was upgraded to first class.

Before takeoff the purser circulated the aisles brandishing a frequently-replaced bottle of Piper-Heidsieck. He did it again later on, and at one point I think he might have had a bottle in each hand, although that might just be a fanciful enhancement in my recollection.

Posted: **Sat Aug 05, 2023 10:21 am**

If an airline punished me from traveling with them for skiplagging, I'd never travel with them ever again. Either come up with fair pricing for every leg of a trip, or fuck off.

Posted: **Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:04 pm**

Flew Alaska Airlines for the first time to Seattle and back, approximately five hours each way, in economy. I was going to upgrade to economy plus, but decided for such relatively short flights to stick with economy rather than paying $1,000 extra for a little extra room for four thin people. Luckily, the seats were somewhat roomy, so it was a good gamble. My next flight is more like eight plus hours. Going business class on that one.

We had a medical emergency on the flight, and I had all kinds of bad thoughts going through my mind about having to land somewhere else, and getting in late. But we didn't have to land until Pittsburgh. The flight out left at 7:40 AM, so I was able to sleep for a few hours, but I couldn't sleep on the red eye coming back. Being awake in the middle of the night is my idea of what going to hell would be. I'm not sure business class is going to be much better. I hate flying that much.

Posted: **Wed Aug 16, 2023 8:26 pm**

Volkonski wrote: ↑Fri Aug 04, 2023 3:08 pm https://onemileatatime.com/news/america ... ess-class/

American Airlines has started serving an Italian sparkling wine instead of a French champagne in Business Class.

Since I retired I no longer spend much time in Business Class on any airline. However even back then the wines served in Business Class were good but not great. I see no reason that a midpriced Italian sparkling wine might not be as good as a midpriced French champagne.

Thank you for reminding me that it’s Bellini Season.

Giuseppe Cipriani: :notworthy:

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