Fogbow

Ben-Prime wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:01 pm Is it wrong that when this is all over one way or the other, I will be glad never to read anything that Turley spews ever again?

Jeebus I hates me some Turley. More than once I've been listening to Fox on the radio and have thought to myself, who is this asshole they have on? And it's Turley. He's really bad.

SuzieC wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:14 pm

Ben-Prime wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:01 pm Is it wrong that when this is all over one way or the other, I will be glad never to read anything that Turley spews ever again?

I have no idea who Jonathan Turley is, but he sounds like an asshole. Wow, that was some explosive testimony. It seemed designed to draw Meadows and Cipolline out of their caves.

Turley is a hack lawyer that's always on Fox.

I'm shocked to learn Turley doesn't check his facts before running his mouth. /s

This is per the Civil Service Headquarters website - Link just below left:
https://civilservicehq.com/can-the-secr ... president/

By law, the Civil Service can override the President. The President communicates with the Secret Service about what he would like to do or where he wants to go. It is then up to the Secret Service to determine if it is a risk to national security for the President to do so. If not, a protection plan is formulated and executed by Secret Service agents.

That's not a surprise. I would think since it's their jobs to protect him, they would be permitted to do that. DFO, of course, would not. He's the effing king. It's a wonder he didn't say that instead of effing president.

It’s past time for the people who aren’t in criminal jeopardy to cut the bullshit, start acting like Americans again, and tell the whole truth. The jig is up. Stop covering up for this traitor.

SuzieC wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:14 pmI have no idea who Jonathan Turley is, but he sounds like an asshole.

Very briefly: Turley, like Eastman, was once a respected conservative law professor. Like, he was conservative, but mainline conservative; then, like so many, drank the Kool- Flavor-Aid, and became addicted to the attention for saying profoundly stupid things while fawning over the current right-wing fascism.

He's probably jealous of Eastman for being chosen to find the legal theory for the coup.

bob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:50 pm

Cf.:

while the incident in The Beast is important, it, is not, in my layman’s opinion, the most significant part of her testimony. the key part is where she testified that she heard Trump demand that the security barriers be removed so that he could have unfettered access to an armed mob acting on his orders.

Cassidy Hutchinson is witness number 1.

we need one more witness to confirm that Trump tried to wage war against the United States.

on the ketchup

NBC reporting that NBC sources say limo driver and agent would testify that Hutchinsons's testimony that Trump lunged for steering wheel, lunged for agent's throat, are not true. Ha Ha. We'll see.

AndyinPA wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:13 pm on the ketchup

Yes!

tek wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:21 pm Nobody could ever sell this screenplay.

Just not believable.. yet it appears to be reality.

Grabbing the wheel in the Beast? Throwing food at the wall in the small dining room?

Not the Beast, which would be a thing because its just physically a long way from the back to the steering wheel, but video from the day confirms that Trump rode in the SUV that day, which is almost a regular consumer version of the car and about like reaching from the back seat of a regular SUV to the front.

poplove wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:09 pm

The Menetekel, the fiery writing on the wall ?

The testimony about the steering wheel, while of true is mind blowing, is not really much by itself. It's hearsay evidence and they do need to ask the SS agents involved.

poplove wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:09 pm

So it begins.

Yeah, we can play this stuff out twice a week until election day. Drag every bleeding one of them in front of the camera, show them for the lying traitors they are.

All for a chintzy reality TV star from Queens who cheats on his wife, cheats at business and cheats at golf.

Gregg wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:52 pm The testimony about the steering wheel, while of true is mind blowing, is not really much by itself. It's hearsay evidence and they do need to ask the SS agents involved.

I agree. Plus I hate to see this take attention from the important issue. Trump did everything he could to encourage violence in the hope that the electoral votes wouldn’t be certified on the 6th. Then the ensuing chaos would work to his favor.

Chilidog wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:58 pmwhile the incident in The Beast is important, it, is not, in my layman’s opinion, the most significant part of her testimony.

Objectively, it isn't that important.

But it is the birther-esque trick for the "doubters" to point to one inconsistent/unexplained detail (e.g., Obama's "Connecticut" Social Security Number) that give them (self-granted) "permission" to discount everything. A laser-like focus on one particular tree to avoid acknowledging the forest's existence.

* * *

Gregg wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 6:43 pmNot the Beast, which would be a thing because its just physically a long way from the back to the steering wheel, but video from the day confirms that Trump rode in the SUV that day, which is almost a regular consumer version of the car and about like reaching from the back seat of a regular SUV to the front.

I've seen a few people say "the Beast" is akin to "Air Force One": that's the name when the president is the passenger, regardless of the vehicle. I'm not enough of a president-trivia fanboi to know if that's accurate.

Regardless, he clearly was in the SUV. Whether she (mistakenly) believed it was the Beast, called it "the Beast" because the president was in it, was nervous while testifying, or some other reason, ultimately is a distraction to both the overall theme of the testimony, as well as force of this particular anecdote.

I think the SS's biggest difficulties with Obama were his tendency to go and great people and his strolls about town. When he was driving Seinfeld's Vette around the grounds, he drove up to the gate, asked the guard if they would let him out, and they said, no sir. Always the gentleman, he said, okay, and drove back to the WH (of course he knew the answer but it made for good television).

"For completeness," everything Hutchinson said today is hearsay.

Because "hearsay" refers to out-of-court statements; Hutchinson spoke in Congress, which isn't a court.

But Hutchinson testified under oath; lying to Congress could lead to obstruction, perjury, or both charges. (See [pre-pardoned] Roger Stone.)


Now, Hutchinson testified that Ornato said the repeached Florida Man tried to grab the steering wheel.

If Hutchinson tried to testify to that in court, it would lead to a hearsay objection: Although she was testifying in court, she was only relating what someone told her, and not what she had personally perceived.

There are, however, many exceptions and exemptions to the hearsay rule; Ornato's statements to her could nonetheless still be admissible in court under a variety of circumstances.

Not that anyone is going to be prosecuted for any of this.

bob wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 7:16 pm

Chilidog wrote: ↑Tue Jun 28, 2022 5:58 pmwhile the incident in The Beast is important, it, is not, in my layman’s opinion, the most significant part of her testimony.

Objectively, it isn't that important.

But it is the birther-esque trick for the "doubters" to point to one inconsistent/unexplained detail (e.g., Obama's "Connecticut" Social Security Number) that give them (self-granted) "permission" to discount everything. A laser-like focus on one particular tree to avoid acknowledging the forest's existence.

Nail. Head.

Dinesh D'Souza @DineshDSouza wrote: NBC and CBS are reporting that both Trump’s driver and Secret Service agent are willing to testify under oath that Trump never attempted to grab the steering wheel. And just like that, today’s “bombshell” testimony at the #January6thCommiteeHearings is completely discredited