Fogbow

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 2:05 pm**

re above tweets, slightly offtopic

Trump’s Team of Lawyers Marked by Infighting and Possible Legal Troubles of Its Own
Several of the former president’s lawyers are under scrutiny by federal investigators amid squabbling over competence.

By Maggie Haberman and Glenn Thrush
Sept. 16, 2022

To understand the pressures, feuds and questions about competence within former President Donald J. Trump’s legal team as he faces potential prosecution on multiple fronts, consider the experience of Eric Herschmann, a former Trump White House lawyer who has been summoned to testify to a federal grand jury.

For weeks this summer, Mr. Herschmann tried to get specific guidance from Mr. Trump’s current lawyers on how to handle questions from prosecutors that raise issues of executive privilege or attorney-client privilege.

After ignoring Mr. Herschmann or giving him what he seemed to consider perplexing answers to the requests for weeks, two of the former president’s lawyers, M. Evan Corcoran and John Rowley, offered him only broad instructions in late August. Assert sweeping claims of executive privilege, they advised him, after Mr. Corcoran had suggested that an unspecified “chief judge” would ultimately validate their belief that a president’s powers extend far beyond their time in office.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/16/us/p ... hmann.html

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Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 2:22 pm**

So Bobb has lawyered up.

And

Mr. Corcoran, the son of a former Republican congressman from Illinois, has told associates that he is the former president’s “main” lawyer and has insisted to colleagues that he does not need to retain his own counsel, as Ms. Bobb has

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 3:40 pm**

jcolvin2 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 10:12 am The government filed a Notice of Appeal in the district court several days ago. (Because the government was enjoined, the injunction aspect of the case was immediately appealable.) The government also moved for a stay in the district court pending appeal. Once the district court denied the stay, the government asked the Circuit to impose a stay pending resolution of its appeal. (A litigant must typically ask the district court to stay its own order before asking the Circuit court to issue a stay.)

Excellent.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:05 pm**

And next, I suppose - I know less than zero about motion practice in federal appeals court, and even less than that about the 11th Circuit, but lemme guess here - the motion will be ruled upon in due course, meaning

I dunno when.

Also I dunno how the 11th Circuit decides WHO is going to be assigned to the appeal and - maybe completely separately

- WHO is going to rule on the Motion for Partial Stay. I think some federal appeals courts have motions panels that just rule on motions, isn't that right? All part of my less than zero knowledge, right there.

And of course I think I can safely assume that the Trump side gets to file a brief opposing the motion, and maybe even the gubbermint gets a reply brief, and ... and somebody who knows something (like jcolvin2, who seems to be on top of it even if he doesn't live anywhere near the 11th Circuit) can fill us in on what we can expect from here on out.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:26 pm**

JUST IN: Appeals court sets a Tuesday deadline for Trump to respond to DOJ’s motion for partial stay of Judge Cannon’s order

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm**

Kendra wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:26 pm

JUST IN: Appeals court sets a Tuesday deadline for Trump to respond to DOJ’s motion for partial stay of Judge Cannon’s order

And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:47 pm**

Greatgrey wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.

Ain't that a cryin' shame.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:49 pm**

Greatgrey wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm
JUST IN: Appeals court sets a Tuesday deadline for Trump to respond to DOJ’s motion for partial stay of Judge Cannon’s order
And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.

Now THAT'S the kind of response we're internationally galactically famous for, here at the Fogbow.

I ask what comes next and 21 minnits later Kendra jumps in with the answer, and Greatgrey promptly points out the ... well, not exactly conflicting, but difficult time pressures on Trump’s attorneys. Bingo.

'Course, he did pay Kise $3 million, I'm sure his team will step up to the plate with regard to both the brief and the hearing. You want to play with the big kids, better wear your big boy pants.

Edit: Trapped in a world I never made, I realize that you can be in Noo Yawk City for a hearing and file a brief electronically in another state. It's not onerous today.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:55 pm**

Speaking of Kise and the $3M payment, Neil Katyal was on MSNBC earlier this week and pointed out that this was a staggering figure for even the biggest cases. I don't think it's clear if this was a retainer in case he got stiff, or if those fees were already racked up for services rendered.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:56 pm**

much ado wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:47 pm
Greatgrey wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.
Ain't that a cryin' shame.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:01 pm**

Greatgrey wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.

This is a modestly promising development. The panel (not yet publicly announced) has substantially shortened Trump’s deadline for filing a reply, which would ordinarily be due on October [

] September 26. FRAP 27(a)(3)(A). This order suggests that the panel is treating the motion seriously and recognizes its urgency. The order might also reflect an understanding that they need to rule before the Special Master starts reviewing documents, but I dunno if we can say that much.

The need to travel to Brooklyn and prepare for the hearing before Judge Dearie will put stress on Trump's lawyers working on the response, but they should have anticipated this and prepared for it.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:03 pm**

Foggy wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:49 pm
Now THAT'S the kind of response we're internationally galactically famous for, here at the Fogbow.

I’m here to swerve.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:05 pm**

Kendra wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:55 pm Speaking of Kise and the $3M payment, Neil Katyal was on MSNBC earlier this week and pointed out that this was a staggering figure for even the biggest cases. I don't think it's clear if this was a retainer in case he got stiff, or if those fees were already racked up for services rendered.

I think Kise is new, so I assume a massive retainer that factors in a premium for the, umm ... "special" attributes of the worst client a lawyer could ever possibly find.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:09 pm**

chancery wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:01 pm
Greatgrey wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:33 pm And ShitGibbon’s lawyers are due in NY just 2 hours later to meet with the Special Master.
This is a modestly promising development. The panel (not yet publicly announced) has substantially shortened Trump’s deadline for filing a reply, which would ordinarily be due on October 26. FRAP 27(a)(3)(A). This order suggests that the panel is treating the motion seriously and recognizes its urgency. The order might also reflect an understanding that they need to rule before the Special Master starts reviewing documents, but I dunno if we can say that much.

The need to travel to Brooklyn and prepare for the hearing before Judge Dearie will put stress on Trump's lawyers working on the response, but they should have anticipated this and prepared for it.

Excellent analysis as always from chancery. This is drastic, imho. I can just imagine Trump's lawyers -

Wait, this morning our response to the Motion to Stay was due October 26th, and suddenly this afternoon it's due freakin' TUESDAY?

Sometimes you just gotta put the pedal to the metal.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:17 pm**

I'll admit, I was somewhat surprised that the gubbermint didn't make it an "Emergency" motion or something similar that would lead to an expedited ruling. I'm even more surprised about that now that I learned that in the ordinary course of things, Trump’s lawyers would have had until October 26th to even file an opposition.

But somebody at the 11th Circuit is paying attention.

This is fun.

Edit: OK, first time drunk in a long time, I'm at my dad's, he's got some stuff ... Where's the Virtual Drunk Tank at, brohendous?

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:20 pm**

Now the former guy just needs to allocate some of the free office space at T Tower, then his legal team can relocate early and camp out in NYC, work thru the weekend, file electronically by high noon and take the Uber to court.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:28 pm**

chancery wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:01 pm
which would ordinarily be due on October 26. FRAP 27(a)(3)(A).

October 26 or September 26? The general rule is 10 days to respond, is it not?

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:31 pm**

Foggy wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:17 pm I'll admit, I was somewhat surprised that the gubbermint didn't make it an "Emergency" motion or something similar that would lead to an expedited ruling. I'm even more surprised about that now that I learned that in the ordinary course of things, Trump’s lawyers would have had until October 26th to even file an opposition.

But somebody at the 11th Circuit is paying attention.

This is fun.

Edit: OK, first time drunk in a long time, I'm at my dad's, he's got some stuff ... Where's the Virtual Drunk Tank at, brohendous?

Am I misreading the Rule? As I understand it, they have 10 days from service, which would be 26 September. Am I missing something?

ETA: Ninja’d by Delarin

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:36 pm**

Too (also) late! Chancery said OCTOBER 26th, that settles it!

Pay no attention to the drunken rooster person.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:37 pm**

Delarin wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:28 pm
chancery wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:01 pm
which would ordinarily be due on October 26. FRAP 27(a)(3)(A).
October 26 or September 26? The general rule is 10 days to respond, is it not?

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:31 pm
Am I misreading the Rule? As I understand it, they have 10 days from service, which would be 26 September. Am I missing something?

ETA: Ninja’d by Delarin

You're both correct, and I corrected my post. I was thinking September but typed October.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:39 pm**

Foggy wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:36 pm Too (also) late! Chancery said OCTOBER 26th, that settles it!

Pay no attention to the drunken rooster person.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:41 pm**

Kendra wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 7:55 pm Speaking of Kise and the $3M payment, Neil Katyal was on MSNBC earlier this week and pointed out that this was a staggering figure for even the biggest cases. I don't think it's clear if this was a retainer in case he got stiff, or if those fees were already racked up for services rendered.

That's certainly a lot of money for a retainer. It's hard to assess how lucrative it is without knowing what Kise has committed to.

Having left Foley & Garder, Kise no longer has the support available from a large firm, especially the experienced associates and hard-driving junior partners that are crucial for carrying out high-stakes litigation successfully and profitably. We don't know, for instance, if Kise is expected to hire his own legal and support staff, or if he can rely on high quality support from other firms and lawyers willing to work for Trump behind the scenes. We also don't know if Kise has committed to represent Trump in any post-indictment proceedings, for which, IMO, $3 Million prolly wouldn't be nearly enough.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:53 pm**

httArt of the deal: Trump’s $3 million retainer to Kise is three times what Maduro’s people paid.

https://nytimes.com/2022/09/16/us/polit ... 5482935297

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 10:31 pm**

Kendra wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 8:53 pm httArt of the deal: Trump’s $3 million retainer to Kise is three times what Maduro’s people paid.

https://nytimes.com/2022/09/16/us/polit ... 5482935297

Is it even legal for TFG to use his Super PAC's money for this? I know that until he formally announces a run for the WH, the rules are a little more lenient that they will be after the announcement. But it seems to me to be a bit beyond the pale that he can use political donations to pay for personal legal expenses in what is potentially a criminal investigation.

Posted: **Sat Sep 17, 2022 11:54 pm**

noblepa wrote: ↑Sat Sep 17, 2022 10:31 pm Is it even legal for TFG to use his Super PAC's money for this?

It's so sweet that you think that might be a remotely relevant question in Trumpworld!

Fogbow

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