Fogbow

Posted: **Wed Apr 26, 2023 5:01 pm**

Eric Trump appears to have deleted the tweet in question.

Posted: **Wed Apr 26, 2023 5:32 pm**

New York Times

Breaking News: E. Jean Carroll’s testimony accusing Donald Trump of rape detailed a harrowing assault in the mid-1990s that she says ended her romantic life forever. She said she has since not been able to form a romantic relationship or had sex.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/04/26 ... &smtyp=cur

https://mas.to/@cnexnews/110267219461036262

Posted: **Wed Apr 26, 2023 7:40 pm**

Thanks to all who answered my question about prior acts.

Posted: **Wed Apr 26, 2023 8:26 pm**

Volkonski wrote: ↑Wed Apr 26, 2023 5:32 pm New York Times

Breaking News: E. Jean Carroll’s testimony accusing Donald Trump of rape detailed a harrowing assault in the mid-1990s that she says ended her romantic life forever. She said she has since not been able to form a romantic relationship or had sex.

https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/04/26 ... &smtyp=cur

https://mas.to/@cnexnews/110267219461036262

If anyone could ruin your sexual/romantic life for all eternity, it would be Donnie Depends.

What a disgusting piece of garbage.

Posted: **Wed Apr 26, 2023 9:41 pm**

Totally agree resume18. A vile disgusting experience like that is enough to turn a woman off men and sex forever.

Posted: **Thu Apr 27, 2023 1:34 pm**

Day 3, lots from ICP. Lunch break now until 2pm EDT.

ICP unrolled thread reader: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1651 ... 25440.html

Posted: **Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:57 pm**

Judge pauses testimony in E. Jean Carroll trial with accuser on the stand

Fri, April 28, 2023 at 1:37 PM GMT+2

Trump’s attorney was cross-examining E. Jean Carroll when he brought up the dress Carroll wore the day of the alleged attack, prompting the judge to end the testimony over concerns about DNA evidence.

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/judge-pauses- ... 50135.html

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 9:29 am**

orlylicious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 1:34 pm Day 3, lots from ICP. Lunch break now until 2pm EDT.

Catching up, drinking my coffee, this morning and I'm thinking "what do the Juggalos have do do with this?"

Oops... Need more coffee.

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 9:31 am**

I had to put that together (but I did).

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 9:37 am**

Chilidog wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 9:29 am
orlylicious wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 1:34 pm Day 3, lots from ICP. Lunch break now until 2pm EDT.
Catching up, drinking my coffee, this morning and I'm thinking "what do the Juggalos have do do with this?"

Oops... Need more coffee.

Me too, apparently, as that was my first thought as well

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:40 pm**

RTH10260 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:57 pm
Judge pauses testimony in E. Jean Carroll trial with accuser on the stand

Fri, April 28, 2023 at 1:37 PM GMT+2

Trump’s attorney was cross-examining E. Jean Carroll when he brought up the dress Carroll wore the day of the alleged attack, prompting the judge to end the testimony over concerns about DNA evidence.

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/judge-pauses- ... 50135.html

That was a dirty trick to put in jurors minds that "oh, there's a dress? Well there must not be any DNA or we'd be seeing it". Joe Taco Tuesday was told before trial that it wasn't admissible and I sorely hope the Judge sanctions him for it. Also, too, now that it's been put in their minds, I think the only fair thing to do is to inform them that yes, there is a dress, but Trump refused to provide DNA so it won't be admitted into evidence for that reason. Le them stew on why Trump refused.

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:57 pm**

Me too, apparently, as that was my first thought as well

I try never to think of them. And yet, I got the reference. Oh no.

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:58 pm**

Was this the case where someone wondered if Mary Trump’s DNA would suffice? And what did they decide?

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:21 pm**

Gregg wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:40 pm
RTH10260 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:57 pm
Judge pauses testimony in E. Jean Carroll trial with accuser on the stand

Fri, April 28, 2023 at 1:37 PM GMT+2

Trump’s attorney was cross-examining E. Jean Carroll when he brought up the dress Carroll wore the day of the alleged attack, prompting the judge to end the testimony over concerns about DNA evidence.

https://www.yahoo.com/gma/judge-pauses- ... 50135.html

That was a dirty trick to put in jurors minds that "oh, there's a dress? Well there must not be any DNA or we'd be seeing it". Joe Taco Tuesday was told before trial that it wasn't admissible and I sorely hope the Judge sanctions him for it. Also, too, now that it's been put in their minds, I think the only fair thing to do is to inform them that yes, there is a dress, but Trump refused to provide DNA so it won't be admitted into evidence for that reason. Le them stew on why Trump refused.

Agree 100%. I hope Carroll's attorneys come out swinging Monday morning demanding that the judge do exactly that, otherwise I think it could be grounds for a mistrial.

Posted: **Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:28 pm**

Gregg wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:40 pm That was a dirty trick to put in jurors minds that "oh, there's a dress? Well there must not be any DNA or we'd be seeing it". Joe Taco Tuesday was told before trial that it wasn't admissible and I sorely hope the Judge sanctions him for it. Also, too, now that it's been put in their minds, I think the only fair thing to do is to inform them that yes, there is a dress, but Trump refused to provide DNA so it won't be admitted into evidence for that reason. Le them stew on why Trump refused.

One can hope...

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 10:25 am**

SuzieC wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:21 pm
Gregg wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 3:40 pm
RTH10260 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 11:57 pm
That was a dirty trick to put in jurors minds that "oh, there's a dress? Well there must not be any DNA or we'd be seeing it". Joe Taco Tuesday was told before trial that it wasn't admissible and I sorely hope the Judge sanctions him for it. Also, too, now that it's been put in their minds, I think the only fair thing to do is to inform them that yes, there is a dress, but Trump refused to provide DNA so it won't be admitted into evidence for that reason. Le them stew on why Trump refused.
Agree 100%. I hope Carroll's attorneys come out swinging Monday morning demanding that the judge do exactly that, otherwise I think it could be grounds for a mistrial.

Same. I think that is the only fair thing to do. The judge already had given Trump a favor by not allowing Ms Carroll to bring it up, and Taco knew it was off limits and knew what he was doing. I agree in hopes that the judge will give a statement that Trump refused to give DNA for comparison.

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 11:06 am**

Yeah, but Jean Carroll doesn't want a mistrial. Absolutely not. Last thing in the world.

She wants to put on the rest of her evidence, and let the world see it, and get a jury verdict that Donald Trump raped her.

A mistrial means more years of delay. A mistrial means the trial stops now. And if Trump can get a mistrial just by asking about the dress, what's to stop him from getting another mistrial the next time and the time after that? Oh, oops, I forgot again that I wasn't supposed to mention that dress, Judge.

No, what should happen now is that the judge should craft a statement for the jury about how Ms. Carroll still has the dress, but Trump refuses to provide a sample of his DNA, and so the judge ordered Taco Pie not to mention the dress, because it would lead to speculation. But Taco Pie violated the court order because he's a asshat (this can be translated into appropriate legal language), so now the judge is telling them the whole story, so they won't speculate.

Of course, then Trump is a goner.

They'll be able to figure out in about two minutes that if Trump hadn't raped her, he could have ended the case immediately by simply submitting some DNA for testing. If his DNA doesn't match the dress, case over.

And they'll wonder why he spent all the money on lawyers fighting the case, instead of simply giving them some DNA.

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:03 pm**

The recent posts on the DNA issue don't reflect its complexities, including that Trump made a squirrelly 11th hour conditional offer to provide DNA evidence, an offer with strings attached that would have likely delayed the trial for at least six months.

The whole story is laid out in Judge Kaplan's 21 page memorandum opinion rejecting Trump's proposal.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap ... 5.56.0.pdf

Of particular note is this on p. 20

Nor is it clear that injecting a DNA issue into the case at this late date would be likely to produce any important evidence for several reasons.

First, even if there were a "match" between Mr. Trump's DNA sample and the mixture of DNA recovered on Ms. Carroll's dress, that would tend only to show that there was some encounter between Mr. Trump and Ms. Carroll on at least one occasion when she wore that dress. But it would not prove or disprove Ms. Carroll's rape allegation. [As the court noted earlier in the opinion, while DNA was recovered, no markers for semen were recovered.]

Second, even if a DNA analysis were to determine that Mr. Trump could be eliminated as a potential contributor to the mixture of DNA found on Ms. Carroll's dress, the probative value of such a determination would be very far from conclusive. It would not disprove Ms. Carroll's accusation. The alleged rape could have occurred without a sufficient quantity or quality of Mr. Trump's DNA to have remained on the dress since the mid 1990s.

Third, it is possible that the results of further DNA analysis using Mr. Trump's DNA sample would be entirely inconclusive.

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:31 pm**

Foggy wrote: ↑Sun Apr 30, 2023 11:06 am Yeah, but Jean Carroll doesn't want a mistrial. Absolutely not. Last thing in the world.

She wants to put on the rest of her evidence, and let the world see it, and get a jury verdict that Donald Trump raped her.

A mistrial means more years of delay. A mistrial means the trial stops now. And if Trump can get a mistrial just by asking about the dress, what's to stop him from getting another mistrial the next time and the time after that? Oh, oops, I forgot again that I wasn't supposed to mention that dress, Judge.

No, what should happen now is that the judge should craft a statement for the jury about how Ms. Carroll still has the dress, but Trump refuses to provide a sample of his DNA, and so the judge ordered Taco Pie not to mention the dress, because it would lead to speculation. But Taco Pie violated the court order because he's a asshat (this can be translated into appropriate legal language), so now the judge is telling them the whole story, so they won't speculate.

Of course, then Trump is a goner.

This is my dream too. The whole dress/dna issue was a setup from the day the judge told the parties not to bring up DNA. All Taco has to do is bring it up, however obliquely, and there is nothing the plaintiff can do, because a mistrial only helps fuckhead. The only solution is for the judge to explain how many YEARS fuckhead fought the DNA test, and that when it was finally ordered, he refused to do it. But IMO no judge on this Earth would have the guts to lay out the truth in that way.

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 8:01 pm**

p0rtia wrote: ↑Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:31 pm
The only solution is for the judge to explain how many YEARS fuckhead fought the DNA test, and that when it was finally ordered, he refused to do it.

Except that the DNA was never ordered. Carroll finally served a discovery request for it, Trump objected, and Carroll never moved to compel. Then, in February, Trump filed a bad-faith motion for an order (i) requiring Carroll to produce an appendix to her DNA expert's report (which Trump's counsel had known about for years and never requested), and (ii) implicitly allowing Trump to delay trial for months while he engaged in an extended meaningless ExpertWitnessPalooza, in exchange for which he said he would deliver a DNA sample, but with room to back out.

So it's tricky.

But IMO no judge on this Earth would have the guts to lay out the truth in that way.

I dunno. Judge Kaplan is known for being an extreme hard-ass. He had attorney Steven Donziger prosecuted, disbarred, and imprisoned for criminal contempt for violating a discovery order.* So he might be able to craft an instruction that meets this situation.

______
* I'm oversimplifying a weirdly fucked-up situation.

Posted: **Sun Apr 30, 2023 8:40 pm**

Never heard of Inner City Press or Matthew Lee until I started seeing their amazingly detailed coverage of the Trump rape trial a few days ago. And their coverage of other cases seems outstanding. They've apparently been doing the Lord's work for awhile. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inner_City_Press

So this sucks.

https://twitter.com/innercitypress/stat ... 7678552065

Inner City Press
@innercitypress
Update: YouTube demonetized this, about the Carroll v Trump trial - unclear on what basis...
Quote Tweet
Inner City Press
@innercitypress
·
Apr 29
E. Jean Carroll Trumpster Dumpster Blues
by Matthew Russell Lee, Inner City Press
Epstein with the Trumpster / a fire in this dumpster
My Cousin Vinny caps off the week
Some at Bergdorf the truth may seek
Fitting room open after empty escalator
Verdict comes later
Others this weekend, on Ukraine and Sam Bankman-Fried, not demonetized. What is it about the Carroll v. Trump trial video?

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 8:03 am**

According to a report from ABC7, Donald Trump attorney Joe Tacopina has requested a mistrial in the case in the Manhattan courtroom where writer E. Jean Carroll has accused the former president of rape and defamation.

With the trial expected to resume on Monday, the attorney made the filing at dawn, attacking Judge Lewis Kaplan's conduct during the four day trial.

The report states, "Defense attorney Joe Tacopina said the judge has mischaracterized elements of the case and improperly shut down certain lines of questioning during cross examination. Tacopina said he should have been allowed to explore why Carroll did not pursue security camera footage from the store and why Carroll did not go to the police following the alleged rape."

In his filing, he wrote, "Proof that Plaintiff never attempted to determine if any such footage of the parties existed constitutes circumstantial evidence that her accusation is false."
....

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-e-jean-c ... 659933926/

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 10:19 am**

Sorry for the ICP (Inner City Press) confusion

Chancery, you bring up a great point about their work. I remember the Roy Moore v Sasha Baron Cohen coverage, they were one of the only journalists in the courtroom for some of the hearings. For some reason, I associate them with Shiva Ayyadurai but think I'm misremembering. But they really are worthy of a donation, I'm going to try to give a little something when the Carroll trial wraps up.

He's back... guess Ashtray Joe was turned down again (or Judge Kaplan is going to deal with it later). But cross continues.

Inner City Press @innercitypress 14m
OK - Carroll v. Trump trial resumes now, after sealed filings (Inner City Press has written to the Court seeking to unseal https://documentcloud.org/documents/237 ... licp050123), Tacopina moved for mistrial https://patreon.com/posts/82327756, now resumes cross examination. I'll live tweet, thread below

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 10:51 am**

chancery wrote: ↑Sun Apr 30, 2023 8:01 pm
p0rtia wrote: ↑Sun Apr 30, 2023 2:31 pm
The only solution is for the judge to explain how many YEARS fuckhead fought the DNA test, and that when it was finally ordered, he refused to do it.
Except that the DNA was never ordered. Carroll finally served a discovery request for it, Trump objected, and Carroll never moved to compel.

Yep, I was wrong on the "ordered" point (and I could have sworn....) But I think "finally" is incorrect, isn't it? She/counsel sent the report of the DNA found on to the dress to TFG, and requested that he submit to a DNA test in January 2020, shortly after the test was conducted.

Then, in February,

February 2023

Trump filed a bad-faith motion for an order (i) requiring Carroll to produce an appendix to her DNA expert's report (which Trump's counsel had known about for years and never requested), and (ii) implicitly allowing Trump to delay trial for months while he engaged in an extended meaningless ExpertWitnessPalooza, in exchange for which he said he would deliver a DNA sample, but with room to back out.

So it's tricky.

But IMO no judge on this Earth would have the guts to lay out the truth in that way.
I dunno. Judge Kaplan is known for being an extreme hard-ass. He had attorney Steven Donziger prosecuted, disbarred, and imprisoned for criminal contempt for violating a discovery order.* So he might be able to craft an instruction that meets this situation.

______
* I'm oversimplifying a weirdly fucked-up situation.

Posted: **Mon May 01, 2023 11:04 am**

Confirmation:

Adam Klasfeld @KlasfeldReports 36m
Blink and you might have missed it:
Judge Kaplan denied Tacopina's mistrial motion without comment this morning before trial officially began.
More on that in a story later.

Also, we all love Adam Klasfeld and he's on it and providing what seem to be direct quotes:

Fogbow

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America (poll added!)

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America

E. Jean Carroll v. Donald J. Trump and United States of America