Fogbow

somerset wrote: ↑Sat May 01, 2021 10:36 pm

much ado wrote: ↑Sat May 01, 2021 10:16 pm

LM K wrote: ↑Sat May 01, 2021 10:00 pm Any chance Rudy received a secret pardon or pre-emptive pardon?

And if Rudy did receive such a pardon, is there any chance that the courts would hold the pardon to be lawful?

This is ridiculous, NY Times has gotten so sloppy. Other outlets picked it up; if the Gray Lady wants to be a credible source, she needs to stop printing first and fact-checking afterward.

Beat me to it. I came here to post the same thing.

I got a kick out of this. I guess I will have to search and see if we have a political funnies in the new Fogbow.

Maggie Haberman
@maggieNYT
·
9m
NEWS - Giuliani allies have been pressing for Trump team to have Trump's legal defense money cover Rudy legal bills Ben Protess and me

good luck with that!

tek wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:48 pm good luck with that!

Yep, poor Rudy. Prostituted himself for Trump and finds out Trump stiffs prostitutes. Maybe he can pull a Cohen and flip.

Jim wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:50 pm

tek wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:48 pm good luck with that!

Yep, poor Rudy. Prostituted himself for Trump and finds out Trump stiffs prostitutes. Maybe he can pull a Cohen and flip.

I'm pretty sure the Feds would tell Rudy to kindly go fuck himself.

He's had this coming for a long time.

I think if he doesn't flip, he will also fuck himself. He's in a really bad place.

Jim wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:50 pm

tek wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:48 pm good luck with that!

Yep, poor Rudy. Prostituted himself for Trump and finds out Trump stiffs prostitutes. Maybe he can pull a Cohen and flip.

Who’s he going to flip on? He’s the big fish. I think the likelihood of the Justice Department going after Trump is zero.

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:03 pmWho’s he going to flip on? He’s the big fish. I think the likelihood of the Justice Department going after Trump is zero.

Barr. But I'd put that at zero as well.

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:03 pm

Jim wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:50 pm

tek wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:48 pm good luck with that!

Yep, poor Rudy. Prostituted himself for Trump and finds out Trump stiffs prostitutes. Maybe he can pull a Cohen and flip.

Who’s he going to flip on? He’s the big fish. I think the likelihood of the Justice Department going after Trump is zero.

Giuliani: Profiles in stupid. trump would have been impeached and removed from office for high crimes in the Ukraine affair had it not been for the republicans and their trump crime coverup. Now comes Giuliani, doing the same on a much larger scale. Did Rudy not even think of the repercussions in the event of a trump defeat?

Hahahahaaahahahahahaaaahahahaha!
(deep breath)
Hahahahahahaaahahahahahahahahaa!

Play stupid games




.......................................


fuck mr noun, verb and 9/11

zekeb wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:09 pm

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:03 pm

Jim wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 3:50 pm

Yep, poor Rudy. Prostituted himself for Trump and finds out Trump stiffs prostitutes. Maybe he can pull a Cohen and flip.

Who’s he going to flip on? He’s the big fish. I think the likelihood of the Justice Department going after Trump is zero.

Giuliani: Profiles in stupid. trump would have been impeached and removed from office for high crimes in the Ukraine affair had it not been for the republicans and their trump crime coverup. Now comes Giuliani, doing the same on a much larger scale. Did Rudy not even think of the repercussions in the event of a trump defeat?

Giuliani was counting on a Trump pardon. But I suspect Trump got pissed off when Giuliani had the audacity to hand Trump a legal bill and ask to be paid.

sterngard friegen wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 7:15 pm

zekeb wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:09 pm

Maybenaut wrote: ↑Tue May 04, 2021 5:03 pm

Who’s he going to flip on? He’s the big fish. I think the likelihood of the Justice Department going after Trump is zero.

Giuliani: Profiles in stupid. trump would have been impeached and removed from office for high crimes in the Ukraine affair had it not been for the republicans and their trump crime coverup. Now comes Giuliani, doing the same on a much larger scale. Did Rudy not even think of the repercussions in the event of a trump defeat?

Giuliani was counting on a Trump pardon. But I suspect Trump got pissed off when Giuliani had the audacity to hand Trump a legal bill and ask to be paid.

Rudy was also a very public and spectacular failure in his efforts to overturn the election. In Trump's eyes, one of the worst things one can do is to fail him.

BOGO Tuesdays at a Naval Base.

Giuliani evidence should be reviewed by an outside lawyer, Justice Dept. says

Federal prosecutors have asked a judge to appoint an outside lawyer to review the records seized from Rudolph W. Giuliani — echoing the Justice Department’s pursuit of a criminal case against a previous attorney for former president Donald Trump, Michael Cohen.
In a letter unsealed Tuesday, federal prosecutors in Manhattan asked U.S. District Judge J. Paul Oetken to appoint what’s known as a special master to examine evidence taken late last month from the former New York mayor’s home and office. They cited the Cohen case as a past example when such an appointment helped to show that Trump’s lawyer was treated fairly.
FBI agents seized cellphones and other electronic devices from Giuliani, as well as the cellphone of D.C.-area lawyer Victoria Toensing, as part of an investigation to determine whether Giuliani acted as an unregistered agent of foreign interests. Giuliani, who worked as a lawyer for Trump in 2019 and 2020, the time frame under investigation, has not been charged and has denied any wrongdoing.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... story.html

I know that Rudy has claimed that the search of his apartment and office and seizure of his electronic devices is illegal, but I'm surprised I haven't heard him and others screaming about attorney-client privilege. This, even though the search was ostensibly about Rudy's own actions in Ukraine, not to get evidence against Trump.

That's what the special master request is for; to have someone, not involved with the case, go through the evidence and determine what part, if any, of it is truly privileged and what is not.

The retired federal judge who did the Michael Cohen review should do Rudy’s, if she is willing. She did an expeditious job last time.

Alan "Motormouth" Dershowitz has claimed just that, among other things..

Reading the privileged information is damaging enough to Giuliani or any of his clients, because of "tainting" prosecutors who tend to privately share information with each other.

"What the government does is they seize it all, and then they give it to some prosecutors: They call them the taint team," Dershowitz said. "Those prosecutors read all the privileged information and they decide what to turn over to the prosecution team.

Dershowitz added, the prosecutors then say,"'Well, all right, this is privileged, so we won't use it in a trial,' but the government has already read it. That's illegal. The 4th Amendment doesn't protect you only against criminal prosecution, it protects your privacy, and so in situations like this, they should always use a subpoena, not a search warrant."

Dershowitz acknowledged to Higbie he has advised Giuliani's lawyers in this case pro bono.

Dershowitz is again full of shit. I heard he had a brother who was a fairly respected criminal defense lawyer, but the person said Alan has always been a blowhard. I can vouch for that.

tek wrote: ↑Wed May 05, 2021 10:06 am Alan "Motormouth" Dershowitz has claimed just that, among other things..

Reading the privileged information is damaging enough to Giuliani or any of his clients, because of "tainting" prosecutors who tend to privately share information with each other.

"What the government does is they seize it all, and then they give it to some prosecutors: They call them the taint team," Dershowitz said. "Those prosecutors read all the privileged information and they decide what to turn over to the prosecution team.

Dershowitz added, the prosecutors then say,"'Well, all right, this is privileged, so we won't use it in a trial,' but the government has already read it. That's illegal. The 4th Amendment doesn't protect you only against criminal prosecution, it protects your privacy, and so in situations like this, they should always use a subpoena, not a search warrant."

Dershowitz acknowledged to Higbie he has advised Giuliani's lawyers in this case pro bono.

As I understand it, in the Cohen case, the material was handed over to the special master, unopened. The special master then examined the evidence and separated it into privileged and unprivileged. The privileged material was returned to Cohen and the unprivileged material was given to the prosecution team. The prosecutors, as I remember it, never saw the privileged material.

This procedure was followed just so that what Dershowitz is claiming can't happen. The prosecutors can't be influenced by the privileged information, even if they choose not to use it in court.

I can only assume that the prosecutors in Rudy's case will follow a similar protocol. They're not stupid.

If Dershowitz were right, it would mean that lawyers would, in effect, be immune from prosecution, because, in his mind, it seems to be impossible to separate privileged from unprivileged information and impossible to avoid the prosecution being "tainted" by knowledge of privileged information.

I don't know what happened to Dershowitz. My first memory of him was, I think, during the OJ Simpson trial and later in Bill Clinton's impeachment trial. He seemed sane back then. Not now. I think maybe he's smoking the same stuff that Rudy is. Rudy also appeared to be sane at one time. Both seem to have lost their minds over their contact with the mouse of Mar a Lago.

Hypothetically, one can sort of understand Dershowitz's point. (Ugh, I think I threw up a little in my mouth typing that.)

There have been cases in the past of prosecutors, even federal prosecutors, getting their hands on privileged information and then reverse engineering cases from that privileged information. The biggest problem has usually been with supposedly inadvertent monitoring and recording of attorney-client phone calls from inmates in facilities. Once a prosecutor sees or hears something, there are any number of ways he or she could work an investigation to launder the fact that the whole thing is fruit of an exceedingly poisonous tree.

The thing is, the cases where that happens aren't the high-profile cases. It's the cases where the defendant has limited resources for hiring counsel or investigators. Of course they're going to play the Giuliani case by the numbers, because if they got caught breaking the rules, they know it's their ass.