Fogbow

northland10 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 21, 2022 9:37 pm I am, however, confused. Conservatives are all about free-market and no government intrusion, or so they say. Yet, they want Biden to fix the gas prices which could be intrusion into a private industry. If we are supposed to believe that everything is better when the market dictates, then the market is dictating higher gas prices and the public keeps buying.

neonzx wrote: ↑Sun Jun 12, 2022 6:18 pm I just checked online at my local Walmart -- prices of the two biggest brands (Bud and Miller) are stable, but all the products are "Out of Stock".

noblepa wrote: ↑Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:01 pm Does anyone really believe that the gas companies will actually lower the price of gas by that purported $0.18?

I think that gas prices might drop as much as five cents, but the gas companies will simply pocket the rest.

Even if the gas companies do the honorable thing (yeah, I know) and lower the wholesale price by 18 cents, many retailers will not make a corresponding adjustment to the pump price.

Chad Pergram @ChadPergram wrote: Dem VA Sen Warner on proposed gas tax policy: I want to get more data on whether this kind of savings would actually be passed on to consumers.

noblepa wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 4:50 pm As much as I would love to see gas prices come down, I think a gas tax holiday is a waste of time.

I think it would save a lot of time and effort if the government would simply write a check to the oil industry for a couple of billion dollars, because that is what the result will be; a massive subsidy for the industry and almost no change for the consumer.

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:09 pm

noblepa wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 4:50 pm As much as I would love to see gas prices come down, I think a gas tax holiday is a waste of time.

I think it would save a lot of time and effort if the government would simply write a check to the oil industry for a couple of billion dollars, because that is what the result will be; a massive subsidy for the industry and almost no change for the consumer.

They already do: The oil companies receive huge subsidies to keep fuel prices down, unlike most of the rest of the civilized world. They include, but are not limited to....

---Special income tax treatment of intangible drilling costs.

---Permitting the LIFO method (last in first out) of accounting for inventory. This results in an understatement of inventory because inventory purchased today costs more than inventory produced last year. In other words, the inventory costs deducted as product is sold (cost of goods sold) are those incurred most recently, not those that were acquired years, if not decades past. Think of layers of inventory, with the deduction always taken from the top.

---Royalty payments to foreign governments. Instead of taking a deduction for these royalty payments and reducing taxable income, the Code permits these royalty payments to be classified as a foreign tax. No deduction, but a dollar-for-dollar reduction in tax. Income tax advice #2 is that a tax credit is always better than a tax deduction.

---Petroleum shipped in US navigable waterways do not pay a tonnage fee to ship their products, unlike other commodities.

---Percentage depletion of 15%. This is an annual deduction based upon the gross revenue from oil and gas extraction. This goes on for as long as a well produces crude or natural gas.

There are others as well.

I don't think we can easily figure how much money the oil companies save with these and other benefits, but it is not a trivial amount.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:20 pm Maybe I'm the outlier (as usual) but if you can't afford an extra $3-$4.00 per fill up, how the hell are you buying tires and tags and insurance?

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:56 pm

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:20 pm Maybe I'm the outlier (as usual) but if you can't afford an extra $3-$4.00 per fill up, how the hell are you buying tires and tags and insurance?

I cannot say with absolute certainty. But I believe that many folks spend their money as fast as they acquire it. And many people spend their money foolishly. So, they do buy tires, pay for their tags, and have some sort of insurance. And many people are maxed out on credit cards to boot.

So, that extra $3-$4 per fill up means that they can't spend that money on non-essential things. Not being judgmental, we all have our impulses and bad habits. And if they can't get their pack of smokes, or pay a little more on the credit cards, or get their jet skis repaired, well, they are pissed.

But I think you slipped a digit. Gas prices are more than a dollar today than before. With a 15-gallon fill-up, they're out of pocket $15-$20 or more, depending on state and tank size.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:20 pm Maybe I'm the outlier (as usual) but if you can't afford an extra $3-$4.00 per fill up, how the hell are you buying tires and tags and insurance?

Right now, the federal government charges an 18 cent tax per gallon of gasoline and a 24 cent tax per gallon of diesel. Those taxes fund critical highways and public transportation, through the Highway Trust Fund. But in this unique moment, with gas prices near $5 a gallon on average across the country, President Biden is calling on Congress to suspend the gas tax for three months – until the end of September – to give Americans a little extra breathing room as they deal with the effects of Putin’s war in Ukraine.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:05 pm

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:56 pm

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:20 pm Maybe I'm the outlier (as usual) but if you can't afford an extra $3-$4.00 per fill up, how the hell are you buying tires and tags and insurance?

I cannot say with absolute certainty. But I believe that many folks spend their money as fast as they acquire it. And many people spend their money foolishly. So, they do buy tires, pay for their tags, and have some sort of insurance. And many people are maxed out on credit cards to boot.

So, that extra $3-$4 per fill up means that they can't spend that money on non-essential things. Not being judgmental, we all have our impulses and bad habits. And if they can't get their pack of smokes, or pay a little more on the credit cards, or get their jet skis repaired, well, they are pissed.

But I think you slipped a digit. Gas prices are more than a dollar today than before. With a 15-gallon fill-up, they're out of pocket $15-$20 or more, depending on state and tank size.

18 cents per gallon of federal tax on a 20 gallon tank is $3.60.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-roo ... x-holiday/

Patagoniagirl wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:21 pm

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:05 pm

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 6:56 pm

I cannot say with absolute certainty. But I believe that many folks spend their money as fast as they acquire it. And many people spend their money foolishly. So, they do buy tires, pay for their tags, and have some sort of insurance. And many people are maxed out on credit cards to boot.

So, that extra $3-$4 per fill up means that they can't spend that money on non-essential things. Not being judgmental, we all have our impulses and bad habits. And if they can't get their pack of smokes, or pay a little more on the credit cards, or get their jet skis repaired, well, they are pissed.

But I think you slipped a digit. Gas prices are more than a dollar today than before. With a 15-gallon fill-up, they're out of pocket $15-$20 or more, depending on state and tank size.

18 cents per gallon of federal tax on a 20 gallon tank is $3.60.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-roo ... x-holiday/

$3.60 for the tank? I think not. BS. In 2021, gas here was $3/gallon. Today, $4.10. a gallon. I'm no math wiz, but that is $1.10 PER GALLON.. figure your tank capacity and it's much more than 3-4 bucks per tank.

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:40 pm Sorry, Sugar.

I was not aware, or was not paying attention that you were referring solely to the gas tax holiday.

But I stand by my response. Lotsa folks are maxed out and don't have any cash reserves for the proverbial rainy day. An extra three or four bucks per week (or more depending upon commute and other things) might mean they have to skimp elsewhere.

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:42 pm

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:40 pm Sorry, Sugar.

I was not aware, or was not paying attention that you were referring solely to the gas tax holiday.

But I stand by my response. Lotsa folks are maxed out and don't have any cash reserves for the proverbial rainy day. An extra three or four bucks per week (or more depending upon commute and other things) might mean they have to skimp elsewhere.

But that's true of anything, including food and housing and electricity.

Patagoniagirl wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 8:04 pm

sugar magnolia wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:42 pm

humblescribe wrote: ↑Thu Jun 23, 2022 7:40 pm Sorry, Sugar.

I was not aware, or was not paying attention that you were referring solely to the gas tax holiday.

But I stand by my response. Lotsa folks are maxed out and don't have any cash reserves for the proverbial rainy day. An extra three or four bucks per week (or more depending upon commute and other things) might mean they have to skimp elsewhere.

But that's true of anything, including food and housing and electricity.

So, what was your point? That folks of limited income flout the law? Or they gripe about gas prices because it cuts into their income so they don't pay their tags renewal, taxes, and tires.

I certainly don't begrudge people who are fortunate to have some disposal of income. I do begrudge those who have that, passing judgment on those less fortunate. I hope you and yours are fortunate, but don't think I'm not annoyed that your statement
"How are you affording tags, tires....". I felt that that was a slam towards people with little financial ability and if they can afford that...shut up and pay more for gas without bitching. Like no one is bitching about gas. Right?