State of New York vs Trump, et al - the civil fraud case against the Trump Organization

[MN-Skeptic]

So the Trump family can just go to Jared Kushner for the money. After all, he got $2 billion from Saudi Arabia.

Please. That's the amount of Saudi funds that Kushner is being paid to "manage." I'm sure that he makes a tidy sum from management fees, and if he profits additionally from insider and self-dealing side deals, I wouldn't, as Dorothy Parker said about the girls attending a Yale prom, be at all surprised.

But the $2 billion isn't money in his pocket.

Ok. Then sell Mar-a-lago. Trump keeps insisting that it's worth over $1 billion. I bet you Saudi Arabia would buy it!

[AndyinPA]

tfg has no clue what remorse is. He couldn't even fake it.

[chancery]

There is substantial evidence that Allen Weisselberg’s $2 million separation agreement was negotiated to compensate him for his continued non-cooperation with any entities with any legal interests “adverse” to defendants. Moreover, as Weisselberg was a critical player in nearly every instance of fraud, it would be inequitable to allow him to profit from his actions by covering up defendants’ misdeeds.

Accordingly, Allen Weisselberg is liable for the money he has received from this separation agreement as ill-gotten gains. S.E.C. v Razmilovic, 738 F 3d 14, 33 (2d Cir 2013) (“The court also reasonably ruled that Razmilovic should disgorge his $5 million severance payment”). Although he was promised $2 million in total, at the time of his testimony, he had received only $1 million. PX 1751. Accordingly, Allen Weisselberg must disgorge the $1 million he has already received as ill-gotten gains.

I don't know about that. In fact, this passage gives me some agita. If there is direct evidence of a quid pro quo, the judge should have mentioned it.

There's no doubt that Weisselberg was deeply complicit in the Trump fraud; he was convicted for it, and the evidence at this trial confirms it. And the credibility of his testimony in this proceeding was severely injured, even if he doesn't eventually plead guilty to perjury.

But while the separation agreement looks pretty stinky, direct evidence that it was was a dirty deal, no, I don't think so.

Now, this might be a permissible inference from the totality of the record, but without a detailed account of the chain of reasoning, this ruling could be vulnerable on appeal.

Note: I've edited this post a couple of times.

[W. Kevin Vicklund]

This one practically wrote itself. I present for your consideration my latest composition, Treason and Fines.

Three hundred, sixty four million dollars of losing
Three hundred, sixty four million dollars so wrought
Three hundred, sixty four million dollars of losing
How do you measure, measure a fraud?

In memos, apartments,
In records, evaluations,
In loans and SFCs,
In records they lost

In three hundred, sixty four million dollars of losing
How do you measure society’s cost?

How about fines?
How about fines?
How about fines?
Measuring fines
Treason and fines
Treason and fines

Three hundred, sixty four million dollars of losing
Three hundred, sixty four million dollars and banned
Three hundred, sixty four million dollars of losing
How can you measure the trust of a woman or a man?

In Truths that he sent
Or in crimes he denied
In bridges he burned
Or the way that he lied

It's time now to sing out
Although it's not the end
To celebrate, remember three years from New York he’ll be banned

Remember the fines
Remember the fines
Remember the fines
Measuring the treason and fines
Treason and fines

[raison de arizona]

Letitia James presser livestreaming @6pm ET: https://ag.ny.gov/news-media/livestream

[W. Kevin Vicklund]

Perhaps the higher figure is all parties fines while the lower is just those Donnie is liable for

Sorry to be that guy, but these are civil recoveries, not fines, which are criminal penalties.






Actually not sorry.

Dammit!

[andersweinstein]

[chancery]

So the Trump family can just go to Jared Kushner for the money. After all, he got $2 billion from Saudi Arabia.

Please. That's the amount of Saudi funds that Kushner is being paid to "manage." I'm sure that he makes a tidy sum from management fees, and if he profits additionally from insider and self-dealing side deals, I wouldn't, as Dorothy Parker said about the girls attending a Yale prom, be at all surprised.

But the $2 billion isn't money in his pocket.

Ok. Then sell Mar-a-lago. Trump keeps insisting that it's worth over $1 billion. I bet you Saudi Arabia would buy it!

On reflection, however, I'll concede that the Saudis might find a way to bail out Trump from his current cash crunch.

[raison de arizona]

James: Donald Trump and the other defendants were ordered to pay $463.9 million. That represents $363.9 million in disgorgement, plus $100 million in interest, which will continue to increase every single day until it is paid.

[Kendra]

AG James was amazing!

Tfg sounded pretty pissed off

[RTH10260]

Someone else is more than happy to add another sting

[AndyinPA]

I've never seen him look so happy!

[SuzieC]

I hope the Lincoln Project comes out with a snarky rude ad.

[John Thomas8]

So what? Ain't nobody getting a penny, it's all just a public show with no real consequences. Carroll's getting nothing, NY is getting nothing, neither turmp or his gaggle of gangsters that passes for a family is going to face any actual consequences.

It's a joke. A sick one, but still a joke.

[northland10]

So where were the other Attorneys General of New York who allowed him to get away with it all these years?

It is likely that as long as he was just an annoying NY real estate guy with a reality show, they were not going to push it. However, once he decided to put himself higher by going into politics, he put a big target on his back.

So, yes, him being and running for president is possibly one of the reasons they are going after him now. Turnip can whine all he wants, but that's politics. If you have a bunch of skeletons in your closet, stay out of the capitol. That's just life.

[AndyinPA]

Well, it was his decision to come down that escalator.

[Ben-Prime]

Ruling is out, online. Legal teevee eagles are likely reading like mad and report back. Lots of money judgment, no word on business license, etc. Junior, Eric and Weisselberg got fines. We wait.

Is wrong that this was the first website and first forum I checked after waking up this morning (at 6am on this side of the world)? Because if that's being wrong, I don't want to be right.

[much ado]

So what? Ain't nobody getting a penny, it's all just a public show with no real consequences. Carroll's getting nothing, NY is getting nothing, neither turmp or his gaggle of gangsters that passes for a family is going to face any actual consequences.

It's a joke. A sick one, but still a joke.

I believe you are wrong.

[Rolodex]

So, what happens if he...just doesn't pay?
What happens if he just throws a couple of million bucks at it and says he's working on it?

They can continue adding interest to what he owes, but if he never pays it, what does it matter? Can they put liens on or seize his real property assets? Seize bank accounts?

[much ado]

So, what happens if he...just doesn't pay?
What happens if he just throws a couple of million bucks at it and says he's working on it?

They can continue adding interest to what he owes, but if he never pays it, what does it matter? Can they put liens on or seize his real property assets? Seize bank accounts?

IANAL, but the answer is clearly yes, especially for the State of New York.

ETA: I posted this before. Here are the State of New York guidelines on how someone can collect on a judgement.

New York State Unified Court System - How do I collect on a judgement?

[W. Kevin Vicklund]

Tish Tower has a nice ring to it.

[Kendra]

Well, it was his decision to come down that escalator.

If he'd just stayed in NY, he'd likely still be criming to his heart's content. Too bad

[much ado]

I found another NY State Court page that details how Trump can be forced to pay the judgement against him. He evidently has 30 days to deal with this, one way or another.

New York State Unified Court System - Collection Basics

There are many tools to help you collect money or property from the Debtor. Some Courts give you the forms you need. Contact the Court to see if it has a form for you and to find out where to file it.

Collection tools:

• A very important tool to help you collect money or property from the Debtor is called a Transcript of Judgment. This is used when you want to Make a Judgment Work in a Different Court or County.

• If the Debtor has a bank account: The Creditor can serve a Restraining Notice signed by the Court Clerk on the bank to stop the Debtor from withdrawing money. A Restraining Notice can also be used to stop someone who owes money to the Debtor from paying it back until your debt is paid.

• If the Debtor has a job: The Creditor can use an Income Execution to make the Debtor’s boss pay part of the Debtor’s salary to him or her. This is called garnishment. The Creditor fills out an Income Execution form and has it signed by the Court Clerk. Then the Creditor gives the Income Execution to an Enforcement Officer. Read People Who Collect the Debtor’s Money.

• If the Debtor has land: A judgment filed in a County Clerk’s Office becomes a lien on the Debtor’s land or land he or she buys in the county. Having a lien means that the Debtor can’t sell the property without paying the Creditor.

• If the Debtor has personal property, like a car, boat or jewelry [or really big jet]: The Creditor can fill out a Property Execution and give it to an Enforcement Officer to use to take the Debtor’s personal property. Read People Who Collect the Debtor’s Money.

• If someone owes the Debtor money: The Creditor can fill out a Property Execution and give it to an Enforcement Officer to make the person pay the Creditor instead of the Debtor. Read People Who Collect the Debtor’s Money.

• Other Ways to Make the Debtor Pay.

[SuzieC]

Lien against Trump Tower, stat.

[Sam the Centipede]

Perhaps the higher figure is all parties fines while the lower is just those Donnie is liable for

Sorry to be that guy, but these are civil recoveries, not fines, which are criminal penalties.

Actually not sorry.

For hoi polloi: I get that this is civil, not criminal, but the plaintiff is the People of the State of New York, embodied in the Attorney General, not Little Miss Nobody or the DeadAndBuried Burger Bar.

There is muscle in the state and its AG.

So, in practical terms, what might this mean? A teeny weeny plainfiff might not be able to squeeze the dollary blood from the Trump stone, but the AG and her muscle? Will she collect at least a sizeable chunk?

Is it likely that the Trump Gang will be able to avoid payment by judicious bankruptcy etc. or will they be forced to liquidate and pay?

All opinions and speculations welcome! – especially from folks who know stuff! (yes, chancery, I see you!)