Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

Siegfried Shrink
Posts: 224
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2017 5:00 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1176

Post by Siegfried Shrink » Thu Aug 09, 2018 4:08 pm

If they are the Zim notes I suspect, they are worth well more than the envelopes, just not as money. At a coin fair he could probably spend them, the collector demand is pretty steady as is the novelty aspect.

No hope of anything else, of course. The RV thing is one of the sillier things to come along Crazy Pike

User avatar
Gregg
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:09 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Occupation: We build cars

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1177

Post by Gregg » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:11 pm

Yes, but the collector market has been influenced by the crazy people who think it might someday be worth that many US Dollars market. I remember seeing some Zims in a flea market at a novelty kind of place selling for $3 each, 2 for $5 before the RV crowd latched onto them. The guy had bundles of them in bank bands, if he kept them a few months after I saw him he might have gotten rich on them.
Honorary Commander, 699th Airborne Assault Dachshund Regiment
Deadly Sausage Dogs from the Sky

BruceHollandRogers
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu May 07, 2015 5:50 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1178

Post by BruceHollandRogers » Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:10 am

I noted elsewhere the conflation of the Qanon and GCR belief systems. That might mean that new buyers are entering the Dinar/Zim/etc market. My so-far-subjective judgment is that Zim sales volumes and prices are picking up on eBay. Zim notes are selling at $80 to $160 per Z$100-trillion. That low end hasn't moved much, but the high until recently was more like $120.

User avatar
TheNewSaint
Posts: 2143
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:05 am

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1179

Post by TheNewSaint » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:49 am

The other thing I wonder about is the condition of the notes. Collectible value can vary a great deal depending on condition. I wonder how many of these dinar idiots stumbled into something with actual value, then lessened that value by handling the note as they would ordinary currency. It doesn't take much to knock it out of the top grades.
This bramble need not be traversed.

Siegfried Shrink
Posts: 224
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2017 5:00 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1180

Post by Siegfried Shrink » Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:51 pm

That is a very good point. They could halve the value with what most folk would consider very minor flaws but get us colectors very excited..

Average circulated could be a tenth the value of Uncirculated.

I'd pay good money for a full set of all the Zimbabwe inflation notes. I only have 1,5 and 10 dollar notes form the original issue, before the whole country went tits up.

User avatar
TheNewSaint
Posts: 2143
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:05 am

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1181

Post by TheNewSaint » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:36 pm

On the other hand, RV believers aren't buying for condition in the first place. They care about quantity, not quality, so they would buy whatever's cheapest. So its less likely they started with any high-end grades.
This bramble need not be traversed.

User avatar
Gregg
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:09 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Occupation: We build cars

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1182

Post by Gregg » Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:50 pm

TheNewSaint wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:36 pm
On the other hand, RV believers aren't buying for condition in the first place. They care about quantity, not quality, so they would buy whatever's cheapest. So its less likely they started with any high-end grades.
Not true, in fact they are very picky about their Dinar being clean, uncirculated and having sequential serial numbers. Buying the plastic collector sleeves is common. They also almost always in the old days insisted on a certificate of origin, a totally made up by the dealers document.
Honorary Commander, 699th Airborne Assault Dachshund Regiment
Deadly Sausage Dogs from the Sky

User avatar
TheNewSaint
Posts: 2143
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:05 am

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1183

Post by TheNewSaint » Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:35 pm

Gregg wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:50 pm

Not true, in fact they are very picky about their Dinar being clean, uncirculated and having sequential serial numbers. Buying the plastic collector sleeves is common. They also almost always in the old days insisted on a certificate of origin, a totally made up by the dealers document.
Really? Wow. I guess two wrongs really do make a right sometimes.
This bramble need not be traversed.

BruceHollandRogers
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu May 07, 2015 5:50 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1184

Post by BruceHollandRogers » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:13 am

Actually, a good measure of what drives the prices in Zimbabwe banknotes is the relative indifference to condition. A note denominated in the trillions with stains, folds and even holes would be considered un-collectible, but a GCR believer might only discount it by ten or twenty percent. So while collectors are stuck paying outlandish prices for notes that are actually quite common in uncirculated condition, it's not other collectors that have driven that price up.

As we go down to smaller denominations, condition becomes important again because GCR believers aren't interested in smaller denominations.

There have been four series of Zimbabwe dollars, plus the current series of bond notes that are supposed to be backed by USD. The third dollar is the series that went to denominations of trillions. In that series, the only denomination that is actually rare in uncirculated condition is Pick number 72, Z$10,000. Pricing for that note *is* dependent on condition. A stained and folded $Z10,000 is essentially worthless. An uncirculated one will fetch $100 USD and up. It's a true collectible.

User avatar
mmmirele
Posts: 2450
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:17 pm
Location: Xenu's Red Mountain Trap

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1185

Post by mmmirele » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:01 am

Well, it looks like the Iraqi dinar scam has morphed again. Now it's sucking followers of Trump in following the breadcrumbs (shades of QAnon).
Trump supporter Hayes Kotseos runs a North Carolina pool-maintenance company, but she’s got a side bet that she thinks might make her fabulously wealthy: the Iraqi dinar.

The currency is nearly worthless outside of Iraq, but Kotseos bought millions of dinars in April, after watching a video of President Trump at a 2017 press conference. In the clip, Trump says, with characteristic vagueness, that all currencies will soon “be on a level playing field.”

In reality, Trump was talking about trade imbalances with China. But like other Trump supporters who have fallen into the dinar investment scam, which has existed since at least 2012, Kotseos interpreted Trump’s rambling statement as proof that the Iraqi dinar would soon be worth as much or even more than the dollar, making anyone who had been smart enough to buy in early a millionaire.

:snippity:

Trump supporters like Kotseos have also been drawn in by videos showing the “prophecy” of Kim Clement, a South African “prophet” whose fans believe predicted Trump’s election. Before his death in 2016, Clement also often mentioned a dinar revaluation.

“It was like, OK, well, God said the Iraqi dinar is going to revalue,” Kotseos told The Daily Beast.
Obviously, much more at the link. It's a cult, folks.

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-fan ... dinar-scam

User avatar
mmmirele
Posts: 2450
Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:17 pm
Location: Xenu's Red Mountain Trap

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1186

Post by mmmirele » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:05 am

In the previous article, mention was made of convictions in a dinar-peddling scheme. Here's the DoJ press release.
Owners of currency exchange business that made $600 million convicted of fraud

ATLANTA – The co-owners and chief operating officer of one of the largest Iraqi dinar exchangers in the United States were convicted by a federal jury following a five-week trial. Tyson Rhame, James Shaw, and Frank Bell were each convicted of mail and wire fraud conspiracy, as well as multiple counts of mail and wire fraud. Rhame and Bell were also convicted of making false statements to federal law enforcement agents.

“These executives engaged in a lengthy campaign to defraud investors by spreading lies about the investment potential of the Iraqi dinar,” said Acting U.S. Attorney Kurt R. Erskine. “These convictions resulted from years of investigation, which included dozens of electronic and physical search warrants, hundreds of witness interviews, and extensive financial analysis.”

“The conviction of these three defendants is the result of an extensive effort by the government to protect investors from those who make unsubstantiated claims about the potential revaluation of a foreign currency,” said Chris Hacker, Special Agent in Charge of FBI Atlanta. “Their greed led them to steal the hopes of unsuspecting investors and ultimately led them to their demise. The FBI and its partners make it a priority to root out and punish anyone who preys on investors for their own selfish desires.”

“This was a trial about fraudulent inducements, conspiracy, investment fraud and outright greed,” said Thomas J. Holloman, Special Agent in Charge, IRS-Criminal Investigation. “Rhame, Shaw, and Bell saw an opportunity to build their personal net worth and business position in the currency market by seizing on investors’ desire for high returns on their investments. At the end of the trial, the jury agreed with the government and found the Sterling Currency Group co-owners and chief operating officer guilty of the conspiracy and the underlying frauds. Despite the challenges these complex cases present, IRS-CI is committed to working with our partners at the FBI, and the U.S. Attorney’s Office to show white-collar fraud is still an investigative priority.”

According to Acting U.S Attorney Erskine, the charges, and other information presented in court: Rhame and Shaw owned and operated the Sterling Currency Group, which was once one of the country’s largest sellers of the Iraqi dinar. Bell was Sterling’s chief operating officer. Between 2010 and June 2015, Sterling grossed over $600 million in revenue from the sale of the Iraqi dinar and other currencies, while Rhame and Shaw received over $180 million in distributions.

The evidence at trial established that the defendants took steps to make investors believe they would get rich by investing in the Iraqi dinar. At one point, Rhame posted information on Sterling’s website falsely suggesting that the dinar was about to revalue. At other times, Rhame and Bell falsely claimed that Sterling would cash out investors at airports around the country following a dinar “revaluation.” The defendants also paid substantial sums of money to third parties who in turn spread false information about the dinar on conference calls and Internet chat rooms.

Tyson Rhame, 53, and James Shaw, 55, both of Atlanta, Georgia, and Frank Bell, 55, of Decatur, Georgia, were convicted of conspiracy to commit mail and wire fraud and multiple mail and wire fraud counts. Rhame and Bell were also convicted of making false statements to federal agents regarding Sterling’s operations. The jury acquitted the defendants of money laundering charges. A fourth defendant, Terrence Keller, was acquitted of all charges at trial.
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndga/pr/ow ... cted-fraud

User avatar
Flatpointhigh
Posts: 7880
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 1:05 pm
Location: Hotel California, PH23
Occupation: Voice Actor, Podcaster, I hold a Ph.D in Procrastination.
Contact:

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1187

Post by Flatpointhigh » Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:36 am


My Name is...
Daffy Duck.. woo hoo!
Cancer broke me

BruceHollandRogers
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu May 07, 2015 5:50 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1188

Post by BruceHollandRogers » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:31 pm

Siegfried Shrink wrote:
Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:51 pm
I'd pay good money for a full set of all the Zimbabwe inflation notes. I only have 1,5 and 10 dollar notes form the original issue, before the whole country went tits up.
If that's still the case, I have an auction up on Ebay for a set of all 27 banknotes of the Zimbabwe third dollar. This is the issue that includes the Z$100-trillion. All uncirculated, except for the Z$10,000, which is in very circulated condition. The auction starts at 99 cents, and the market seems a little depressed lately. If nothing else, it may interest you to see what such a set currently goes for.

Meanwhile, I stayed away from dinar land for months. I just had a look today at a site that aggregates the various call-in shows, and all of they all have shows posted from as recent as last week. They men who ran the Sterling Currency Group had their day in federal court and lost, but the successful prosecution of scammers isn't enough to dissuade ordinary dinarians.

User avatar
JohnPCapitalist
Posts: 1370
Joined: Tue Feb 16, 2016 10:29 pm
Location: Wall Street
Occupation: Investment management in the financial industry. Deep knowledge of stocks, tech and economics.

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1189

Post by JohnPCapitalist » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:44 pm

BruceHollandRogers wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:31 pm
They men who ran the Sterling Currency Group had their day in federal court and lost, but the successful prosecution of scammers isn't enough to dissuade ordinary dinarians.
Good to see you back again.

I wasn't familiar with the Sterling Currency Group. Pretty scary that they were able to extract $600 million from the dinar RV crowd. I didn't think these particular suckers had that much cash to fleece.

Sentencing is scheduled for late May. One of the defendants is taking their time to file motions for a new trial, and sentencing has been pushed back a few times.

User avatar
Sam the Centipede
Posts: 6963
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 3:25 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1190

Post by Sam the Centipede » Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:51 pm

I don't follow this stuff closely so I searched for Sterling Currency Group and found a press release by the US Attorneys Office summarizing the prosecution and conviction in October 2018: Owners of currency exchange business that made $600 million convicted of fraud.

Of course, some of the investors marks know better: thread at DinarVets. Nobody will be surprised to hear that apparently it's Obama's fault! :brickwallsmall:

User avatar
woodworker
Posts: 2760
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2011 2:54 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1191

Post by woodworker » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:56 pm

I followed the Dinar saga for a while and Sterling was very very big in it. They were paying gurus to tout the Dinar RV with daily updates about how the RV was just around the corner, always waiting for the one magical thing that needed to happen (which at various times included Iraq enacting laws about oil/gas production/allocation, appointment of someone as Oil Minister/Finance Minister/Iraq Central Bank Director, the Kurds agreeing to do something/the Kurds agreeing not to do something, the IMF something something, etc., etc. -- all of the conditions precedent somehow never being fully satisfied). At the same time they were paying gurus, they, and the gurus, were publicly denying that they were paying the gurus.

The folks at Sterling, and all of the gurus, are despicable pieces of shit, IMHO, and should be taken out and strung up by the gonads.
Pence / Haley -- 2020 "I Won't Call Her Mother" and "We Will Be The Best Team Ever, But Never Alone Together"

User avatar
Sam the Centipede
Posts: 6963
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 3:25 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1192

Post by Sam the Centipede » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:10 pm

:confused: :confused: Revaluation: has any country or currency ever had any sort of revaluation remotely comparable to the sort of event RV boosters predict?

Obviously currency speculators can make money in ordinary trading, but that's wholly different from almost worthless value paper being converted to serious hard cash.

Do the RV gangsters ever point to any previous instances, real or imagined?

Lansdowne
Posts: 58
Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2017 4:00 am

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1193

Post by Lansdowne » Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:50 pm

Sam the Centipede wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:10 pm
:confused: :confused: Revaluation: has any country or currency ever had any sort of revaluation remotely comparable to the sort of event RV boosters predict?
I am no economist, but I can't see it could happen in any circumstances. The massive losses in value seen in Zimbabwe (and I gather now in Venezuela), known as hyper-inflation, produce huge reductions in value so you would think some equal and opposite phenomenon could do the reverse.

Even the dinar pushers themselves weren't very consistent about how it would happen. It was noticeable that all the currencies being pushed were those which happened to have a small single unit, that is thousands of dinars, Z$ or VND to the dollar. In the real world that just means the currency had undergone some rapid inflation in the past. But the usual dinarians' theory seemed to be that the low value of a unit was due to a past bad economic situation in the country (true) and that a good future economic outlook would restore the unit value to its past level (not true). In other words if the Iraqi state gets fully back in working order the Iraqi dinar, instead of being 1700 to the dollar or whatever it is, should be worth as much as a Kuwaiti dinar or a US dollar in a short period of time. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

The other version seems to involve the Iraqi government, or the IMF, or US banks, or maybe Chinese dragon families, DECIDING that the dinar needs to be revalued, i.e. abolishing market forces. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

Then there is the global RV theory and the global NESARA theory, which seem to predict that the currencies all over the world will have their relative values changed by diktat, and that all the movements will be in the right direction to satisfy the mostly-Americans which have bought into the theory. That one doesn't seem to have any other background related to the world economy.

User avatar
Sam the Centipede
Posts: 6963
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 3:25 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1194

Post by Sam the Centipede » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:35 pm

Thanks Lansdowne, that's as I thought. I can't understand how the marks persuade themselves to believe that mysterious and powerful strangers will shower them with unimaginable quantities of wealth when all their life experience as perennial losers surely points in exactly the opposite direction.

For some suckers it seems to be quasi-religious as they babble about the great things they are going to do with these riches for family, friends and strangers as if this purity of heart will somehow make the miracle of RV more probable.

User avatar
Notorial Dissent
Posts: 12215
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:21 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1195

Post by Notorial Dissent » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:48 pm

You have to have an economy that is actually doing more than treading water or anticipating a complete collapse as in the case of Iraq, or even breaking even as in the case of Zimbabwe or more recently Venezuela before you can have an RV. The going to pot part is easy, it's the ceasing to be waste paper bit that is really really hard. So I would say the answer is NO.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

User avatar
Gregg
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:09 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Occupation: We build cars

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1196

Post by Gregg » Mon Feb 11, 2019 10:33 pm

Sam the Centipede wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:10 pm
:confused: :confused: Revaluation: has any country or currency ever had any sort of revaluation remotely comparable to the sort of event RV boosters predict?

Obviously currency speculators can make money in ordinary trading, but that's wholly different from almost worthless value paper being converted to serious hard cash.

Do the RV gangsters ever point to any previous instances, real or imagined?
You know what the best currency play in the last 40 years was, honestly, the DInar currently in use was issued at around 4,000 to a dollar and in 6 years dropped to 1190. It was, to any sane person, a phenomenal return, but while that was happening the Dinaridgits were waiting every day for the ''big RV'' and even though some of them did have a chance they lost it. That's still the rate and the few who got in at the start, didn't pay something like 40% markup plus $30 overnight shipping or a premium for ''lower denomination notes'' have pretty much lost the opportunity now, because their stupidity chased the legitimate banks out of exchanges of Dinar and the only people who would accept it now for dollars are the aforementioned scumbag dealers who want to buy at a 20% discount and again have other fees and really stupid restrictions on how they'll buy it, or other more trustworthy but still expensive currency exchange places like the ones at airports.

That being said, the drop to the current 1190 was the closest they'll ever get to an RV and anyone holding on to it now is tempting fate. On any given day, the Iraqi Central Bank can cancel those notes and exchange them for ''lopped zero'' series where a 10,000 note would be equal to a new series 10 note. When they do this, it is more than possible, maybe probable that they'll enact measures to prevent all those dinars in grandpa's closet from being exchanged by making it hard to exchange them outside Iraq, they could also at the same time make it illegal to try to come into Iraq with more than a set amount unless you're a citizen, limiting how much you can exchange without opening a bank account in Iraq and limiting how much cash you can withdrawal and finally, make it extremely hard and/or expensive to leave Iraq with large amounts or hard currency. Any of these moves would wipe out most US DInaridgits, and more than one of them are likely to happen.
Honorary Commander, 699th Airborne Assault Dachshund Regiment
Deadly Sausage Dogs from the Sky

User avatar
Gregg
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:09 am
Location: Cincinnati, OH USA
Occupation: We build cars

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1197

Post by Gregg » Mon Feb 11, 2019 10:48 pm

While I'm at it, the currency dealers and gurus aren't the only ones who stripped these suckers to the bare bones. There is still quite a cottage industry of people selling trusts to put your new riches into (has to be done before the RV, for...reasons), tax planning advice and other legal/accounting services the providers are neither licensed nor qualified to give. Then there are the subscription websites where you pay to have access to a forum much like this where you can get all the latest dope, subscription ''Alert'' services to give you the latest developments as soon as they can misunderstand them...and don't even get me started on the multilayered scam shopping central that is "Adam Montana (real name reported to be James Wolf" and dinarvets.com that offers all of the above plus investment account hosting in Belize among other things.

He's held out as "The" guru, the most trusted of all the grifters and according to reputable sources, he's not as claimed a Harvard grad who made big bucks in the (didn't actually happen) Kuwaiti DInar RV and is the most bigly savvy currency speculator EVER, but in fact a high school dropout with a history of registering web addresses that forward you to porn sites who pay him a commission. He's a slightly dumber and scummier version of the Kransenstiens.

Digging for the truth around the DInar scam is a very deep hole.
Honorary Commander, 699th Airborne Assault Dachshund Regiment
Deadly Sausage Dogs from the Sky

User avatar
Sam the Centipede
Posts: 6963
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 3:25 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1198

Post by Sam the Centipede » Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:09 am

Thanks Gregg! :thumbs: You're clearly the guy to ask for anyone who wishes to know how many truck transmissions a million Iraqi dinars or a trillion Zimbabwe dollars will buy! :-D

As you say, 4000 to 1190 is potentially a huge return by normal standards, sbout 300%, but a speculator would still need access to large amounts of money to make the level of eye-watering profit these people talk about. I exclude buying on margin because any of the suckers who understood that would have been bankrupted b theiry earlier missteps!

And, as you point out, reaping profits from high peaks in any currency, commodity, etc. depends on identifying that the peak has been reached and liquidating then, not waiting for even bigger returns that never come. The suckers have too much greed and too little knowledge to achieve that.

BruceHollandRogers
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu May 07, 2015 5:50 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1199

Post by BruceHollandRogers » Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:22 pm

I'm going to disagree slightly with Gregg's assertion that the Kuwaiti RV never happened and point to Kuwait as the instance where the RV story has a germ of truth. But even as I'm disagreeing with Gregg, if we're talking about an RV that happened as a matter of policy, Gregg's absolutely right.

I'm also on argumentative thin ice here because I can't point to any officially recorded currency exchange transactions that show the valuation changes I'm referring to. There may have been some, but the narrative I'm offering relies on nothing but an understanding of how fiat currency works, or doesn't, when a government falls.

If you had a stash of Kuwaiti dinar in your hands on the day when Iraq invaded, the purchasing power of that cash plummeted. Let's say you were able to get out of the country with a suitcase of cash, are you going to be able to use that money to set yourself up in a hotel suite? Your cash is backed by a government that has just fallen and is now either in exile with you or imprisoned by the invaders. The Iraqi forces are insisting that the only cash that has value in Kuwait (now a conquered region of Iraq, according to them) is the Iraqi dinar.

If your hotelier believes that the conquest is a temporary situation and that Kuwait's government will be restored, he may accept your Kuwaiti dinar at a discount that reflects his estimate of how likely that restoration will be and how difficult it will be to present his Kuwaiti dinar for exchange. So he accepts your cash at a rate of ten percent of face value. So he has received Kuwaiti dinar at a steep (but reasonable, and maybe even too generous!) discount.

Then the coalition forces throw the Iraqi army out of Kuwait. The hotelier rejoices! The dinar is again backed by a government! It's not that simple, though. On their way out, the Iraqis empty the bank vaults of cash reserves. The restored Kuwaiti government doesn't want to be flooded with ill-gotten cash, so they demonetize the old money and issue a brand-new currency.

I don't know how the situation turns out for the hotelier, but it's likely that there was a window during which it was possible for people in his situation to exchange the old money for the new money, with restrictions in place to keep the stolen money in Iraq from returning to be similarly exchanged. But if everything worked out for him, he did effectively experience a ten-fold appreciation for his holdings of Kuwaiti dinar.

So people who acquired dinar in Kuwait's darkest days were well compensated for making a bet that the restored government would again back its paper. Ten-fold or twenty-fold increases would have been unremarkable. But very few people would have had this experience. If you were Kuwaiti, you'd have seen the value of your currency plunge and then recover to exactly where it had been. It would only be people who had received dinar when it was essentially without value who would have made money. And, of course, they'd have made that money at the expense of Kuwaitis whose money had been aggressively devalued at the barrel of a gun.

Now, if the Kuwaiti dinar was traded in official currency exchanges outside of Kuwait, and if trading remained open under these dubious circumstances, then the relative value of the Kuwaiti dinar would show on the charts as falling steeply and recovering with a V-shaped rocket. But my best guess is that any such exchanges were shuttered by the invasion and the only dinar RV fortunes made were booked by people like my imaginary hotelier. I doubt that even any US soldiers were in a situation where they bought and sold dinar in the right time frame, but there were probably US soldiers who heard stories by people in the hotelier's situation and dreamed of having made fortunes by buying dinar at the right moment.

So my understanding, strictly anecdotal, is that the Iraqi dinar myth began with soldiers who had heard stories about the Kuwaiti dinar and thought that Iraq represented a similar opportunity.

BruceHollandRogers
Posts: 130
Joined: Thu May 07, 2015 5:50 pm

Re: Dinar Valuation and Global Currency Reset Scam Thread

#1200

Post by BruceHollandRogers » Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:42 pm

A little more about Sterling Currency Group:

One of the features of the Iraqi dinar that was useful to those guys was that the currency didn't participate in broad currency exchange. You can buy and sell the US dollar, Swiss franc, euro or even Mexican peso on a lot of global exchanges, along with futures contracts on those currencies. But Iraq's dinar is bought and sold pretty much exclusively in Iraq. SCG had the advantage of trading in a physical commodity that was complicated to acquire. Competition was limited.

But that limit to competition also had a downside. Acquiring notes at face value, in huge quantities, was costing them something.

However, evil geniuses that they were, they saw a way to eliminate the cost of acquiring physical notes and convert every sale into much fatter profit. In addition to peddling physical notes, they sold layaway accounts. Buyers never took possession of anything beyond an ownership document, denominated in dinar. I guess buyers were meant to think they were getting something like a futures contract, controlling a large sum of dinar in exchange for having made a down-payment. Come the RV, owners would be able to redeem part of their new riches to purchase the remaining portion of their fabulous wealth.

One dinarian I knew was not shaken in his belief in the RV when the FBI raided Sterling, but he did conclude that his layaways would be toast. At least he determined that Sterling was a corrupt outfit, rather than blaming the FBI for breaking up the party.

Post Reply

Return to “Sovereign Citizens, Private Militias, and Citizen Grand Juries”