The Question of Presidential Inability

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#301

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Sep 23, 2018 12:14 pm

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Sun Sep 23, 2018 10:08 am
Addie wrote:
Sun Sep 23, 2018 9:10 am
Posting this here because I'll be damned if I can find the thread on this NYT Op-Ed. It's from a few days ago, so likely to be a dupe anyways.
Salon: Right to remain Anonymous: Scholar who decoded “Primary Colors” unmasks author of Times op-ed

Professor who outed Joe Klein in 1996: Detailed analysis narrows the list of administration suspects — down to one
Interesting article.
Very interesting, but I don't buy it.

It's not that I think Matis wouldn't try to do the things the author of the op-ed discusses. I just don't see him talking about it.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#302

Post by Addie » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:56 am

Washington Monthly - Nancy LeTourneau: Signs That Donald Trump Is Mentally Deteriorating

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#303

Post by Volkonski » Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:35 am

Here is a little more stress for Trump.

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Wow. One day before the Federalist Society's annual convention, longtime member George Conway (@gtconway3d) has announced the formation of Checks and Balances—a new group of conservative lawyers who believe Trump is undermining the rule of law. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/14/us/p ... trump.html
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Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#304

Post by Addie » Wed Nov 14, 2018 1:29 pm

WaPo - Jennifer Rubin
A frightful portrait of a president out of control ...

There are several takeaways from all of this.

First, Trump will get worse under pressure. If he is this bad now, imagine what he’ll be like if more associates are indicted, the economy goes to seed or the subpoenas start flying. At some point, unless Trump has him fired, special counsel Robert S. Mueller III will issue his report. Unless it miraculously exonerates him, the president may have a meltdown that will make his trip to France look like a picnic.

Second, self-described saviors of the country, such as the anonymous op-ed writer, are deluding themselves if they believe they are preventing the president from harming the country. Daily, he threatens democratic norms, blemishes the United States’ reputation around the world and makes worse and worse personnel decisions in an effort to surround himself with more compliant aides. If Trump fires Defense Secretary Jim Mattis and White House Chief of Staff John F. Kelly, it is not clear how many more erratic decisions will be made or how serious the ramifications may be.

Third, all of this points to the gross irresponsibility of Republicans who, for two years, refused to exercise any oversight and continue to spin on his behalf. They would rather excuse the conduct of an unbalanced and hysterical commander in chief then move to limit his powers (e.g., reassert that a first strike is an act of war requiring congressional authorization, claw back power to enact tariffs). They likely will continue to rubber-stamp his executive branch picks, no matter how unprepared and temperamentally unfit they may be. Even more reprehensible, they will heartily endorse him for reelection while maligning his challengers. Maybe if they see control of the Senate slipping away, they will finally cut him loose.

All of this reminds us that Democratic control of the House is only a halfway measure. Unless and until Trump is out of office, the country, our democracy and our security remain at risk.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#305

Post by MN-Skeptic » Wed Nov 14, 2018 1:46 pm

I have a problem with the articles declaring that Trump is deteriorating mentally.

I don't think he's changed from Day 1. Moreover, I don't believe he's changed from the day he decided to run for President.

I think he's ALWAYS been the petulant child, the lazy bully, the psychotic liar. The only difference now is that more people are realizing what a despicable man he truly is. Lying is not new to him. Relying on a news media which tells him exactly what he wants to hear is not new to him. Sitting around home, watching TV, eating bonbons, and tweeting is not new to him. Arguing with people pointing out his lies has always been his thing. These press conferences just reflect who he truly is.

Trump has always been uniquely unsuited for the Presidency. This is only news to folks who didn't research him before the 2016 election.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#306

Post by Volkonski » Wed Nov 14, 2018 2:02 pm

Aaron Rupar

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Trump hasn't tweeted in 21 hours and his schedule today included an "intelligence briefing" and then lunch. Good gig if you can get it.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#307

Post by Addie » Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:34 am

BBC News: Donald Trump wrote own health letter, says physician Harold Bornstein

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#308

Post by Dr. Kenneth Noisewater » Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:07 am

Addie wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:34 am
BBC News: Donald Trump wrote own health letter, says physician Harold Bornstein
May 2018... But it's not like we didn't already know this.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#309

Post by Addie » Thu Nov 15, 2018 12:04 pm

Duh, I didn't notice the date. Thanks.
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:07 am
Addie wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:34 am
BBC News: Donald Trump wrote own health letter, says physician Harold Bornstein
May 2018... But it's not like we didn't already know this.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#310

Post by Addie » Mon Nov 19, 2018 10:36 am

WaPo - Daniel W. Drezner
Why is Donald Trump so bad at being head of state? ...

There is just no getting around it: Trump is a God-awful head of state. Why? I can think of three reasons — which, as it turns out, also help to explain why he’s not that great as the head of government either.

First, Trump is not an experienced politician. His supporters love this about him, but it also means that he is unprepared for the performative parts of the job. He has no idea how to read a speech with any conviction (you can always tell when he’s winging it, because those are the only times when there is energy to his voice). He cannot for the life of him display any kind of empathy. He lacks the political instincts to realize that flying all the way to France to not attend an important ritual is a boneheaded move. These are essential traits to competently perform the rituals of a head of state, such as eulogies or commemorations. Trump lacks the muscle memory to do these things well.

Second, Trump wants everything to be about himself, but playing the role of the head of state actually requires more sacrifice than this president can stomach. It means traveling long distances to attend lengthy ceremonies, sometimes in inclement weather. More than the logistics, being the head of state often means directing attention toward others: someone winning a prize, someone in mourning, and so forth. The head of state bestows recognition on others, but Trump only wants recognition directed at himself. The irony is that if he was better at this part of the job, he probably would earn some reflected glory. That kind of logic is beyond him, however.

Finally, being a good head of state requires believing in something larger than one’s self. The ideals that animate this country should stir the soul: a nation conceived in liberty, dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal, resolved that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom — and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the Earth. Trump, however, believes in nothing beyond himself, and he cannot feign that belief. When he tries, he ends up going meta and joking about how corny it sounds.

The qualities of a good head of state are not identical to being a good head of government, but there is a fair degree of overlap. Trump is a bad head of state because he is unschooled, soft and cannot conceive of a higher ideal. It helps to explain why he has blundered so much as the head of government.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#311

Post by Addie » Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:12 pm

WaPo - Wes Clark
I served under 8 commanders in chief. Trump doesn’t grasp the role.

Of all the roles of the presidency, commander in chief was perhaps the one that candidate Donald Trump most relished. His take-charge style, his hat and slogan, his command presence on the stage, his early experience at New York Military Academy and his boasting that “I know more about ISIS than the generals do” demonstrated his inclinations. And many Americans, including service members and veterans, believed that he would be a strong and effective commander in chief.

Yet as president, Trump’s actions and behavior have led service members and veterans to question whether he really understands who a commander in chief is, or what he does. ...

But if Trump struggles with his role’s rites and rituals, there are deeper issues with his command. His blustering and combative diplomacy on Korea, cozying up with a potential adversary who has consistently worked to undermine the United States, and his pattern of insulting friends and disrupting allies are all deeply unsettling to the middle-grade and senior officers who plan and execute U.S. policy. They need steady, consistent, reliable leadership. The bobbing and weaving may work in a small family office, but he is now leading one of the largest, most structured organizations in the world -- and certainly the most powerful. It needs a steady hand, not just at secretary of defense, but also at the very top.

What actually drives Trump’s policies and actions as commander in chief? On what basis does he make the decisions that could separate us from our families, and send us to war? By all reports he doesn’t like to read, doesn’t suffer long briefings, doesn’t want to study, doesn’t seem to want much of the experience of the generals closest to him.

We honor the chain of command, so we trust him with the most central issues of our time -- war, peace, the nuclear button. But Russia is still bullying, North Korea is still polishing up its nuclear force, China is strengthening its position in the South China Sea, and Iran and the Islamic State are still there in the Middle East, while our oldest allies are cringing and disheartened.

In his campaign, Trump promised that only he knew how to lead America. In the field of national security the jury is still out.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#312

Post by Slim Cognito » Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:52 pm

The jury isn't just out. They pried open the window, made a rope out of sport coats and cardigans and were last seen heading towards Canada.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#313

Post by AndyinPA » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:08 pm

Military school, where you frequently send troubled kids, is hardly preparation for the presidency. :brickwallsmall:

Then, there were those six deferments.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#314

Post by Fortinbras » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:27 pm

I would dare say that military school, such as West Point, was an adequate education for some presidents including such heroes of the Republic as Ulysses Grant and Dwight Eisenhower.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#315

Post by AndyinPA » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:37 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:27 pm
I would dare say that military school, such as West Point, was an adequate education for some presidents including such heroes of the Republic as Ulysses Grant and Dwight Eisenhower.
He didn't go to West Point, but, yeah, it's good preparation for the right person

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#316

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Mon Nov 19, 2018 4:21 pm

Slim Cognito wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:52 pm
The jury isn't just out. They pried open the window, made a rope out of sport coats and cardigans and were last seen heading towards Canada.
:like:
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#317

Post by Gregg » Mon Nov 19, 2018 7:25 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:27 pm
I would dare say that military school, such as West Point, was an adequate education for some presidents including such heroes of the Republic as Ulysses Grant and Dwight Eisenhower.

The military Academies are not what you think of when someone says ''military schools". Hardly a place where the problem rich kids with self control issues are sent in some kind of exile by affluent parents, simply being appointed to one of them requires a demonstrated lifelong history of discipline, dedication and determination.

Aside from that, they are unlike a lot of high school level military schools, damn fine Universities where you have to work hard and end up with a top flight education. In that respect, they can be and often are superior to the Ivy League schools where more often than anyone admit,s once you get in your success is not nearly as hard as the journey. I saw it a lot and there is quite a reputation for it at both Yale and Brown, schools that otherwise are perceived as places that provide a good amount of book learnin'. (also too, the undergraduate Ivy League schools are not nearly as elite as the Ivy League Graduate Schools)

Having known plenty of people from both, I'd put the average graduate of West Point ahead of the average graduate of Harvard every day of the week and twice on Sunday, as regards to how ''educated'' they were the day after they were graduated.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#318

Post by RVInit » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:04 pm

Exactly. Donald Trump did not attend West Point. Never in a million years could he have ever achieved such a thing. His parents did send him to a military school when he was a child. Totally different thing. And yes, it is quite common for certain parents to send "difficult" kids to military school.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#319

Post by Gregg » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:44 pm

For what its worth, I don't think he attended Wharton, either. I could be wrong on what is and isn't considered Wharton, but as I said above, to those who know more about the Ivy League schools than what you learn from a Facebook post, the grad schools are much more prestigious than the undergrad. If anyone tells you they went to Harvard Business School but they don't have an MBA from there, well, no they didn't. HBS is the graduate school of business at Harvard University (and you cannot get an undergrad degree in business from Harvard, believe it or not).

Wharton is the graduate school of business of the University of Pennsylvania and having an undergrad degree from there, I would think it a lot more proper to say he had a degree in Economics from U Penn. (and they must be so proud)
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#320

Post by HST's Ghost » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:54 pm

I don't have a picture of my old MIT red hoodie but whenever I wore it and was asked if I went there:

"Oh, sure, I went to MIT alright...went there in 1987...walked into the bookshop and bought this sweatshirt..."
Fortinbras wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:27 pm
I would dare say that military school, such as West Point, was an adequate education for some presidents including such heroes of the Republic as Ulysses Grant and Dwight Eisenhower.
Eisenhower also had some good work experience in the interim between school and presidency apparently...
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#321

Post by Gregg » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:19 pm

HST's Ghost wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:54 pm
I don't have a picture of my old MIT red hoodie but whenever I wore it and was asked if I went there:

"Oh, sure, I went to MIT alright...went there in 1987...walked into the bookshop and bought this sweatshirt..."
Fortinbras wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:27 pm
I would dare say that military school, such as West Point, was an adequate education for some presidents including such heroes of the Republic as Ulysses Grant and Dwight Eisenhower.
Eisenhower also had some good work experience in the interim between school and presidency apparently...
Yes, he spent a long time as an aide to a General named Fox Conner, who no one not a military history reader has ever heard of but probably had more influence on the US Army than anyone since Grant and Sherman. His other aides and subordinates include Patton, George Marshall and John McAuley Palmer.
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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#322

Post by AndyinPA » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:47 pm

Gregg wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:44 pm
For what its worth, I don't think he attended Wharton, either. I could be wrong on what is and isn't considered Wharton, but as I said above, to those who know more about the Ivy League schools than what you learn from a Facebook post, the grad schools are much more prestigious than the undergrad. If anyone tells you they went to Harvard Business School but they don't have an MBA from there, well, no they didn't. HBS is the graduate school of business at Harvard University (and you cannot get an undergrad degree in business from Harvard, believe it or not).

Wharton is the graduate school of business of the University of Pennsylvania and having an undergrad degree from there, I would think it a lot more proper to say he had a degree in Economics from U Penn. (and they must be so proud)
I think you're right on all counts. And I think I remember that one of his professors at U Penn said he was the absolute dumbest student he ever had.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#323

Post by RVInit » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:51 am

:lol: The last few posts prompted me to read (again) an article about Trump's less than illustrious time at the University of Pennsylvania.

A very stable genius, indeed. Even the audience clearly doesn't know what the hell he's babbling about. This is, thankfully, very short.

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#324

Post by Somerset » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:06 pm

RVInit wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:51 am
:lol: The last few posts prompted me to read (again) an article about Trump's less than illustrious time at the University of Pennsylvania.

A very stable genius, indeed. Even the audience clearly doesn't know what the hell he's babbling about. This is, thankfully, very short.

Watch the expressions of the woman in the lower right :) (Sadly, I'm sure she still voted for him)

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Re: The Question of Presidential Inability

#325

Post by AndyinPA » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:57 pm

Wow! Maybe he and the Wasilla Wonder could understand each other. :eek2:

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