Mueller's investigation

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pipistrelle
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#101

Post by pipistrelle » Mon May 15, 2017 6:29 pm

TollandRCR wrote:
TollandRCR wrote:Recent pictures of Trump show a worried old man.
This is only one of many pictures that show Trump in a bad light.
He looked happy with Palin and the Nuge, but otherwise he generally looks grumpy. He looks his age in that photo.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#102

Post by Chilidog » Tue May 16, 2017 5:52 pm

Meanwhile. This story isn't going away either
WASHINGTON — President Trump asked the F.B.I. director, James B. Comey, to shut down the federal investigation into Mr. Trump’s former national security adviser, Michael T. Flynn, in an Oval Office meeting in February, according to a memo Mr. Comey wrote shortly after the meeting.

“I hope you can let this go,” the president told Mr. Comey, according to the memo.

The existence of Mr. Trump’s request is the clearest evidence that the president has tried to directly influence the Justice Department and F.B.I. investigation into links between Mr. Trump’s associates and Russia.

Mr. Comey wrote the memo detailing his conversation with the president immediately after the meeting, which took place the day after Mr. Flynn resigned, according to two people who read the memo. The memo was part of a paper trail Mr. Comey created documenting what he perceived as the president’s improper efforts to influence a continuing investigation. An F.B.I. agent’s contemporaneous notes are widely held up in court as credible evidence of conversations.
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/05/16/u ... id=1212423

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#103

Post by tek » Tue May 16, 2017 6:27 pm

Mr. Comey wrote the memo detailing his conversation with the president immediately after the meeting, which took place the day after Mr. Flynn resigned, according to two people who read the memo. The memo was part of a paper trail Mr. Comey created documenting what he perceived as the president’s improper efforts to influence a continuing investigation. An F.B.I. agent’s contemporaneous notes are widely held up in court as credible evidence of conversations.
Wow.

Did Trump think the FBI is like his Mafia buddies?
There's no way back
from there to here

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Chilidog
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#104

Post by Chilidog » Tue May 16, 2017 6:39 pm

Comey: "Fuggetaboutit."

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#105

Post by Gregg » Tue May 16, 2017 7:20 pm

And still, Republicans are ''worried'' or ''concerned'.
Thursday someone will produce a videotape where he shoots a child on Pennsylvania Avenue, and Mitch McConnell will say ''he might have done something questionable''.
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Chilidog
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#106

Post by Chilidog » Tue May 16, 2017 7:21 pm

Gregg wrote:And still, Republicans are ''worried'' or ''concerned'.
Thursday someone will produce a videotape where he shoots a child on Pennsylvania Avenue, and Mitch McConnell will say ''he might have done something questionable''.
The little snowflake deserved it!

(they already did that)

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#107

Post by Reality Check » Tue May 16, 2017 7:22 pm

Isn't this about to the line of obstruction of justice? MSNBC also reported Comey documented every frigging conversation with Resident Dumpster Fire.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#108

Post by RVInit » Tue May 16, 2017 7:40 pm

Gregg wrote:And still, Republicans are ''worried'' or ''concerned'.
Thursday someone will produce a videotape where he shoots a child on Pennsylvania Avenue, and Mitch McConnell will say ''he might have done something questionable''.
:yeah: and this is why Republicans have no credibility with me and have lost my respect.
Edit: I mean Republican politicians. I should have specified this.
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pipistrelle
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#109

Post by pipistrelle » Tue May 16, 2017 9:17 pm

Just saw a letter from Chaffetz to McCabe asking him to cough up Comey's documents in case the president tried to influence/impede.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#110

Post by Dolly » Tue May 16, 2017 9:50 pm

pipistrelle wrote:Just saw a letter from Chaffetz to McCabe asking him to cough up Comey's documents in case the president tried to influence/impede.


4 more pages "Responding to Committee Document Requests" at this Facebook post

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#111

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Wed May 17, 2017 8:24 am

Reality Check wrote:Isn't this about to the line of obstruction of justice? MSNBC also reported Comey documented every frigging conversation with Resident Dumpster Fire.
Like every good lawyer should.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#112

Post by Sugar Magnolia » Wed May 17, 2017 8:36 am

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Reality Check wrote:Isn't this about to the line of obstruction of justice? MSNBC also reported Comey documented every frigging conversation with Resident Dumpster Fire.
Like every good lawyer should.
And every good LEO.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#113

Post by noblepa » Wed May 17, 2017 10:05 am

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Reality Check wrote:Isn't this about to the line of obstruction of justice? MSNBC also reported Comey documented every frigging conversation with Resident Dumpster Fire.
Like every good lawyer should.
This is especially true when the conversation or communication is such that anyone with half a brain can see might be a question in the future. Comey was certainly smart enough to know that the Russia investigation was controversial. So, he knew that he might be called on to testify before congress or even in court, about this conversation.

While such a memo is not, in itself, directly admissible, it can be brought in to corroborate a witness' testimony and refresh his/her memory.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#114

Post by Gregg » Wed May 17, 2017 10:12 am

One of the talking heads on TV last night mentioned that an FBI Agents contemporaneous notes can be admitted as evidence. I was curious how true that was.

Another thing I thought was true and am told is not is that a sitting President cannot be indicted. There seems to be at least some debate on that, and it might be legally possible in theory, its not a practically likely. Any lawyers have an opinion?
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#115

Post by HeatherGray » Wed May 17, 2017 10:21 am

Gregg wrote:One of the talking heads on TV last night mentioned that an FBI Agents contemporaneous notes can be admitted as evidence. I was curious how true that was.

Another thing I thought was true and am told is not is that a sitting President cannot be indicted. There seems to be at least some debate on that, and it might be legally possible in theory, its not a practically likely. Any lawyers have an opinion?
Hence the famous term from the Nixon years: Unindicted Co-conspirator.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#116

Post by Maybenaut » Wed May 17, 2017 10:41 am

noblepa wrote:
Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Reality Check wrote:Isn't this about to the line of obstruction of justice? MSNBC also reported Comey documented every frigging conversation with Resident Dumpster Fire.
Like every good lawyer should.
This is especially true when the conversation or communication is such that anyone with half a brain can see might be a question in the future. Comey was certainly smart enough to know that the Russia investigation was controversial. So, he knew that he might be called on to testify before congress or even in court, about this conversation.

While such a memo is not, in itself, directly admissible, it can be brought in to corroborate a witness' testimony and refresh his/her memory.
Do the rules of evidence apply at an impeachment trial?
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#117

Post by Gregg » Wed May 17, 2017 11:59 am

The rules of impeachment are kind of vague if I recall, not nearly as comprehensive as say, FRCivPr. Whatever the written rules are, in practical reality is they're whatever the two houses of Congress want them to be.


The House passes Articles of Impeachment which function something like an indictment, and the trial in the Senate requires a 2/3 Majority to convict and remove him from office.

After Conviction and Removal by the Senate, he would still be liable for criminal prosecution, no double jeopardy would apply.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#118

Post by Reality Check » Wed May 17, 2017 12:04 pm

Maybenaut wrote: :snippity: Do the rules of evidence apply at an impeachment trial?
I believe they are whatever the Senate and the Chief Justice who presides decide they are to be. The only hard rule is that a 2/3rds vote is required for removal. The House appoints a team of members as prosecutors.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#119

Post by bob » Wed May 17, 2017 12:19 pm

IIRC, when the Senate tried the Big Dog, the FRE were adopted as the baseline.

Assuming something similar would happen in future proceedings, a contemporaneous writing would be admissible.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#120

Post by SLQ » Wed May 17, 2017 12:59 pm

Would the memos come in as public records or business records? I dealt with the admission of a police report as a public record a while back. In our state, there is case law that a police report can be admitted as a public record to the extent it contains objective information (the driver's license he reviewed listed the subject's height as 6 feet), but not to the extent it contains subjective information (the officer perceived the subject he interviewed to be 6 feet tall.)
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#121

Post by jonbeck » Wed May 17, 2017 1:10 pm

There is an argument to be made that the memos are a business record, since it was Comeys ordinary course of business to make them. Moot point because Comey will be a willing witness, he will merely refresh his recollection (if necessary) with the memos.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#122

Post by Dolly » Wed May 17, 2017 7:07 pm

wrong thread?
Under Pressure, DOJ Has Named a Special Counsel to Oversee the Russia Investigation

The Justice Department has appointed a special counsel to oversee the FBI’s investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election and possible coordination with the Trump campaign. In an order issued Wednesday, Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein named former FBI director Robert S. Mueller to the role. Mueller, who has most recently been working at the law firm WilmerHale, was appointed to the FBI director job by George W. Bush a week before Sept. 11 and served for 12 years.

Appointing a special counsel was widely viewed as the only way for the Justice Department to bring any semblance of integrity to the Russia probe, which Rosenstein became responsible for after Attorney General Jeff Sessions recused himself from it under pressure back in March. Rosenstein's decision comes eight days after Trump fired James Comey as the director of the FBI, in a move that Trump himself admitted was motivated by his displeasure with the status of the Russia investigation (and involved a letter from Rosenstein criticizing Comey's handling of the Hillary Clinton email investigation).

In his memo Wednesday, Rosenstein specifies that the investigation Mueller is now in charge of concerns “any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump” as well as “any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation”—an implicit reference to Trump’s alleged attempts to undermine the process.

Rosenstein said in a statement that while his decision to appoint a special counsel should not be read as a finding that “crimes have been committed,” he believes that it is “in the public interest” to “place this investigation under the authority of a person who exercises a degree of independence from the normal chain of command.” <SNIP>
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#123

Post by Jim » Wed May 17, 2017 7:19 pm

Watergate on whatever Trump is taking.

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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#124

Post by Reality Check » Wed May 17, 2017 7:24 pm

Mueller. Well, it could have been worse. A George W. Bush appointee, I suppose a Republican who is not batshit crazy is what passes for middle of the road in these times. There is at least a chance he won't sweep things under the rug.
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Re: FBI investigation of Trump

#125

Post by Estiveo » Wed May 17, 2017 7:30 pm

Mueller stood up to W over warrantless surveillance and Obama liked him enough to extend his directorship at the FBI.

Ken Starr managed to expand Whitewater to include blowjobs, so maybe Mueller can expand Russia into emoluments and pussy grabbing.
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