Mueller's investigation of Trump

[Addie]

VOX - Matt Yglesias

You should care about the Trump-Russia scandal

It's not a distraction. It's about holding the president accountable to the public and not his bottom line.

While the unfolding saga of Donald Trump and his associates’ ties to Russia has riveted millions of Americans for months, millions more find the media’s fascination with it bizarre or even perverse. At the end of the day, one might reasonably ask, what does this have to do with my life? The answer is: quite a lot.

The investigation is important for American foreign policy, of course. But the scandal implicates something more far-reaching and consequential — whether wealthy and powerful people will be held accountable for their actions or whether a long-simmering culture of impunity is about to boil over and leave ordinary people defenseless.

There’s a reason the same president who’s spent months trying to block an investigation of Russian hacking also has the State Department spending $15,000 at his Vancouver hotel, has the Secret Service spending $35,000 renting golf carts from his Palm Beach resort, and is collecting millions of dollars in conflict of interest revenue through his DC hotel. There’s a reason that same president decided to ignore the American Academy of Pediatrics and reject the government’s own science and let chemical companies keep selling a pesticide that doctors say is poisoning young children’s brains. There’s a reason his health care bill breaks his promises to protect Medicaid and lower deductibles and that his budget breaks his promise to protect Social Security.

Donald Trump is a president who cares only about himself. That, fundamentally, is what the Russia scandal is about, and it’s what his whole presidency is about too. The investigation, conversely, is about accountability and whether anything can force Trump to acknowledge an obligation to serve the public rather than to have the levers of government serve his narrow self-interest.

Russian hackers committed serious crimes

It’s easy to forget amid the partisan tumult and talk of possible “collusion” between the Trump campaign and a foreign power, but this whole story started with a rather straightforward crime. Someone — later identified by American intelligence and law enforcement officials as the Russian government — hacked first the Democratic National Committee internal email and then the Gmail inbox of John Podesta, Hillary Clinton’s campaign chair. They then posted the entirety of the stolen emails online for the world to see.

That’s a crime.

Adding:

CNN: How the Trump Jr. meeting fits into the larger Putin game plan

WaPo: Ruth Marcus: Behind the Trump team’s bluster, a dark legal strategy

[Maybenaut]

“You know, adopting babies from Russia was a big thing, and it was ended, but that was a big thing. But during the campaign, I mean, I may be wrong, I don’t remember anybody ever bringing it up as an issue.”

One reason he might not remember anyone bringing it up is because that wasn't the reason for the meeting.

[noblepa]

I can't imagine Jr not telling daddy he had an important meeting coming up to provide dirt on Clinton

Agree

nor can I imagine Trump himself not wanting to attend.

I can. I imagine he probably told Jr to attend and report back on how useful their information was. If there was value, he'd get involved.

according to those who have worked with him in the past, he's a micro-manager. He was there..

Also, The Donald doesn't seem to understand (or care about) the concept of "plausible deniability". So, having junior take the meeting and report back would never occur to him.

[Sterngard Friegen]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

[RVInit]

“You know, adopting babies from Russia was a big thing, and it was ended, but that was a big thing. But during the campaign, I mean, I may be wrong, I don’t remember anybody ever bringing it up as an issue.”

One reason he might not remember anyone bringing it up is because that wasn't the reason for the meeting.

[much ado]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

[Sterngard Friegen]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

Off Topic

I actually had one, with wax cylinders. I'd like to say it was an office decoration but you wouldn't believe me. PS: it worked!

[much ado]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

Off Topic

I actually had one, with wax cylinders. I'd like to say it was an office decoration but you wouldn't believe me. PS: it worked!

Off Topic

I am not surprised. You were probably using a Dictaphone when I was a teenager wishing I had one to play with.

[Kendra]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... e0254b5e1f

This is a fun take down of The Excuses...

It's been a week since the Donald Trump Jr. scandal broke, and the White House and its allies have trotted out a whole bunch of different defenses — some of them only suggestive — from the 39-year-old's age to blaming former attorney general Loretta Lynch to the idea that it was only attempted collusion. Over the weekend, President Trump's lawyer even tried to suggest the Secret Service had no problems with the meeting — only to have that argument quickly unravel.

It's getting a little hard to keep track of all it. So below is a scorecard of each one, along with how plausible it is — scored from 0 to 10, with 10 being the most plausible.

[kate520]

Off Topic

My father and grandmother surreptitiously recorded Roosevelt's fireside chats, as many as they could, on a reel to reel wire recorder when grandad was out of town. A few women neighbors would drop by for "coffee' or, better yet, "canasta" to listen and discuss, which they were forbidden to do at home by their husbands.

[Notorial Dissent]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

Off Topic

I actually had one, with wax cylinders. I'd like to say it was an office decoration but you wouldn't believe me. PS: it worked!

Off Topic

What I want to know is do you still have the rock slab and hammer and chisels? Or was it clay pads and sharp sticks?

[Sam the Centipede]

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

Off Topic

I actually had one, with wax cylinders. I'd like to say it was an office decoration but you wouldn't believe me. PS: it worked!

Off Topic

I am not surprised. You were probably using a Dictaphone when I was a teenager wishing I had one to play with.

Of course, one always had to be wary of asking any colleague "can I use your Dictaphone?" in case he started (miming!) unzipping his pants...

[YellowMustard]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... e0254b5e1f

This is a fun take down of The Excuses...

It's been a week since the Donald Trump Jr. scandal broke, and the White House and its allies have trotted out a whole bunch of different defenses — some of them only suggestive — from the 39-year-old's age to blaming former attorney general Loretta Lynch to the idea that it was only attempted collusion. Over the weekend, President Trump's lawyer even tried to suggest the Secret Service had no problems with the meeting — only to have that argument quickly unravel.

It's getting a little hard to keep track of all it. So below is a scorecard of each one, along with how plausible it is — scored from 0 to 10, with 10 being the most plausible.

Speaking of excuses, have y'all seen this? http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2017/05/ ... klist.html

[Chilidog]

One question I've not seen discussed,

Did Junior or any of the other three stooges make any attempt to assure that the information being offered was not illegally obtained?

Or did they they just wink at each other and say, "it fell off the back of a truck."

[Sam the Centipede]

One question I've not seen discussed,

Did Junior or any of the other three stooges make any attempt to assure that the information being offered was not illegally obtained?

Or did they they just wink at each other and say, "it fell off the back of a truck."

Oh c'mon! You know that the anwer to that question! It's "no, definitely not, no way, never in a zillion years or in a thousand star systems or a million alternate realities did Trump Jr. or his accomplices make any attempt to verify the source of the information."

[Slim Cognito]

Jr. was a floor below the Orange Menace. I am placing my bet on Sr. being on an intercom line listening to the whole thing. (Does "intercom" date me?)

Not like "Dictaphone" would.

Off Topic

I actually had one, with wax cylinders. I'd like to say it was an office decoration but you wouldn't believe me. PS: it worked!

I transcribed from a Dictaphone for decades. Doctors hated giving them up.

[MsDaisy]

I looked back and didn’t see this article posted, though I certainly could have missed it, or it may be in another thread somewhere but it’s a good example of actual events and how they line up with the Steele Dossier.

Details in Donald Trump Jr.'s emails align with parts of the explosive Trump-Russia dossier

The astonishing emails posted on Twitter by Donald Trump Jr. on Tuesday display parallels with the controversial unverified leaked document from a former British spy that BuzzFeedpublished back in January.

President Donald Trump blasted BuzzFeed for publishing the document, which had not been confirmed by any independent source or authority. He called Buzzfeed "a failing pile of garbage" at a press conference the next day. The document had been written by ex-MI6 employee Christopher Steele, now a private security consultant.

More

http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-t ... ent-2017-7

[vic]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the ... e0254b5e1f

This is a fun take down of The Excuses...

It's been a week since the Donald Trump Jr. scandal broke, and the White House and its allies have trotted out a whole bunch of different defenses — some of them only suggestive — from the 39-year-old's age to blaming former attorney general Loretta Lynch to the idea that it was only attempted collusion. Over the weekend, President Trump's lawyer even tried to suggest the Secret Service had no problems with the meeting — only to have that argument quickly unravel.

It's getting a little hard to keep track of all it. So below is a scorecard of each one, along with how plausible it is — scored from 0 to 10, with 10 being the most plausible.

But if you add up all the scores, it's a 10! Winning!

Off Topic

For Slarti, et al: That's a "10", not 10 factorial.

[Addie]

Update:

WaPo: Eighth person in Trump Tower meeting is identified

An American-based employee of a Russian real estate company took part in a June 2016 Trump Tower meeting between a Russian lawyer and Donald Trump Jr., bringing to eight the number of known participants at the session that has emerged a key focus of the investigation of the Trump campaign’s interactions with Russian.

Ike Kaveladze’s presence was confirmed by Scott Balber, an attorney for Emin and Aras Agalarov, the Russian developers who hosted the Trump-owned Miss Universe pageant in 2013. Balber said Kaveladze works for the Agalarovs’ company and attended as their representative.

Balber said Tuesday that he received a phone call from a representative of Special Counsel Robert Mueller over the weekend requesting the identity of the Agalarov representative , which he said he provided. The request is the first public indication that Mueller’s team is investigating the meeting.

Adding:

Politico: Eighth man in Trump Tower meeting was linked to money laundering

Daily Beast: Donald Trump Jr. Met Russian Accused of Laundering $1.4 Billion

Slate: Donald Trump Jr. Meeting Also Included Accused Money Launderer Who Was Born in Soviet Union

Think Progress: Mysterious 8th person at Trump Jr. meeting allegedly ran massive Russian money-laundering scheme

-------------------------------------

What's the big sekrit?

CNN

Special Counsel investigators seeking info from 'eighth man' at Trump Tower meeting

Washington (CNN) Special Counsel investigators are seeking information from the still-publicly unidentified eighth person who attended the June 2016 meeting with Donald Trump Jr. at Trump Tower, this person's attorney Scott Balber said Tuesday.

"The eighth person has been identified by prosecutors and we are cooperating fully with prosecutors as a result of the investigation. To preserve the integrity of the investigation we are declining to identify him at this time," Balber told CNN.

Balber said his client hasn't been interviewed yet and that Special Counsel Robert Mueller's investigators have not reached out about Emin and Aras Agalarov, whom he also represents. ,,,

The eighth person has been described by sources familiar with the circumstances as an employee and US representative of the Agalarovs.

Balber said the individual is a long-time US citizen who speaks fluent Russian and has "never had any engagement with the Russian government in any capacity."

[Chilidog]

So, does Jared have to revise his SF-86 again!

[Addie]

Foreign Policy

Could Trump Jr., Kushner, or Manafort Be Charged Under the Espionage Act?

If the meeting at Trump Tower feels to you like treason, that's probably because it may actually be espionage.

The current focal point of the Russia scandal is the confab at Trump Tower, an Apalachin meeting of sorts in which at least eight agents of the Trump campaign and the Russian government met to discuss the Russia’s opposition research on the Clintons. The Russians apparently offered this information in exchange for the Trump campaign’s willingness to hear them out on the Magnitsky Act. Donald Trump Jr. has protested that nothing ever came of this.

Over the weekend, however, the Associated Press reported on an interview it conducted with one of the Russians at the meeting. Rinat Akhmetshin, a Russian-American lobbyist and former Soviet military officer, claimed that the Russian lawyer who ran the meeting, Natalya Veselnitskaya, not only promised to give the Trump campaign dirt on the Clintons, but actually presented her interlocutors with “a plastic folder with printed-out documents that detailed what she believed was the flow of illicit funds to the Democrats.”

Apparently, Trump Jr. was unimpressed with the contents of the plastic folder and asked Veselnitskaya whether she had more concrete evidence. The plastic folder, therefore, may have just contained propaganda. Whether Trump Jr. took the plastic folder with him or whether he left it behind in the conference room is unclear. What was clear, however, was the intent. According to the AP report, “Veselnitskaya presented the contents of the documents to Trump Jr. and suggested that making the information public could help the campaign.” And receiving this plastic folder, assuming it really happened, may have implicated the participants in espionage.

The word “treason” has been thrown around to describe this and other putative efforts by members of the Trump campaign to court and be courted by the Russian government during the 2016 election. For reasons that have been described here, here, and here, nothing anyone in the Trump campaign did or conceivably could have done would meet the constitutional definition of treason. (Even being a vice presidential candidate does not make you a constitutional law scholar.)

[MsDaisy]

Trump had undisclosed hour-long meeting with Putin at G-20 summit

After his much-publicized, two-and a quarter-hour meeting early this month with Russian President Vladi¬mir Putin at the Group of 20 summit in Germany, President Trump met informally with the Russian leader for an additional hour later the same day.

The second meeting, unreported at the time, took place at a dinner for G-20 leaders, a senior administration official said. Halfway through the meal, Trump left his own seat to occupy a chair next to Putin. Trump was alone, and Putin was attended only by his official interpreter.

The encounter underscores the extent to which Trump was eager throughout the summit to cultivate a friendship with Putin. During last year’s campaign, Trump spoke admiringly of Putin and at times seemed captivated by him.

Meeting each other face-to-face for the first time in Hamburg, the two presidents seemed to have a chemistry in their more formal bilateral session, evidenced by the fact that it dragged on for more than two hours.

WaPo
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... ion&wpmk=1

ETA Cross posted to "Congressional Committees: Re 2016 Elections & Russia" thread

[RTH10260]

Seems the fast moving events prevent me from posting the story of another dark episode with Russian connection, though the capital was Vienna...

► Show Spoiler

The Third Man

https://youtube.com/?v=21h0G_gU9Tw

[RTH10260]

Trump had undisclosed hour-long meeting with Putin at G-20 summit



WaPo
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... ion&wpmk=1

ETA Cross posted to "Congressional Committees: Re 2016 Elections & Russia" thread

Of course Putin knew how to lead on Teh Donald. How many secrets did he inadvertantly reveal?

[maydijo]

Trump had undisclosed hour-long meeting with Putin at G-20 summit



WaPo
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/nat ... ion&wpmk=1

ETA Cross posted to "Congressional Committees: Re 2016 Elections & Russia" thread

Of course Putin knew how to lead on Teh Donald. How many secrets did he inadvertantly reveal?

Nobody can reveal secrets like Donald. The secrets he reveals are yuuuge. He is very, very bigly on revealing secrets, especially if it's to Putin, because Putin is a good guy, a really good guy.