President* Trump - *Impeached

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ZekeB
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12251

Post by ZekeB »

Inquiring minds want to know if those who stayed at the various Trump hotels received their usual complimentary newspapers this morning. I've seen the headlines on all that major newspapers so far :)
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12252

Post by fierceredpanda »

Eh. I don't really give a fuck about someone's non-apology apology after they've just been shown the door. Be defiant, be remorseful, be silent, be anything you damn well please. Just make your way to the exit.

He said an awful thing and paid for it. If he wants to blame everyone but himself, that's his prerogative. Cynically, if he wants to stay in conservative radio, I would imagine that sincerely apologizing for anything at all would be detrimental to his prospects of getting hired.
"There's no play here. There's no angle. There's no champagne room. I'm not a miracle worker, I'm a janitor. The math on this is simple; the smaller the mess, the easier it is for me to clean up." -Michael Clayton


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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12253

Post by fierceredpanda »

ZekeB wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:40 am
Inquiring minds want to know if those who stayed at the various Trump hotels received their usual complimentary newspapers this morning. I've seen the headlines on all that major newspapers so far :)
The vote probably came too late for the evening print deadline at Pravda.
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12254

Post by DejaMoo »

neonzx wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:38 am
DejaMoo wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 7:58 am
This is how they earn the sobriquet "deplorables".

Regarding the @710KNUS situation. Chuck Bonniwell has this comment. “I made an inappropriate comment meant as a joke. I’m sorry it was not received that way.”

— Chuck and Julie (@ChuckandJulie1) December 19, 2019
Apology non-apology. Why'd he even bother writing this?? I'm sorry you didn't like my joke.
Classic DARVO. DARVO stands for "Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender." The perpetrator or offender may Deny the behavior, Attack the individual doing the confronting, and Reverse the roles of Victim and Offender such that the perpetrator assumes the victim role and turns the true victim -- or the whistle blower -- into an alleged offender. That is the basis of the "sorry you can't take a joke" non-apology.
I've heard this bull before.

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Sugar Magnolia
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12255

Post by Sugar Magnolia »

Is there any truth to this statement? It came from someone I don't know so have no idea how (in)accurate it may be.
Whatever the Senate does, he is no longer able to be pardoned for federal crimes by a future president because of the impeachment.

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12256

Post by fierceredpanda »

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 10:13 am
Is there any truth to this statement? It came from someone I don't know so have no idea how (in)accurate it may be.
Whatever the Senate does, he is no longer able to be pardoned for federal crimes by a future president because of the impeachment.
Totally false. Article II, Section 2, Clause 1:
and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.
A presidential pardon cannot reverse a conviction upon impeachment, which makes perfectly good sense, otherwise the Vice President could simply make a convicted President the President again. A presidential pardon also cannot remove any bar upon the convicted President from holding any office of profit or trust under the United States. Other than that, the pardon power is unrelated to impeachment.

Whoever wrote that is either purposefully misstating the law, or is simply ignorant and claiming to know more than they do.
"There's no play here. There's no angle. There's no champagne room. I'm not a miracle worker, I'm a janitor. The math on this is simple; the smaller the mess, the easier it is for me to clean up." -Michael Clayton


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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12257

Post by Volkonski »

Image
Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12258

Post by Volkonski »

Image

Image
Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12259

Post by Sugar Magnolia »

fierceredpanda wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 10:22 am
Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 10:13 am
Is there any truth to this statement? It came from someone I don't know so have no idea how (in)accurate it may be.
Whatever the Senate does, he is no longer able to be pardoned for federal crimes by a future president because of the impeachment.
Totally false. Article II, Section 2, Clause 1:
and he shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.
A presidential pardon cannot reverse a conviction upon impeachment, which makes perfectly good sense, otherwise the Vice President could simply make a convicted President the President again. A presidential pardon also cannot remove any bar upon the convicted President from holding any office of profit or trust under the United States. Other than that, the pardon power is unrelated to impeachment.

Whoever wrote that is either purposefully misstating the law, or is simply ignorant and claiming to know more than they do.
So Pence could pardon trump for any and all federal crimes except the actual impeachment?

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12260

Post by Foggy »

That's how I see it. :smoking:
For more information, read it again.

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12261

Post by RoadScholar »

Screen Shot 2019-12-19 at 11.12.34 AM.png
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12262

Post by fierceredpanda »

I'll add a caveat: That clause of the Constitution hasn't been tested in court, and there's a lot of theoretical debate. Why? Because Congress' power of impeachment and the President's power of the pardon are both (essentially) unchecked powers for which there really isn't a mechanism to resolve any disputes between the branches, and into which the courts are exceedingly unlikely to ever insert themselves to resolve any dispute. Whether they would beg off on political question grounds or make up some other reason, the Judiciary wants to stay out of these areas.

It's the same with war powers. The Constitution is super clear on who has the power to declare war: Congress. And yet, no court has ever ruled that the War Powers Act - which more or less authorizes the President to declare war and then ask for an ex post facto blessing from Congress - is unconstitutional. Nor would they, as it would diminish to nothingness the ability of the President to, for example, respond quickly should a foreign power launch ballistic missiles at us that would arrive carrying nuclear warheads in less than one hour.

In the absence of case law that says the pardon language with regard to impeachment means something else, the safest course is a plain language reading that convictions for trials of impeachment are not susceptible to being pardoned. When you recall that the other usage for impeachment is to remove other officers appointed by the President, namely federal judges and cabinet secretaries, this makes perfect sense. If the President could reverse Congress' decision to impeach and convict one of his appointees simply by unilaterally issuing a pardon, then the power of impeachment would become entirely useless. The President could protect his officials with pardons, and nothing Congress could do could remove them. If Congress impeached and removed the President, the Vice President (as Acting President) could reverse that conviction, and the impasse would remain. Congress would have no power to remove officials at all. But clearly the framers of the Constitution intended for Congress to have that power, albeit with great effort, or they wouldn't have written impeachment into the document. A simple reading that impeachment removals are not subject to the President's power to pardon resolves this logical contradiction. Reading anything further into the clause creates tangles that federal courts would, as I said earlier, be highly uncomfortable trying to sort out.
"There's no play here. There's no angle. There's no champagne room. I'm not a miracle worker, I'm a janitor. The math on this is simple; the smaller the mess, the easier it is for me to clean up." -Michael Clayton


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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12263

Post by Dr. Kenneth Noisewater »

Anyone notice anything weird about his right hand in this tweet?


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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12264

Post by RTH10260 »

Sure you are not waving BYE BYE :?:

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bob
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12265

Post by bob »

Foggy wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:02 am
That's how I see it. :smoking:
I'll go one further: President Pence could pardon the impeached president for the acts underlying the impeachment. So the impeached president would never face criminal charges.

President Pence cannot pardon the actual impeachment and removal (and prohibition against holding future federal office). That's forever.
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12266

Post by AndyinPA »

I see the * Impeached.

:thumbs:
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12267

Post by Suranis »

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:35 am
Anyone notice anything weird about his right hand in this tweet?

They did a really bad job of increasing the side of his hand. The dirty rule is that you can enlarge or stretch something by 15% in order to make it look fine. They went 50% in that
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12268

Post by Somerset »

Suranis wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 1:21 pm
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:35 am
Anyone notice anything weird about his right hand in this tweet?

They did a really bad job of increasing the side of his hand. The dirty rule is that you can enlarge or stretch something by 15% in order to make it look fine They He went 50% in that
FIFY

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12269

Post by tencats »

:roll:
Jon Voight hits out at 'evil Democrats'


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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12270

Post by AndyinPA »

I thought I’d be sorry I watched that. I am.

I will probably see that at some point on my cousin’s Facebook page. :cantlook:
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12271

Post by SLQ »

pipistrelle wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 8:33 am
“I made an inappropriate comment meant as a joke. I’m sorry it was not received that way.”
Classic non-apology. It's your fault you didn't take his "joke" the right way.
I'm sorry, you idiot, that you don't understand that school shootings should never be the subject of a joke.
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12272

Post by SLQ »

Suranis wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 1:21 pm
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:
Thu Dec 19, 2019 11:35 am
Anyone notice anything weird about his right hand in this tweet?

They did a really bad job of increasing the side of his hand. The dirty rule is that you can enlarge or stretch something by 15% in order to make it look fine. They went 50% in that
Oh, yeah. Blown up, you can totally see the pixelated white out portions of the edit. (No such pixelated white portions on the closed left fist.)
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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12273

Post by neonzx »

:rotflmao:

https://nypost.com/2019/12/19/obama-gol ... impeached/

Obama golfed in Hawaii as Trump was being impeached
Image
While President Trump was hunkered down in the White House monitoring impeachment proceedings Wednesday, his predecessor in the Oval Office was hitting the links in Hawaii.

Photos show Barack Obama — a native of Honolulu — on the course at the Mid-Pacific Country Club in Lanikai, O’ahu, playing a round of golf under sunny skies and temperatures in the 70s.

Meanwhile, back at the nation’s capital, where the mercury hovered in the 30s, the House of Representatives was embroiled in hours of heated debate before eventually voting to impeach Trump.

Sporting a bright fuchsia polo shirt, white shorts, shoes and ball cap, a beaming Obama was photographed driving from the tee, lining up a putt and riding in a golf cart with an unidentified companion.
To which Trump replied, Fuck the law. I don't give a fuck about the law. I want my fucking money.

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12274

Post by Sterngard Friegen »

Does President Obama have to pay triple greens fees when he golfs at a Trump property?

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Re: President* Trump - *Impeached

#12275

Post by Orlylicious »

I like this! #IMPOTUS would be good in the title too also :lol:

George Conway ‏ @gtconway3d 11 minutes ago

IMPOTUS (IMpeached President Of The United States) @realDonaldTrump is accusing @SpeakerPelosi of political malpractice. I don’t think so. #IMPOTUS
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