Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816

#101

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:35 pm

Reality Check wrote:
Karen Walker wrote:Did anyone else hear IG say, "Mr. Dowdell is here"? It was right at the very beginning of the afternoon session. I listened a few times & it sure sounded like it but she wasn't at the mic & may be my wishful thinking.
Yes, I heard that. He was on IG's list of fake grand jury members to testify when she decided to not call him. I think the Judge was getting on her case because after three of them it was more of same. I will see if I can find a time stamp and PM it to Orlylicious and Karen Walker.
Too bad. Meggs could have asked questions about the supposedly accidental recording that was then accidentally transcribed and then accidentally passed around. (Florida is a "two-party state" which actually means all parties.) And Garcia would have elicited questions from Dowdell which could have been used in a subsequent perjury prosecution if Dowdell had testified the way the other 3 witnesses had.

Dowdell dodged a bullet.



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816

#102

Post by vic » Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:46 pm

Sterngard Friegen wrote:
Reality Check wrote:
Karen Walker wrote:Did anyone else hear IG say, "Mr. Dowdell is here"? It was right at the very beginning of the afternoon session. I listened a few times & it sure sounded like it but she wasn't at the mic & may be my wishful thinking.
Yes, I heard that. He was on IG's list of fake grand jury members to testify when she decided to not call him. I think the Judge was getting on her case because after three of them it was more of same. I will see if I can find a time stamp and PM it to Orlylicious and Karen Walker.
Too bad. Meggs could have asked questions about the supposedly accidental recording that was then accidentally transcribed and then accidentally passed around. (Florida is a "two-party state" which actually means all parties.) And Garcia would have elicited questions fro,m Dowdell which could have been used in a subsequent perjury prosecution if Dowdell had testified the way the other 3 witnesses had.

Dowdell dodged a bullet.
IANAL, but I took a quick look at the statute and it appears to say that disclosing the contents of the illegal recording are also illegal. Did IG manage to do that? Or would that be exempt somehow?



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Includes Terry's Testimony

#103

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:41 am

Sterngard Friegen wrote:I've listened to most of the testimony at 1.5X normal speed. Some of it can be listened to a 2X normal speed.
You're way ahead of me - I'm still on day one. And I found that at least some of Dana Johnson's testimony needed to be slowed all the way down to 1.25X. But the Judge and Mr. Meggs can both definitely be understood (with ease) at 2x.


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#104

Post by Turtle » Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:28 pm

I may have identified the point in the cross examination where the Trussell Train goes off the tracks.

PM session 2 (#10)
4m 35s
Meggs: Did you file that in the record with the clerk?
Trussell: No I did not.
Meggs: You didn't take it to the clerk?
Trussell: I didn't file it with the clerk
Meggs: Well, you don't file anything with the clerk-
Trussell: That's correct.
Meggs: You take things to the clerk to file, do you not?

objection by Garcia
overruled

Trussell: Sir, my understanding of filing is that it would have to go into the court record.
...

If Terry does not realize here that it might have been a mistake to take the stand, Garcia sure does.



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#105

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:21 pm

I'm watching the chambers video, and I was mildly amused (enough to go back and run it at normal speed instead of my normal 2x) by Willie Meggs' description of Gimmy's finest work product:

Meggs, handing pamphlet to the judge: I was given this by Major Harding. Apparently, that was placed on all the cars around the courthouse yesterday, so it's conceivable that it was also placed on a juror's car. It contains some pretty...[full 2 second pause]...bad stuff."


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#106

Post by Reality Check » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:12 pm

I put a timeline together on the meeting in chambers. The Timeline team has it. There is a precious IG moment at the end that I don't want to spoil. ;)


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#107

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:03 pm

Early note from the first in-court session:

I enjoyed Garcia's attempt to get Major Harden declared an adversary witness so that she could ask leading questions. She could have asked the same leading question on cross examination when he testified during the prosecution's case, instead of waiting until she put him back on the stand. (Entirely unnecessarily, as far as I can tell.)

She truly seems to have gone out of her way to beclown herself during this trial.


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#108

Post by Notorial Dissent » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:15 pm

Mikedunford wrote:Early note from the first in-court session:

I enjoyed Garcia's attempt to get Major Harden declared an adversary witness so that she could ask leading questions. She could have asked the same leading question on cross examination when he testified during the prosecution's case, instead of waiting until she put him back on the stand. (Entirely unnecessarily, as far as I can tell.)

She truly seems to have gone out of her way to beclown herself during this trial.
Since she terribly, obviously didn't know what she was doing from the getgo, I don't see that it would have made much sense. I will still go with floundering epically in deep dark waters in which she should NEVER EVER have ventured.


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#109

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:47 pm

Mikedunford wrote:Early note from the first in-court session:

I enjoyed Garcia's attempt to get Major Harden declared an adversary witness so that she could ask leading questions. She could have asked the same leading question on cross examination when he testified during the prosecution's case, instead of waiting until she put him back on the stand. (Entirely unnecessarily, as far as I can tell.)

She truly seems to have gone out of her way to beclown herself during this trial.
In defense of Garcia (almost), defense lawyers often have a reason for wanting to put on their case in their case. So they will often ask that a witness be recalled. (Apparently the judge didn't do it for the court clerk because she had other pressing business.) At the point the prosecution witness is recalled, the judge should allow the witness to be cross-examined by the defense.

For those who are not lawyers, in cross-examination a lawyer can ask leading questions and use that to confine the witness' testimony. Here it looked like there was a lot of leading questions on both sides with no proper objection for 95% of them. So it continued. I don't know what the judge would have done. He did acknowledge one of Garcia's "leading" objections during the testimony of one witness -- I think it was SA Seigmeister -- but said it was for "preliminary" matters and it would save time, which is a correct ruling. I think only one or two of Garcia's objections was correct. And she objected a few times on "calls for a narrative" when the correct objection would have been "no foundation." In my opinion, she truly did not seem to know what she was doing much of the time.



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#110

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Jun 12, 2016 7:08 pm

Sterngard Friegen wrote: In defense of Garcia (almost), defense lawyers often have a reason for wanting to put on their case in their case. So they will often ask that a witness be recalled. (Apparently the judge didn't do it for the court clerk because she had other pressing business.) At the point the prosecution witness is recalled, the judge should allow the witness to be cross-examined by the defense.
Even if cross was already conducted (without asking to defer the cross until the defense case) immediately following the prosecution's direct examination? And even if the recall is based on the defense's independent subpoena of the witness? Just curious.


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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#111

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Sun Jun 12, 2016 7:26 pm

Mikedunford wrote:
Sterngard Friegen wrote: In defense of Garcia (almost), defense lawyers often have a reason for wanting to put on their case in their case. So they will often ask that a witness be recalled. (Apparently the judge didn't do it for the court clerk because she had other pressing business.) At the point the prosecution witness is recalled, the judge should allow the witness to be cross-examined by the defense.
Even if cross was already conducted (without asking to defer the cross until the defense case) immediately following the prosecution's direct examination? And even if the recall is based on the defense's independent subpoena of the witness? Just curious.
Yes. That has been my experience in California and Federal courts. As for the subpoena, once a person appears in court a lawyer can ask the judge to order that person to appear. Assuming Florida law is like California (and federal) law, in this case Garcia could have asked the judge to command the witness in the defense case to testify in her case even if she had not subpoenaed that witness.

Maybe Paul Lentz will chip in with his (routinely unbelievable) observations.



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#112

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Jun 12, 2016 7:43 pm

Sterngard Friegen wrote:
Mikedunford wrote:
Sterngard Friegen wrote: In defense of Garcia (almost), defense lawyers often have a reason for wanting to put on their case in their case. So they will often ask that a witness be recalled. (Apparently the judge didn't do it for the court clerk because she had other pressing business.) At the point the prosecution witness is recalled, the judge should allow the witness to be cross-examined by the defense.
Even if cross was already conducted (without asking to defer the cross until the defense case) immediately following the prosecution's direct examination? And even if the recall is based on the defense's independent subpoena of the witness? Just curious.
Yes. That has been my experience in California and Federal courts. As for the subpoena, once a person appears in court a lawyer can ask the judge to order that person to appear. Assuming Florida law is like California (and federal) law, in this case Garcia could have asked the judge to command the witness in the defense case to testify in her case even if she had not subpoenaed that witness.

Maybe Paul Lentz will chip in with his (routinely unbelievable) observations.
I, for one, will not be foolish enough to argue with the wisdom of the ages. My initial amusement was clearly in error.


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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#113

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:07 pm

Don't worry, Mike. I don't think you're foolish. And we're both members of the same club.



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Re: Day 3 Videos STATE OF FLORIDA v TERRY TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Annie White

#114

Post by nbc » Mon Jun 13, 2016 12:22 am

Turtle wrote:I may have identified the point in the cross examination where the Trussell Train goes off the tracks.

PM session 2 (#10)
4m 35s
Meggs: Did you file that in the record with the clerk?
Trussell: No I did not.
Meggs: You didn't take it to the clerk?
Trussell: I didn't file it with the clerk
Meggs: Well, you don't file anything with the clerk-
Trussell: That's correct.
Meggs: You take things to the clerk to file, do you not?

objection by Garcia
overruled

Trussell: Sir, my understanding of filing is that it would have to go into the court record.
...

If Terry does not realize here that it might have been a mistake to take the stand, Garcia sure does.
Ouch.. I really have to relisten...



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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#115

Post by Mikedunford » Mon Jun 13, 2016 5:13 pm

I was truly tickled when Ms. Madonna Roberts described sovereign citizens as "the flavor of the month." Hey, Gimmie, how'd that make you feel? A little like Rum Raisin?


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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#116

Post by Reality Check » Mon Jun 13, 2016 5:14 pm

Bittersweet chocolate anyone?


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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#117

Post by Mikedunford » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:45 pm

Still slowly working my way through the videos. (I've never seen a trial start-to-finish, so I thought I'd make the effort.)

Just got to the post-testimony portion. It would appear that Judge Hankinson is pretty thoroughly done with Garcia by this point - he asks her for something, she whines about not being able to get it done in 5 minutes, and he doesn't even really look at her as he's leaving - just tells her to get it finished.


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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#118

Post by woodworker » Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:43 pm

Mikedunford wrote:Still slowly working my way through the videos. (I've never seen a trial start-to-finish, so I thought I'd make the effort.)

Just got to the post-testimony portion. It would appear that Judge Hankinson is pretty thoroughly done with Garcia by this point - he asks her for something, she whines about not being able to get it done in 5 minutes, and he doesn't even really look at her as he's leaving - just tells her to get it finished.
I am watching from beginning to end, trying to mark up as I watch. I am not sure why, other than masochism, but I am trying to put together a comprehensive review/commentary of the testimony, taking into account two different ways, the first with just the information known by the jury and the second the information known to the jury and known by the fogbow. Sometimes I think that there is very little difference between the two data universes and sometimes I think the differences are universe-shattering.

I have just gotten up to TT's direct and Meggs cross of TT and I have to say that it is a good thing I am not a state prosecutor. When TT does his tearful performance, and I say performance because that is what it FUCKING WAS, if I had been Meggs I would grabbed a gun from one of the bailiffs and emptied all the rounds into TT's tiny little heart, whilst declaiming to the court and everyone there that I knew that they agreed with me, that TT was a lying sad sack of shit and a terrible actor. I am against capital punishment, but I do believe in putting down rabid animals, and TT is rabid.

And his bullshit about how the statutory grand jury never met and as foreman he had to take all these actions. Puhleeeze, give the whiner a box of kleenex, but man he is a whiny little shit.

More, much more, to come.


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Re: Day 3 Videos FLORIDA v TRUSSELL 060816 - Incl Terry's Testimony, Jury Tampering, Hatcher, Harden, FDLE White, Linton

#119

Post by Orlylicious » Sat Jun 18, 2016 10:24 pm

There was something about Terry's testimony that was familiar... at last I found it. Of course, it's Bobby Van's "Question Me An Answer" from the 1973 movie musical, "Lost Horizon!" One of my favs, from 3:15 is crazy. It's a huge, long musical number. Similar results.

"Even though your answer may be wrong, my question will be right..." --Bobby Van as Terry Trussell :P
https://youtu.be/sew4NUQ-VkI



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