Bundy related gossip and discussion

rifleman1635
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3726

Post by rifleman1635 »

ZekeB wrote:
noblepa wrote:I think that the Bundy's are Mormons in the same way the members of the Westboro Baptist Church are baptists.
Baptists and many other religions pick and choose the Bible passages that suit their own agenda. Doing so allows them to claim they are following the Bible. I've read the Book of Mormon. I can't find any passages that justify Bundy's actions.
The Book of Mormon is not the only "divine revelation" - there is also the "D&C" (Doctrines and Covenants) and "Pearl of Great Price" both of which give further "Revealed Word of God" through the "Prophet" Joseph Smith.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3727

Post by boots »

rifleman1635 wrote:
ZekeB wrote:
noblepa wrote:I think that the Bundy's are Mormons in the same way the members of the Westboro Baptist Church are baptists.
Baptists and many other religions pick and choose the Bible passages that suit their own agenda. Doing so allows them to claim they are following the Bible. I've read the Book of Mormon. I can't find any passages that justify Bundy's actions.
The Book of Mormon is not the only "divine revelation" - there is also the "D&C" (Doctrines and Covenants) and "Pearl of Great Price" both of which give further "Revealed Word of God" through the "Prophet" Joseph Smith.
You obviously haven't read the Book of the Holy Bird Sanctuary
rifleman1635
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3728

Post by rifleman1635 »

Techno Luddite wrote: :snippity:

You obviously haven't read the Book of the Holy Bird Sanctuary
:lol:
I did a google search on that and got a link to a self-published book titled "Empty Contract Promises Will Be Without Guarantee In Heaven" (there's a passage which refers to evil seed being in the Sacred Bird Sanctuary) ... I got the distinct impression I was reading something that Cliven, Ryan or maybe even Medenbach would have written ...
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3729

Post by Grumpy Old Guy »

rifleman1635 wrote:
Techno Luddite wrote: :snippity:

You obviously haven't read the Book of the Holy Bird Sanctuary
:lol:
I did a google search on that and got a link to a self-published book titled "Empty Contract Promises Will Be Without Guarantee In Heaven" (there's a passage which refers to evil seed being in the Sacred Bird Sanctuary) ... I got the distinct impression I was reading something that Cliven, Ryan or maybe even Medenbach would have written ...
Amazon credits the book to "Mr Michael Richard Meade".

Here is his Bio:

Biography
CLASSIFIED SECRET FOR INTERNATIONAL SECURITY:

The truth about history/religion has been covered up and deliberately kept from the people for thousands of years and now the author is enlightening the world and telling them the truth, bringing them out of the darkness. When they finally see the light it's going to cause that massive headache and shock just as if they were physically locked up in the dung-eon for thousands of years. Unfortunately shock therapy is the only means available to wake the people of the world up who have been brainwashed and indoctrinated by the Churches, Synagogues and Mosques. These religious fan-addicts are the same as Drug Addicts or alcoholics who refuse to believe they are the problem and are willing to destroy their lives and everybody's life around them just like the Muslims Fan-addicts are doing right now.

His other listings:

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=dp_byline_ ... evancerank
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3730

Post by Jerry Mander »

Here's a video of Ammon's video call to his family on his birthday. In all seriousness, I found this very sad. To say Ammon seems dejected is an understatement. I don't think this will be Ammon's last Prison-vision birthday.

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Dolly
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3731

Post by Dolly »

The Oath
1 hr ·
This will be my only post concerning this situation. I am being attacked online and through Twitter by an insignificant group. The wrongful and spiteful lies being told naturally hurt, particularly when they are being told by someone you gave your trust to. I will have faith those that follow me knows that my character speaks for itself.
~Chastity


I don't know if she means the entire Patriot / Bundy stuff or a particular part of it.

I don't follow her personal page. It is not public unless you are a "friend".
I am not sure if she closed down her twitter account. IIRC you had to be "approved/whatever" to see her tweets. Now I get:
Sorry, that page doesn’t exist!
https://twitter.com/CallmeChass

mimi is the real twitter expert.
I did find some discussion about her. Nothing from today.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40CallmeChass
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3732

Post by HumbleScribe »

Jerry Mander wrote:Here's a video of Ammon's video call to his family on his birthday. In all seriousness, I found this very sad. To say Ammon seems dejected is an understatement. I don't think this will be Ammon's last Prison-vision birthday.

Yes, you are correct. He will have many more birthdays in prison. Perhaps as many as 20-25, if the sentences in Nevada are to be served consecutively--and I am just spitballing here.

Why he is dejected is unknown. It could be because the grim reality of the ultimate consequences of his actions is finally starting to sink in. I would think that his lawyers -- both CMA and the current Philford have told him repeatedly that he is fighting a losing battle, and that a plea arrangement would have cut his losses. Motion after motion is denied. The evidence for conviction is overwhelming. Maybe he regrets his "in for a penny, in for a pound" stance, and now feels that he cannot take a plea without alienating himself from his side of the family. Family is so important (I believe) in Mormon households.

Or it could be that birthdays are fun times with family traditions and celebrations. (I know they are for me and mine.) And he is missing that special time when he gets to be the center of attention with his wife and kids for that one glorious day.

Or, maybe both.

Ammon, perhaps there is a silver lining to all this. There will be several months after you are convicted in Oregon to sober up and take a plea in Nevada. Then your might be able to rejoin your family just that much sooner. But Ammon, I must tell you that I am not a lawyer.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3733

Post by Mink »

Jerry Mander wrote:Here's a video of Ammon's video call to his family on his birthday. In all seriousness, I found this very sad. To say Ammon seems dejected is an understatement. I don't think this will be Ammon's last Prison-vision birthday.

In comparison, I find this--thanks to Ammon--a lot sadder: http://www.hcn.org/articles/grazing-cat ... -occupants

He made his own bed, the birds that rely on the refuge didn't. This isn't just about bad guys. This, for me, a habitual birder, is also about the carelessness and outright disdain for the natural world shown by these idiots, as well. I'm more angry after reading that article in HCN than I was. By far. Ammon gets no mercy from me. :torches:
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3734

Post by maydijo »

I've registered to clear up a few things about the Bundys and Mormonism. First I should say this is my opinion; but I was born and raised in Eastern Oregon and I am a Mormon. There are very strong cultural elements at play here for me; the Bundys offend me as a Mormon, as an Oregonian, as an Eastern Oregonian, as someone whose family farmed in Eastern Oregon going back several generations, as an American, and as a human being.

Please do not think that the Bundys represent Mormonism. The fact that they hide behind their religion to act in this way disgusts me, as it does every other Mormon I know.

You will find scant support for the Bundys' actions in the Book of Mormon, or in church doctrine. (In fact it is clearly against some church doctrine, including the basic tenant to uphold and respect the law.) They are clearly inspired by the story of Captain Moroni; but I believe they are much more inspired by:
a) the entirely false "White Horse" prophecy (that in the end days the Constitution will be hanging by a thread and a small group of Mormon men will ride in to save the day) (I was always taught that this was an urban legend; however my understanding is that some Mormons actually believe it. I am pretty sure the Bundys do.)
b) Ezra Taft Benson - Ezra Taft Benson was the President of the LDS Church from 1985 until 1994. As President of the Church he largely steered clear from politics. However prior to serving as President of the Church he was a member of the John Birch Society. IIRC (and I may not) he was a huge fan of Cleon Skousen. He was extremely right-wing. There's a hierarchy in the LDS Church that you really don't need to understand (nothing secretive about it; the information is freely available; but it's just not important for this discussion); but before he was President he held other high-ranking positions in the LDS Church and frequently spoke at bi-annual General Conferences. These talks can all be found at lds.org. If you read through some of his talks from the 1970s especially, you will find that they are highly political - much more so than I would think the LDS Church would be comfortable with today. The Bundys, I believe, are most strongly inspired by Ezra Taft Benson, and in particular by his talks from the 1950s -1970s.
c) I also believe they are to a lesser extent inspired by the history of Mormon persecution (some of which was entirely undeserved; some of which they definitely contributed to with their own actions) - Some people just like playing the martyr. This is certainly not unique to Mormonism; but I think the Bundys (especially Ammon) have a very big martyr complex.
d) I believe that Ammon Bundy actually believes he's a prophet. This puts him in very serious contradiction of Mormon doctrine and theology.

I do not believe Kelli Stewart is LDS because she talks about being "saved." Mormons don't talk about being saved. In general we don't use evangelical parlance.

I'm happy to answer any questions; but with the standard disclaimer, this is just my opinion, I don't speak for the LDS church and am in fact inactive, although I still consider myself a Mormon and am fairly well-versed in Mormon history and culture.
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RVInit
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3735

Post by RVInit »

maydijo wrote:I've registered to clear up a few things about the Bundys and Mormonism. First I should say this is my opinion; but I was born and raised in Eastern Oregon and I am a Mormon. There are very strong cultural elements at play here for me; the Bundys offend me as a Mormon, as an Oregonian, as an Eastern Oregonian, as someone whose family farmed in Eastern Oregon going back several generations, as an American, and as a human being.

Please do not think that the Bundys represent Mormonism. The fact that they hide behind their religion to act in this way disgusts me, as it does every other Mormon I know.

You will find scant support for the Bundys' actions in the Book of Mormon, or in church doctrine. (In fact it is clearly against some church doctrine, including the basic tenant to uphold and respect the law.) They are clearly inspired by the story of Captain Moroni; but I believe they are much more inspired by:
a) the entirely false "White Horse" prophecy (that in the end days the Constitution will be hanging by a thread and a small group of Mormon men will ride in to save the day) (I was always taught that this was an urban legend; however my understanding is that some Mormons actually believe it. I am pretty sure the Bundys do.)
b) Ezra Taft Benson - Ezra Taft Benson was the President of the LDS Church from 1985 until 1994. As President of the Church he largely steered clear from politics. However prior to serving as President of the Church he was a member of the John Birch Society. IIRC (and I may not) he was a huge fan of Cleon Skousen. He was extremely right-wing. There's a hierarchy in the LDS Church that you really don't need to understand (nothing secretive about it; the information is freely available; but it's just not important for this discussion); but before he was President he held other high-ranking positions in the LDS Church and frequently spoke at bi-annual General Conferences. These talks can all be found at lds.org. If you read through some of his talks from the 1970s especially, you will find that they are highly political - much more so than I would think the LDS Church would be comfortable with today. The Bundys, I believe, are most strongly inspired by Ezra Taft Benson, and in particular by his talks from the 1950s -1970s.
c) I also believe they are to a lesser extent inspired by the history of Mormon persecution (some of which was entirely undeserved; some of which they definitely contributed to with their own actions) - Some people just like playing the martyr. This is certainly not unique to Mormonism; but I think the Bundys (especially Ammon) have a very big martyr complex.
d) I believe that Ammon Bundy actually believes he's a prophet. This puts him in very serious contradiction of Mormon doctrine and theology.

I do not believe Kelli Stewart is LDS because she talks about being "saved." Mormons don't talk about being saved. In general we don't use evangelical parlance.

I'm happy to answer any questions; but with the standard disclaimer, this is just my opinion, I don't speak for the LDS church and am in fact inactive, although I still consider myself a Mormon and am fairly well-versed in Mormon history and culture.
Very interesting. Do you have any sense of whether the Bundy's would or could be excommunicated (is that even a thing that's possible?) if (probably more like when) they are found guilty of any crimes?
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3736

Post by maydijo »

With regards to excommunication: The official church policy is not to comment on whether or not a person has been excommunicated. I have never participated in a disciplinary process. If you want a first hand account you can find several of them on-line. Church courts are not convened very often. This is my understanding of the process:

Excommunication is a matter for local authorities. Generally the decision to hold a church court (which may or may not result in excommunication) is taken by the Stake President, who is sort of like the Cardinal. (As another poster noted, wards are local congregations; stakes are made up of several wards.) My understanding is that the Bundys and LaVoy Finicum have/had Stake Presidents who support their politics; hence they are/were safe from excommunication as long as they stayed at home.

However, if they are convicted of a crime, and serve their sentence in Oregon, their membership records will travel with them. Stakes have geographic borders. There would be a Stake President whose borders would cover the Oregon jail where he was serving his sentence. It would be up to that man to institute proceedings. However, as the sentence in Nevada is likely to be much longer than the sentence in Oregon, the Stake President whose area covers the jail in Oregon might defer to the Stake President whose area covers the jail in Nevada. It really depends on the Stake President; and it also depends on the time factor - at church courts, evidence and witnesses are produced (on both sides), and it can take time to pull all of this together.

Officially, the leader of the LDS church (e.g. the prophet, his counsellors, the apostles, etc.) do not make any recommendations to excommunicate any member. (My personal hope is that they make an exception in this case.)

It is possible to be rebaptised after excommunication. Mormons don't (or at least aren't supposed to) shun people who have been disfellowshipped or excommunicated; people who have been excommunicated aren't allowed to teach classes or go to the temple or speak in church, etc. It's supposed to be seen as a part of a repentance process which culminates in rebaptism.
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Dan1100
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3737

Post by Dan1100 »

maydijo wrote: :snippity:

Excommunication is a matter for local authorities. :snippity:

However, if they are convicted of a crime, and serve their sentence in Oregon, their membership records will travel with them. Stakes have geographic borders. There would be a Stake President whose borders would cover the Oregon jail where he was serving his sentence. :snippity:
Since it is federal court, they could be sent to a federal prison anywhere in the United States. Sometimes they are nice and let people serve close to home so their family can visit, but by no means is that always the case. Where they get convicted has very little to do with it.

Link to map of possible prisons for Bundy and Company. https://www.justice.gov/jmd/mps/manual/ ... _large.jpg
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3738

Post by arock »

maydijo wrote:I've registered to clear up a few things about the Bundys and Mormonism. First I should say this is my opinion; but I was born and raised in Eastern Oregon and I am a Mormon. There are very strong cultural elements at play here for me; the Bundys offend me as a Mormon, as an Oregonian, as an Eastern Oregonian, as someone whose family farmed in Eastern Oregon going back several generations, as an American, and as a human being.
big :snippity:
Please do not think that the Bundys represent Mormonism. The fact that they hide behind their religion to act in this way disgusts me, as it does every other Mormon I know.
I'm happy to answer any questions; but with the standard disclaimer, this is just my opinion, I don't speak for the LDS church and am in fact inactive, although I still consider myself a Mormon and am fairly well-versed in Mormon history and culture.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge and opinions -- and welcome!
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3739

Post by Sterngard Friegen »

Perhaps this could be moved to the Mormon discussion thread?
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3740

Post by maydijo »

Dan1100 wrote:
maydijo wrote: :snippity:

Excommunication is a matter for local authorities. :snippity:

However, if they are convicted of a crime, and serve their sentence in Oregon, their membership records will travel with them. Stakes have geographic borders. There would be a Stake President whose borders would cover the Oregon jail where he was serving his sentence. :snippity:
Since it is federal court, they could be sent to a federal prison anywhere in the United States. Sometimes they are nice and let people serve close to home so their family can visit, but by no means is that always the case. Where they get convicted has very little to do with it.

Link to map of possible prisons for Bundy and Company. https://www.justice.gov/jmd/mps/manual/ ... _large.jpg
Thanks for the correction.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3741

Post by Jerry Mander »

Mink wrote:
Jerry Mander wrote:Here's a video of Ammon's video call to his family on his birthday. In all seriousness, I found this very sad. To say Ammon seems dejected is an understatement. I don't think this will be Ammon's last Prison-vision birthday.

In comparison, I find this--thanks to Ammon--a lot sadder: http://www.hcn.org/articles/grazing-cat ... -occupants

He made his own bed, the birds that rely on the refuge didn't. This isn't just about bad guys. This, for me, a habitual birder, is also about the carelessness and outright disdain for the natural world shown by these idiots, as well. I'm more angry after reading that article in HCN than I was. By far. Ammon gets no mercy from me. :torches:
I'm a birder as well. After reading that article, I realized my bleeding heart was preventing me from assessing this correctly. Rot in prison, Bundy cult.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3742

Post by Sterngard Friegen »

Perhaps this could be moved to the Mormon discussion thread?
http://thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 80#p813079
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3743

Post by maydijo »

Sterngard Friegen wrote:Perhaps this could be moved to the Mormon discussion thread?
http://thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 80#p813079
I'm not really here to defend Mormonism, which is what I'd have to do if I took this discussion to that board. I just wanted to give some insights into why/how Mormonism is related to the Bundys and their beliefs. If I've made you uncomfortable I apologise; however that other board makes me very uncomfortable and I am not interested in participating in it.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3744

Post by Mink »

arock wrote:
maydijo wrote:I've registered to clear up a few things about the Bundys and Mormonism. First I should say this is my opinion; but I was born and raised in Eastern Oregon and I am a Mormon. There are very strong cultural elements at play here for me; the Bundys offend me as a Mormon, as an Oregonian, as an Eastern Oregonian, as someone whose family farmed in Eastern Oregon going back several generations, as an American, and as a human being.
big :snippity:
Please do not think that the Bundys represent Mormonism. The fact that they hide behind their religion to act in this way disgusts me, as it does every other Mormon I know.
I'm happy to answer any questions; but with the standard disclaimer, this is just my opinion, I don't speak for the LDS church and am in fact inactive, although I still consider myself a Mormon and am fairly well-versed in Mormon history and culture.
:clap:
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3745

Post by arock »

Regarding the split/creation of a separate thread to discuss the Mormon religion in general, it's my understanding that discussion of Mormonism as it relates to the Bundys/Bunkerville/Malheur falls within this thread.

See http://thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 25#p813097

Or, maybe we should start a separate thread for a certain Corvette, too, also? :-D
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3746

Post by kate520 »

You understand correctly, arock. AFAIC maydijo's comment belongs here.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3747

Post by GreatGrey »

arock wrote:Regarding the split/creation of a separate thread to discuss the Mormon religion in general, it's my understanding that discussion of Mormonism as it relates to the Bundys/Bunkerville/Malheur falls within this thread.

See http://thefogbow.com/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 25#p813097

Or, maybe we should start a separate thread for a certain Corvette, too, also? :-D
I have it on good authority the Corvette in question is a POS.
I am not "someone upthread".
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3748

Post by debdeb »

maydijo wrote:
Dan1100 wrote:
maydijo wrote: :snippity:

Excommunication is a matter for local authorities. :snippity:

However, if they are convicted of a crime, and serve their sentence in Oregon, their membership records will travel with them. Stakes have geographic borders. There would be a Stake President whose borders would cover the Oregon jail where he was serving his sentence. :snippity:
Since it is federal court, they could be sent to a federal prison anywhere in the United States. Sometimes they are nice and let people serve close to home so their family can visit, but by no means is that always the case. Where they get convicted has very little to do with it.

Link to map of possible prisons for Bundy and Company. https://www.justice.gov/jmd/mps/manual/ ... _large.jpg
Thanks for the correction.
I know first hand that excommunications can come from SLC. It happened to a good friend of mine and I can still get worked up over it. The administrative matters are handled by local authorities, but if somebody in Salt Lake wants it to happen, it will happen.

I don't know if the Bundy's will end up excommunicated. I know that being convicted of a felony (or two) is grounds for excommunicated so I guess we'll see what happens post-conviction. It may depend on how much they drag religion into their defenses.
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Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3749

Post by debdeb »

I'm up early with my baby and thought I'd get this posted. Here is my long post as to why, as a member of the LDS church, the Bundy's piss me off and some of the differences between their interpretations and mine.

First: disclaimers. Everything that follows is my opinion based on 40+ years of life and church attendance. I haven't kept up with everything the Bundyites have said so many of my thoughts are fuzzy recollections from months ago. If any points need clarification, I can do research to find sources. Needless to say, I don't speak for the church or for other church members. I be me and me alone.

As I said in my previous post, I am an active member of the church and am raising my kids in the church. I am well aware of flaws, controversies, hypocrisy, and disagreements that others have with the church and I have my own points where I don't understand or actively disagree. But there are doctrines, practices, beliefs, etc. that are specific to the LDS faith that I believe very deeply and those keep me happy with my membership. I don't come to Fogbow to litigate any of that with anybody. I come here to laugh at birthers and other rwnj, including the Bundy Gang. Which brings us to why the Bundy's piss me off, in no particular order.

1. The stories of the persecutions the early church members endured are embedded in our cultural consciousness. The saints were driven westward from New York to Ohio to Missouri to Illinois to Utah. Every child in primary (the children's program) knows these stories and sing songs memorializing the events. The pioneer experience is almost fetishized. The persecutions and tribulations of the early leaders are well remembered and often referenced, especially when somebody is going through difficult times. There are specific, and rather moving, scriptures in the D&C (doctrine and covenants - modern scripture revealed to latter day prophets) that reference these events. It pisses me off that the Bundy's have stolen this well-known, collective history and placed themselves at the center. They are the martyrs. They are the righteous, innocent prophets whom God will deliver from unrighteous jailers. Barf.

2. In addition to the broader church history, I have family history and geography in common. My family settled into southern Utah and Nevada and fought hard to live off the land. They got screwed by the government (they were promised x amount of water to each farm which was never fully delivered) and they literally became dirt farmers. I've been to the old homestead and it's pretty sad. But instead of stomping their feet and screaming about what is owed them, my grandfather worked as a day laborer until he had enough money to support his parents while he went back to high school. He ended up being a fairly well-respected banker in Las Vegas. My point: I don't know, really. I guess I'm pissed that they think they are special.

3. Quotes from religious leaders, especially Ezra Taft Benson used to condone their illegal activities. Pres. Benson was heavily into republican politics before he became prophet in 1985. He did say some fairly controversial and right wing stuff which is out there and fair game, but he toned it way down once he became the Prophet (which probably doesn't mean very much to non-members, but it does to us.) His focused shifted from anti-communism rhetoric to very clear religious speaches. His big push was the Book of Mormon and his political statements aren't a big focus in church manuals. Anyway, I can't imagine Pres. Benson probably would be supportive of how his words are being used.

4. Their general vocabulary that they were acting with some ecclesiastical authority. One thing that everybody knows about the church, is that it is highly centralized. For some it a plus and for others it's a con, but that centralization means that wackos from Bunkerville can't just take church teachings and use them to justify anti-government behaviors. The church doesn't work that way. By setting themselves up as leaders directed by God, they are denying a pretty basic article of faith - that God directs he church through the current Prophet, Thomas S. Monson. If God wanted Mormons to take over federal buildings and violently resist lawful court orders, we wouldn't be hearing about it from a freaking Bundy.

5. The White Horse Prophesy. I don't know if that's been explicitly stated by the Bundy's as an inspiration, but in all my years of church attendance, I've never, ever heard it taught or referenced. It's been repudiate as an official "prophesy" by the church for almost a century and it's way, way, way fringe. Now, I live on the east coast and have deliberately removed myself from a lot of Utah "culture" (I lived in Utah only long enough to get a college degree and then I split.) So there may be some circles where it is more often passed around orally, but again, I like to get my Church directly from the source.

6. They stole words from one of my grandmother's favorite hymns and are touting it as inspiration. The hymn is called "Do What is Right" and one of the Bundy brothers quoted it in a letter. (Ryan? Maybe?) It pisses me off because the song is about personal integrity and enduring through hardship. Things that were important to my grandmother. She loved to sing it when we got discouraged. It was annoying when I was a kid, but it brings back sweet memories. And they are using is as some sort of battle song.

I think that's it, but more may come to mind. I'm happy to discuss and clarify if my words aren't clear (it's early here). To be clear, I'm not interested is defending the church generally, but I'm open to discussing the Bundy's and their Mormonism.
Clairez
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 11:08 am
Location: Indiana

Re: Bundy related gossip and discussion

#3750

Post by Clairez »

Dan1100 wrote:
maydijo wrote: :snippity:

Excommunication is a matter for local authorities. :snippity:

However, if they are convicted of a crime, and serve their sentence in Oregon, their membership records will travel with them. Stakes have geographic borders. There would be a Stake President whose borders would cover the Oregon jail where he was serving his sentence. :snippity:
Since it is federal court, they could be sent to a federal prison anywhere in the United States. Sometimes they are nice and let people serve close to home so their family can visit, but by no means is that always the case. Where they get convicted has very little to do with it.

Link to map of possible prisons for Bundy and Company. https://www.justice.gov/jmd/mps/manual/ ... _large.jpg
This is just a guess but I believe that if Amon, Ryan and Cliven Bundy are found guilty they will be sent to a CMU unit. Those units exist I believe only in Marion Ill and Terra Haute Indiana. The idea will be to limit communication with their followers and so prevent possible uprisings or terrorist acts on their behalf.
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