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Democratic National Committee

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Re: Democratic National Committee

#176

Post by RoadScholar »

Close-reading Ellison today on the Tee Vee machine I conclude he'd be a good pick. He has a crackerjack mind and great poise and clarity.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#177

Post by Orlylicious »

In that same POLITICO article... The rage and hate is unprecedented with these loser Trumpers and they will just go wild over this. One thing we're looking at is setting up some of the same micronews sites like they did, truthfeed, truepatriot, etc... they effectively used those to spread disinformation because it was "published." If we're going in this direction, we have to have those kinds of sites. I'm concerned to take on a big battle like this when there's a lot else to do, I still like the co-chair idea, but if the majority want to try it I'd support it 100%.
Ellison's Muslim faith has made him a target for conservative Republicans, even during his first run for office in 2006.

At that time, there were allegations that Ellison was tied to the Nation of Islam and its leader, Louis Farrakhan. Ellison said he'd never joined the group, although he had helped organize a Minnesota delegation to the 1995 Million Man March, where Farrakhan spoke. Ellison apologized for failing to "adequately scrutinize the positions" of Farrakhan and other Nation of Islam leaders. "They were and are anti-Semitic, and I should have come to that conclusion earlier than I did."

And after he was officially sworn in, Ellison used an English-translation of the Koran owned by Thomas Jefferson for his official photo, a moved that angered some Republicans.

But the Islamic State has also issued a death threat against Ellison, including him on a list of "politically active apostates."

“The fact that I’m on [ISIS'] bad side means I am fighting for things like justice, tolerance and a more inclusive world," Ellison said in an April 2016 statement.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#178

Post by esseff44 »

I still don't see why they can't have co-chairs. The job is too big for one person and Dean can hit the ground running for the fund raising side Keith doesn't think is important. Let Keith do the vision thing.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#179

Post by Addie »

I like Ellison as a co-chair with Dean. I'd also like to see where the state and local DSC honchos are falling in.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#180

Post by Orlylicious »

Agree with you, we have enough work for co-chairs for sure. President Obama is talking with the DNC tomorrow and I think Secretary Clinton is talking with House Ds, it'll get the ball rolling but the DNC vote won't be for a few months yet. Staffer friend said they might postpone the House leadership vote which is scheduled for later this week, not sure yet.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#181

Post by Addie »

Politico
Howard Dean on DNC chair: 'This is not something I have to do'

Former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean is running to take back his old position as chairman of the Democratic National Committee, but took care Monday morning to note that “this is not something I’m going to push people out of the way for.”

Dean was his party’s chairman from 2005-2009 and said he is the best man for the job specifically because he has guided the Democrats before out of a hole similar to the one they find themselves in now.

“When I started, when my team started, we didn't have the house, the senate or the presidency. When we left four years later with had the house, the senate and the presidency,” Dean told MSNBC’s “Morning Joe. “So, you know, I think I know how to do this. But, you know, this is not something -- I've already done this once. This is not something I have to do. This is not something I’m going to push people out of the way for.” ...

While refining a political message will be crucial if the Democratic Party is to escape the minority in both houses of Congress and mount a strong challenge for the White House in four years, Dean said the DNC chairman’s job is one that focuses more on mechanics and less on messaging, which should come from the party’s policy leaders in Congress. He said the party needs to do a better job of involving young people and minorities if it is to rebound from last week’s historic defeat.

“The house and senate leadership are going to have to deliver the economic message. The DNC chair can do that. I think that's important. But it's important for the policy leaders to do that. What the DNC is about is mechanics,” Dean said. “It is about being everywhere. It's about training people up. It's about having an adequate tech system which we no longer apparently have. And it's about enfranchising people in the states to make their own decisions about who runs instead of having the D-triple-C or the DSCC pick candidates who can fund their own campaigns and then can't win because they can't get the message across. That is the problem with the Democratic Party.”


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#182

Post by Addie »

Politico confirming Orlylicious.
Obama, Clinton will talk to Democrats on Monday

President Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton are planning calls with Democrats on Monday as the party struggles to come to terms with a devastating election defeat.

Obama will host a Monday afternoon call with the Democratic National Committee, according to a notice obtained by POLITICO. The post-election call comes amid ongoing infighting about what direction the party should take and who should be its next leader with Obama leaving the White House and Clinton's surprising defeat.

Clinton will participate in a separate call with House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and House Democrats on Monday. ...

House Democrats have scheduled their leadership elections for Thursday. While no one is expected to challenge Pelosi for the top spot, anger and frustration are rampant in the caucus, particularly among junior members, who want to see a shift in strategy and messaging going forward.
Orlylicious wrote:Agree with you, we have enough work for co-chairs for sure. President Obama is talking with the DNC tomorrow and I think Secretary Clinton is talking with House Ds, it'll get the ball rolling but the DNC vote won't be for a few months yet. Staffer friend said they might postpone the House leadership vote which is scheduled for later this week, not sure yet.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#183

Post by Addie »

Josh Marshall posted this to TPM.
On Ellison at the DNC

A TPM Reader who is a member of the Democratic National Committee chimes in on who leads next ...
I am a DNC Member from [REDACTED] and I will be voting on the next DNC Chair. I am responding to your recent post suggesting that Keith Ellison is a "done deal" as the next DNC Chair. I believe that this is a much more difficult choice than what you suggest.

While I supported Hillary Clinton in the primary, I was unhappy with the contemporaneous leadership of the DNC and agreed with some of the complaints many Democrats had about how Bernie Sanders was treated. I also believed that neither Debbie Wasserman Schultz or Tim Kaine (who preceded DWS as DNC Chair) had enough time to dedicate to the DNC -- they were Members of Congress, which is more than a full-time job.

In fact, when I ran for DNC, I earned the support of many Bernie supporters because I vowed to do what I can to ensure that our next DNC Chair did not have another full-time job. The DNC is too important to leave up to a part-timer, especially a sitting elected official who may have dozens of potential conflicts of interest.

I have spoken with a few other Clinton-supporting DNC Members around the country, and the general feeling is that the next Chair should not be a sitting elected official. Period. Full stop. ...


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#184

Post by Lani »

Anybody else planning to listen in on POTUS Obama's call? It begins at noon Hawaii time, 4 pm Eastern.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#185

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Re: Democratic National Committee

#186

Post by Orlylicious »

This is what I mean. They are out of their fu*king minds but this is how they will lie and obfuscate and jam this down. The Resurgent (Erickson's thing) uses this header photo for the story that's drawing on multiple sources already:


If You Think Bannon Is Bad, Look Who The Democrats Want To Run The DNC
By Steve Berman | November 14, 2016, 05:38pm | @stevengberman

Never content to be out-organized or not to be the most extreme party, Democrats are “scrambling to unite” behind a radical member of the Nation of Islam, a follower of Louis Farrakhan, Minnesota Rep. Keith Ellison.

Fox News reported Monday:
[Ellison said in 2007:] “9/11 is the juggernaut in American history and it allows… it’s almost like, you know, the Reichstag fire,” Ellison said, according to a Daily Telegraph report at the time. “After the Reichstag was burned, they blamed the Communists for it, and it put the leader of that country [Hitler] in a position where he could basically have authority to do whatever he wanted.”
Yeah Democrats, this is your guy. The same guy who used George Wallace as an example of a white racist Republican. Only the former Alabama governor was never a Republican; Wallace was a Democrat.

The same guy who cried anti-Muslim bigotry when blogger Scott Johnson published some disturbing history about him in the Star Tribune, that was conveniently left out of Ellison’s book.
In the book, Ellison rewrites his history to eliminate his involvement with Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam, dispatching his activities down the memory hole. Ellison does not simply clean up the picture. He presents himself as a (biting) critic of Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam, as though it were ever thus.

Ellison writes of Farrakhan, for example: “He could only wax eloquent while scapegoating other groups.” Although he must be drawing on his own experience, Ellison conceals the starkly autobiographical element in his observation: “In the NOI, if you’re not angry in opposition to some group of people (whites, Jews, so-called ‘sellout’ blacks), you don’t have religion.”
In a post on PowerlineBlog, Johnson wrote:
In his memoir Ellison recounts his conversion to Islam as a 19-year-old undergraduate at Detroit’s Wayne State University. By the time Ellison graduated from law school at the University of Minnesota, however, he was toeing the Nation of Islam line. When Ellison first ran for public office in Minneapolis in 1998, he was a self-identified member of the Nation of Islam going under the name Keith Ellison-Muhammad. See Keith Ellison for dummies.”

In 2000 Ellison was still talking up “Minister Farrakhan” at a National Lawyers Guild fundraiser for former Symbionese Liberation Army terrorist Kathleen Soliah/Sara Jane Olson in 2000. By 2002, however, when Ellison was first elected to the Minnesota legislature, and 2006, when he sought the DFL endorsement to succeed Rep. Martin Sabo in Congress, Ellison had abandoned the Nation of Islam and returned to the fold of Islam.

So far as I know, Ellison is the only convert to Islam for whom Islam was a way station to the Nation of Islam. How did that work? That’s one part of Ellison’s secret history that actually remains secret.
This is the guy the Democrats want to “coalesce behind.” If their goal was to freak out American Jews more than Stephen Bannon does, I think they’ve accomplished it.
http://theresurgent.com/if-you-think-ba ... n-the-dnc/

Obviously I strongly disagree with everything in this story but after being bludgeoned by Twitter and seeing the hate hasn't abated in the slightest (for heaven's sake, they won but they're still pissed off) we need to pick our battles carefully.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#187

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See, that's what my instinct said, but then I back-slid. I wanted to believe Ellison's qualities could prevail on their own. That he would be judged on the content of his character. I really did.

But the fact is, politics is optics. In context, "you didn't build that" was cognizable, but that doesn't matter. It could successfully be used as a bludgeon, and it was.

In context, when Hillary said "What difference does it make?" it was a perfectly decent statement. Doesn't matter. Bludgeon fodder. Political loss.

Sticking to principles, walking the walk of a universal respect for objective truth, is a good. But competent compassionate Democrats winning elections is also a good. And, woe be us, these competing goods are largely in tension today.

One could make a case for acknowledging the shallowness of many voters... and to some extent that is not even a value judgement; people have lives to live, and they may not have the time for deeper inquiry.

Perhaps we need to weigh the optics more as they will be, less as they should be. If more church-going, gun-assembling white male Democrats in prominent positions helps us win elections, they could then advance some of our goals like promoting diversity in the not-quite-so-high-profile positions, and move toward progress. Is that really so awful to suggest?

Selling out? Capitulating to our baser nature? May be, but it could also be seen as moving gradually in the right direction... or at the very least, surviving (politically) to fight again another day.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#188

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What they need is to beg Howard Dean to come back.

What they'll do is screw the pooch. Again


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#189

Post by esseff44 »

I was completely expecting this kind of use of Ellison's background to disqualify him in the eye of the public. We are in Trumpland now where up is down and down and up. The Vietnamese had a description of these kind of events. It's when Heaven and Earth change places. It keeps ringing in my mind. Heaven and Earth have changed places.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#190

Post by Lani »

esseff44 wrote:I was completely expecting this kind of use of Ellison's background to disqualify him in the eye of the public. We are in Trumpland now where up is down and down and up. The Vietnamese had a description of these kind of events. It's when Heaven and Earth change places. It keeps ringing in my mind. Heaven and Earth have changed places.
No matter who the DNC selects, the person will very quickly be accused of everything we can imagine, and probably somethings we can't. As a Black Muslim, Ellison is more easily attacked, but Dean would be treated viciously as well. Until there is a plan in place to counter the disinformation attacks, the narrative is controlled by the opposition. I haven't a clue how the DNC will tackle this problem. Hopefully, far smarter people than me are working on it NOW.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#191

Post by bob »

My hope is the party will take a two-prong strategy: the primary one that focuses on the map as it is in 2018 and 2020, and one that nurtures a party in anticipation of what the map will look like in 2022 (and beyond). States like Arizona, Georgia, and Texas are trending purple in the longer term. But it would be foolish to both count on them in the short term, or to ignore their long-term possibilities.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#192

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Oh my god!!! Erik Ericson's website has huge concerns about maybe putting a scary black guy with a past into an important Democratic Party job!! Maybe we should think about that and maybe get someone else because of the "optics," or think about picking our battles more, because we should be concerned about how this looks to angry white voters.

Fuck. That. Fuck it twice, and fuck it again. Seriously, what the fuckity-fucking-fuck, people?? I thought all of you were better than that. Look, this is WRONG on at least two major levels - even after we ignore the alt-reich concern trolling aspects. It's morally wrong, and it's strategically stupid.

Morally wrong. I'm Jesuit educated and a lawyer. I understand the need for flexibility in approaches, with the idea that we cannot advance on every front at all times, with the idea that sometimes you need to jettison things that are holding you back from the grander goal. But not discriminating on the basis of someone's color or religion is the grander goal. That is a core value, not something we can jettison. And it's exactly what this "controversy" is about, because any pick of a woman, or a minority, or a member of the LGBT community, is as likely to do that - we'll undoubtedly be told, by the ratfucking son of Erik, will do just that because [insert personally tailored excuse here].

Tactically Idiotic. This is the exact cringing craven response to a problem that the heterosexual Caucasian wing of the Democratic Party has gotten so good at - we lost! Run away! Find a safe space and work to get back on the good side of all the other heterosexual Caucasians! For fuck sake, how do you think that's going to make everyone else feel? Do you seriously think that will make marginalized populations somehow more inclined to vote for Democrats? Do you think that's going to help anyone who isn't in my demographic - straight, snow-white, middle-aged male - feel like the Democrats are likely to stand firm when the chips are down? Convince them that we really will support them?

Or do you think that the marginalized are safe votes that we can count on retaining even if we run away from them at a time of need? If you do, I'd suggest taking a long, hard look at the exit polls. Because here's reality: this election barely went the way that the angry white voters wanted, by the narrowest of margins, and one of the decisive factors in this was that it looks like Trump did slightly better than Romney with minority voters, and Clinton did significantly worse than Obama. Taking people for granted is never, ever a safe strategy.

Look, all that said I still prefer Dean to Ellison - Dean has a track record of success in the job and is available full time. I'm not saying that we should vote for Ellison if he's not the right person for the job. But the "optics" thing is alt-right concern trolling bullshit, and they're going to find ways to do it with every candidate for every elected official from county dogcatcher and up who isn't a white conservative. We need to get armed up for that, because it's coming.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#193

Post by RoadScholar »

A totally valid counter argument. More than half my brain agrees with you.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#194

Post by Mikedunford »

RoadScholar wrote:A totally valid counter argument. More than half my brain agrees with you.
I get the concerns, and I get the instinct. (I think I said above that it was my own immediate response.) We've been beaten badly, and it was a shocking surprise - literally the last time I felt like I have for the past week was right after 9/11. Our instinct is going to be to run and seek shelter. It's a valid instinct, particularly given our evolutionary past. But sometimes it's an instinct that can lead us astray, especially if someone's trying to herd us over a cliff.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#195

Post by RoadScholar »

On the other hand, a fact's a fact:

They have been, are, and will be painting Democrats as the Anti-White People Party.

If we don't defeat that narrative somehow, we are doomed.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#196

Post by Suranis »

You wont defeat it no matter who you stick on the head of the DNC. If its howard dean they will post every picture of him beside Obama and dig out the Dean Scream and play it every night for the next 8 years.

You defeat it by going out and talking to people and SHOWING that you are not against white people. Yes that requires manower and money. So be it. Humans respond better to human contact than any online bullshit.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#197

Post by Mikedunford »

RoadScholar wrote:On the other hand, a fact's a fact:

They have been, are, and will be painting Democrats as the Anti-White People Party.

If we don't defeat that narrative somehow, we are doomed.
It didn't doom us in 2008 or 2012, and it looks increasingly like it wouldn't have doomed us in 2016 if Clinton hadn't lost so much minority support.

And I'm not saying we shouldn't be doing more to win over/win back support from other communities, particularly in the Rust Belt. But it can't come at the cost of core values, because that will kill us just as dead.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#198

Post by RoadScholar »

Yes, but the smear that Democrats are anti-white needs to be countered not merely for political expedience, but also because it's a goddamn lie.

Another stinking right-wing lie.

In general, we need to get better at seizing the narrative.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#199

Post by Plutodog »

RoadScholar wrote:On the other hand, a fact's a fact:

They have been, are, and will be painting Democrats as the Anti-White People Party.

If we don't defeat that narrative somehow, we are doomed.
We start out by burning Eric Erickson to the ground (figuratively). And every other asshole who pulls this shit.


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Re: Democratic National Committee

#200

Post by Mikedunford »

RoadScholar wrote:Yes, but the smear that Democrats are anti-white needs to be countered not merely for political expedience, but also because it's a goddamn lie.

Another stinking right-wing lie.

In general, we need to get better at seizing the narrative.
Sidelining a perfectly qualified candidate because "optics" siezes the wrong narrative.

The narrative that creates is "say what you want about the alt-right, at least their bigotry is open, honest, and unapologetic."


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