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Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:59 am
by Notorial Dissent
I cannot imagine that an African official of any stripe would have used the term Ms in any context in 1986, it certainly wasn't all that common here as I recall, in fact was a point of contention in many places. I can't imagine she would have been referred to as anything but Mrs whoever.

Further, since he was an African official with an obviously African name writing to an an equally obviously African correspondent , I really doubt he would have used English.

I do know from personal experience, that the double name thing is a very Kansas thing, and would have been quite common for someone of her generation. I have cousins with some really hideous double names, and they went by them to their graves. There were a few people who didn't go along with it, but it would appear that Stanley Ann did, and it would have been a life long habit that she would have always gone by Stanley Ann regardless of what her surname was.

There are just a number of things that are off as far as this letter goes, and considering the source just makes it more questionable.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:07 am
by Slarti the White
Sterngard Friegen wrote:Was "Ms." in use in Kenya in 1986? Did Stanley D. Obama uses "Ms." or "Mrs." And when she was married to Barack Obama, did she use "Mrs. Obama"? In 1986 was she "Mrs. Soetoro"? (My British ex-wife was still called "Mrs. Friegen" by her in laws after our divorce.)

Since Smith never researches as well as a good forger should (he's not very smart), I suspect this forgery is facially deficient. Just like Smith's other forgeries.

He really should stick to selling his kidneys.
I'm actually curious (well, not curious enough to actually look into it, but curious enough to write this post) to see what he, Lucas has "learned" from the feedback he got regarding the POSFKBC. I'm guessing that he probably corrected some superficial errors in in his process, but failed to address more substantive issues because he couldn't understand them.

Too also, I call her "Dr. Dunham".

:towel:

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 5:58 am
by Clairez
Surely Obama Sr. was long since her ex-husband by 1986. Also wasn't Dr. Durham's research and work done mostly in Indonesia rather than Africa?

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:10 am
by Dr. Kenneth Noisewater
So now he gets the date format correct?

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:38 am
by Notorial Dissent
Two things that came to mind after my last post. When did Stanley Ann get her degree, since unless she was different than most of the academics I have known, and particularly being female and from that era, the Dr would have been tagged on anything professional she was doing, and that title would have been important in Africa as it would have been in Europe.

Also, maybe this is my misapprehension, but wouldn't an African official been more likely to have written in French, if they didn't write in their native language, at the time rather than English since it was more the lingua franca of the time?

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:54 am
by Sam the Centipede
Dr. Kenneth Noisewater wrote:So now he gets the date format correct?
He has the date format correct, he has British spelling for -ise/-ize verbs but the "Ms." title is wholly implausible; as Slarti says, a genuine letter would use "Dr." and the full name, or at least included the "Ann".

The inclusion of the bogus information about Dr. Dunham's family is clearly a complete fabrication because it is wholly irrelevant and inappropriate in this context. This is made even more obvious by the lack of any attempt to either (a) persuade the recipient of the letter that it would be A Good Thing to cooperate, or (b) an invocation of a more senior or political figure mandating cooperation.

I did a quick Google image search and I couldn't locate the original document that Smith have used as a source for his forgery. I suspect Smith has been through some paper archives and found a letter where, for example, a government official asks another to be nice to, say, the representative of an agricultural company or perhaps even another academic researcher.

Lucas Daniel Smith is lying duplicitous racist scum. The only interesting question whenever he presents anything is "why has this asshole fabricated this crap?"

I wonder if that other racist scum, Orly "Meeee!!!!!" Taitz will run with this? She will probably fling a few feces.

I suspect anybody examining this nonsense would find layers! So, unless Smith can produce a typewriter which will reproduce this letter with exactly one press of a button, I won't believe it! :-D /birther

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:33 am
by Gnarly Goat
Notorial Dissent wrote:Also, maybe this is my misapprehension, but wouldn't an African official been more likely to have written in French, if they didn't write in their native language, at the time rather than English since it was more the lingua franca of the time?
Zambia was a British protectorate and English is the official language so the use of English in a government document would be appropriate.

This may be the one detail he actually got right.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:39 am
by Family Liberty Patriot
Has he, Lucas Smiff, named a price for this artifact yet?

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:46 am
by Epectitus
There actually are a number of Zambian government documents online that, between them, serve as adequate models for the forgery. And there is enough variation between them that the format of the letterhead is passable. All of them however appear to be modern (i.e. 21st century) documents and the information on them (P.O. Box Numbers for example) are all the current ones. There are no circa 1986 examples I can find,

There also was a Dr. Warren associated with USAID in Zambia at the time. Smith calls him "Dr. M. Warren" because he apparently went by "Mike." But his actual name was Dennis Michael Warren so he would have been known as "Dr. D. Warren" not "Dr. M. Warren."

That, along with the certainly anachronistic (for Zambia) "Ms." and the fact that any reference at all to her husband and child was completely gratuitous are the top three tells for me at this point.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:49 am
by Epectitus
Family Liberty Patriot wrote:Has he, Lucas Smiff, named a price for this artifact yet?
I am confident that this was created entirely for Bruce Steadman's consumption. Steadman gives the first fawning comment on the blog, and given the expiration of shelf-life for Smith's deportation to Kenya scam, it is another bread crumb to Bruce for the purposes of keeping the taps open.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:52 am
by Epectitus
Slartibartfast wrote:Too also, I call her "Dr. Dunham".
She didn't get her doctorate until 1992.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:28 am
by RoadScholar
Let's not forget how this story starts:

"Known Forger Comes Up with New Document."

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:07 am
by Foggy
Image

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:10 am
by Epectitus
Oh! SO love that!

:thumbs:

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:11 am
by Family Liberty Patriot
Seems legit. And explains a lot.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:13 am
by RoadScholar
Obviously 100% authentic.

Surely nobody in the Birferverse is stupid enough to believe it is real!

Oh, wait... :roll:

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:37 am
by Gnarly Goat
I wonder how much Bruce would pay for that document?

I'm sure you could get Rharon to bite on that as well.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:46 am
by Flatpointhigh
RoadScholar wrote:Let's not forget how this story starts:

"Known Forger Comes Up with New Document."
That's gonna be the title of my first remix since 2013.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:14 am
by mimi
I'm pretty sure most know about Smith's background. But in case there are any noobs who don't know what a slimy guy he is...

Of all the birfoons, Lucas Smith is the nastiest.
In late 2002, a man from Cedar Rapids, Iowa, sent an e-mail to the family. The man, who called himself Lucas Smith, said he was 23 years old and had emigrated from Russia five years earlier. He had seen the Web site and, Smith said, he wanted to help.

The Wilsons stopped searching for a donor. Smith passed all of the medical, physical and psychological tests. They thought he was going to save their son's life.

Then, on May 3, 2003, Smith sent Jim Wilson Sr. an e-mail saying he wanted to be compensated for donating his kidney.

Wilson said they would pay his airfare, but because it was illegal to receive money for an organ donation, they wouldn't give him any other cash.

Five months after holding out a lifeline, Lucas Smith disappeared.
http://blog.syracuse.com/news/2008/01/o ... _0116.html

He is just an evil S.O.B.

Yeah, he has a long criminal history, but what he did to Jim Wilson is an act of a sociopath.

And then there was the time he threw hot grease on those kids at McDonalds. And all the thefts and forgeries and such.

His rap sheet is yards long. A lot of it is posted her at Fogbow, but there is probably a lot that is hidden cuz Smith has been a criminal his whole life. And most of the stuff he did as a juvenile is hidden.

Smith is the lowest of the birthers.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:19 am
by raicha
The National Commission was part of the Ministry of Agriculture by 1986 and the letterhead would not say "office of the President" but "Ministry of Agriculture".

Also, too, the subject matter of Stanley Ann's research as claimed in this letter is completely implausible because 1) Stanley Ann spent her working life in South Asia, with a stint in Pakistan, but most famously in Indonesia, 2) Her many published works regarding her studies dealt with microcredit and the development of micro/small businesses, especially for women.

She was not known for focusing on macro models of "organisational understanding" of agriculture in Africa or anywhere else. She was, in fact, an expert in rural industry, not agriculture.

But of course, Lucas Smith is a lying cretin.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:43 am
by realist
raicha wrote:The National Commission was part of the Ministry of Agriculture by 1986 and the letterhead would not say "office of the President" but "Ministry of Agriculture".

Also, too, the subject matter of Stanley Ann's research as claimed in this letter is completely implausible because 1) Stanley Ann spent her working life in South Asia, with a stint in Pakistan, but most famously in Indonesia, 2) Her many published works regarding her studies dealt with microcredit and the development of micro/small businesses, especially for women.

She was not known for focusing on macro models of "organisational understanding" of agriculture in Africa or anywhere else. She was, in fact, an expert in rural industry, not agriculture.

But of course, Lucas Smith is a lying cretin.
:yeah:

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:28 pm
by Slarti the White
Epectitus wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:Too also, I call her "Dr. Dunham".
She didn't get her doctorate until 1992.
I knew that, but I'll bet dollars to doughnuts he, Lucas didn't.
Edit: Because he, Lucas is, as mentioned above too also, a cretin. (Which is really praising him with faint damns)

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:36 pm
by Notorial Dissent
Slartibartfast wrote:
Edit: Because he, Lucas is, as mentioned above too also, a cretin. (Which is really praising him with faint damns)
You're being much too kind and generous.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:02 pm
by Fortinbras
He's from Crete? No wonder he has such trouble with English.

Re: eBAY KENYAN HOAXTER IS BAAAAACK - LOL

Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:09 pm
by raicha
Historically, "cretins" were from the Alps, not Crete.