Ireland

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Re: Ireland

#26

Post by RoadScholar » Mon May 08, 2017 11:36 pm

Suranis, I love you but I don't think you're going to be able to prove that paedophilia and covering it up are just as prevalent among teachers and the other groups you cite as in the Priesthood. There's too much data, although admittedly I'm only familiar with the situation in the States; I know next to nothing about what goes on in Ireland.

But if I'm right, so what? They also say adultery is disproportionate among doctors and cops. It's a demographic statistic, and as far as I can tell, it's accurate. What we don't know is the extent to which it's a matter of the man going into the profession or the profession going into the man.

The point is: it says nothing about the general character of the group. The majority of individual good upstanding Priests and faithful happily-married cops should in no way be suspected of suddenly going bad due to some common flaw. That's a non sequitur. The logic-challenged think that is what the stats imply, but it ain't so. I'm guessing that's what irks you so, the baseless notion that there's something deeply wrong with Catholics generally. I certainly don't think that.

The exact numbers, if we knew them, would put things in perspective. Let's say, hypothetically, that paedophilia was twice as prevalent among Priests as among Bus Drivers. As a guess let's say the numbers for Priests could be 8 in 1000 and among Bus Drivers it's 4 in 1000. Now "twice as many" seems different, no?

But people don't think logically a lot. I'm sure there are those (and I agree the media has a hand in this) who believe every other Priest is a perv. That's patently absurd, and it's that sort of crappy thinking that has led to false allegations that have tragically ruined careers, just as you related.


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Re: Ireland

#27

Post by Suranis » Wed May 10, 2017 3:32 am

"Suranis, I love you but I don't think you're going to be able to prove that paedophilia and covering it up are just as prevalent among teachers and the other groups you cite as in the Priesthood."

Number of Priests in the US - 414,313.

Number of teachers in the US - 3.1 million

That means that even if the rate of pederasts in priests was double or triple the rate among lay teachers, the number of pederasts in the Teaching profession must be vastly greater. As Slarti would say, that's cold hard maths. So, call me whenever you start hearing all the massive coverage that must be going on about sexual abuse among lay teachers. I'll be holding my breath, honest.

ANYWAY, just another case of the anti-clerical strain that runs through Irish society, there are Irish members of Parliament that are refusing to stand for a prayer at the beginning of a Parliament session, and doing it to tap into popular opinion. Like Trump they are just aiming for the votes of a very nasty side of Irish society that most people don't like thinking about.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics ... -1.3071324
Three Independent Ministers have broken ranks with the Government over the Dáil prayer.
Independent Minister for Children Katherine Zappone and Independent Alliance Ministers of State Finian McGrath and John Halligan voted in the Dáil on Thursday against a Dáil business committee proposal that TDs must stand for the reading of the prayer in Irish and English and remain standing for a subsequent 30 seconds of silent reflection.

The proposal was accepted, however, by a majority of 97 votes to 18, with 18 abstentions. The new rule says: “All members present shall stand while the prayer is being read, and when it is concluded, members shall remain standing for 30 seconds of silent reflection.”

The new provision will commence at the start of business next Tuesday.

The prayer, read before the start of business, usually by the Ceann Comhairle, states: “Direct we beseech Thee O Lord, our actions by Thy holy inspirations and carry them on by Thy gracious assistance; that every word and work of ours may always begin from Thee and by Thee be happily ended. Through Christ Our Lord, Amen.”

Ms Zappone, Mr McGrath and Mr Halligan had also earlier voted against the Government and in favour of a Sinn Féin proposal to replace the prayer with 60 seconds of silent reflection. That was rejected by 94 votes to 41.
http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/six- ... 88904.html
Six TDs have broken Dáil rules by refusing to stand during the prayer, but have escaped any disciplinary action.
The TDs from Solidarity, People Before Profit and Independents4Change refused to stand during today's prayer.

The two TDs from Solidarity held up signs saying 'Separate Church and State' throughout a moment of silence afterwards.

The TDs say they will continue to break the new rule, and People Before Profit's Brid Smith says public opinion is on their side.

"We are making a point of saying no way we won't pray, and yeah I know it sounds funny but it's true - there's no way, we won't pray.

"We think that most people will support us in this it's a very logical and very non-sectarial position to take and we should be allowed to sit," she said.
Pictures at the link.


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Re: Ireland

#28

Post by Suranis » Wed May 10, 2017 5:25 am

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/late ... 88721.html
Update - 4.45pm: It has been confirmed that planning is underway for a referendum to remove the constitutional ban on blasphemy.

Earlier: A Cabinet Minister has said the law on blasphemy is "silly, embarrassing" and "needs to be changed".
Simon Harris was responding to confirmation that Gardaí have launched a criminal investigation into comments made by the broadcaster and author Stephen Fry.

It comes after the former Justice Minister who brought in Ireland's blasphemy law, Dermot Ahern, has spoken about why he did not put it to a referendum.

Mr Ahern was in office when the 2009 Defamation Act was completed.
This morning, the former Justice Minister said the law was deliberately designed to be nearly impossible to enforce.
Gosh, a high profile case that came from nowhere gets splashed all over the media, that case is quashed becasue no-one actually cares, and suddenly people are saying that a referendum is being planned to remove a part of the constitution due to this high profile case which is really serious despite no-one caring about it or something.. All inside, what, 4 days.

Seems legit.

And people wonder why I follow American politics.


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Re: Ireland

#29

Post by RTH10260 » Wed May 10, 2017 7:07 am

Suranis wrote:http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/late ... 88721.html
Update - 4.45pm: It has been confirmed that planning is underway for a referendum to remove the constitutional ban on blasphemy.

Earlier: A Cabinet Minister has said the law on blasphemy is "silly, embarrassing" and "needs to be changed".
Simon Harris was responding to confirmation that Gardaí have launched a criminal investigation into comments made by the broadcaster and author Stephen Fry.

It comes after the former Justice Minister who brought in Ireland's blasphemy law, Dermot Ahern, has spoken about why he did not put it to a referendum.

Mr Ahern was in office when the 2009 Defamation Act was completed.
This morning, the former Justice Minister said the law was deliberately designed to be nearly impossible to enforce.
Gosh, a high profile case that came from nowhere gets splashed all over the media, that case is quashed becasue no-one actually cares, and suddenly people are saying that a referendum is being planned to remove a part of the constitution due to this high profile case which is really serious despite no-one caring about it or something.. All inside, what, 4 days.

Seems legit.

And people wonder why I follow American politics.
Hilarious, the reason I posted the article about the blasphemy case was cause I thought it so very outdated in our western world. Seems just that some internet light had to be pointed on that law to make it shrink away :lol:



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Re: Ireland

#30

Post by Suranis » Wed May 10, 2017 7:54 am

Or, SOME PEOPLE wanted to speed up a referendum, and invented the whole thing to "force the issue", along with the usual "religious people r dumb." And in fact the only people screaming the about this are Atheist Ireland, and no-one else cared about the Stephen fry segment, which happened 2 years ago.

Seriously, do think that some random person walked into a Police station on his own bat, complaining about this interview with no political agenda at all? And suddenly has lead to this massive shift in 4 whole days? (the original story appeared on the 6th of May. 4 days ago)

Also, sorry to shock you out of the illusion of the Irish government scrabbling due to internet pressure, but the wiki page shows that this referendum has actually been in the pipelines for at least a year. The Wiki page also mentions Atheist Ireland over and over again. I was shocked too.

It's interesting because the actual issue comes from the roots of Irish law coming from English common law, the same as the US. You might want to check out whether you have a similar blasphemy statute, for the same reason.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blasphemy ... of_Ireland
In the Republic of Ireland, blasphemy is required to be prohibited by Article 40.6.1.i. of the 1937 Constitution. The common law offence of blasphemous libel, applicable only to Christianity and last prosecuted in 1855,[1][n 1] was ruled in 1999 to be incompatible with the Constitution's guarantee of religious equality. The deficit was filled in 2009 by a new offence of "publication or utterance of blasphemous matter", against any religion. The continued existence of a blasphemy offence is controversial, with proponents of freedom of speech and freedom of religion arguing it should be removed.[4] The government formed in 2016 has committed to holding a referendum on abolishing the constitutional offence.[5]

...

Defamation Act 2009
Edit: The Law Reform Commission's 1991 Report opined that "there is no place for the offence of blasphemous libel in a society which respects freedom of speech".[47] It said the Prohibition of Incitement to Hatred Act 1989 provided an adequate protection for outrage against religious belief.[47] However, since banning blasphemy is mandated by the Constitution, abolishing the offence would require a referendum. A referendum solely for that purpose "would rightly be seen as a time wasting and expensive exercise".[48] The Commission's report, therefore, outlined criteria for a statutory definition of blasphemy which could serve until such time as Article 40.6.1.i might be changed as part of a broader Constitutional amendment.[49] The 1996 report of the Oireachtas Constitution Review Group agreed that "The retention of the present constitutional offence of blasphemy is not appropriate."[50]

The Defamation Act 2009 (introduced as the Defamation Bill 2006)[51] implemented many of the recommendations of the Commission's 1991 report. The bill as introduced omitted reference to blasphemy, pending a review by the Oireachtas Joint Committee on the Constitution. In March 2008, Brian Lenihan, then Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, said:[11]
In England and Wales blasphemy traditionally only consisted in the scandalising of the established church. It is probably the case in Ireland, with the enactment of the Article 44 provision in 1937, that blasphemy was extended to cover all of the denominations recognised in the Constitution and that in 1972 it passed into a stage where it extended itself to all theistic religions, since all theistic religions are honoured by the Constitution, although Christianity is uniquely invoked in the preamble.
The Joint Committee on the Constitution's report on Article 40.6.1.i. was published in July 2008. The Committee had discussed the case of comedian Tommy Tiernan, whose stand-up routine on The Late Late Show parodied the Gospels, offending many viewers.[52] The Bar Council of Ireland made a presentation to the Committee, pointing out that blasphemy and treason were the only crimes specifically mentioned in the Constitution.[53] Neville Cox stated:[53]
When the English Parliament originally enacted blasphemy laws, it was with a view to appeasing an angry God who was irritated by despicable literature and who was causing plagues and fires to occur in London. That was the historical reason for the law. The Law Commission in England suggested that there were two types of situation where what had previously been characterised as blasphemous material might generate a public interest in its prohibition. The first is where there is incitement to hatred and the second is where there is simply an excessive offence to religious sensibilities. The term "blasphemy" does not relate to either of these. It is, therefore, a misdescription of a changed law.
The Oireachtas Committee's report concluded:[12]
The reference itself has effectively been rendered a "dead letter" by virtue of the decision of the Supreme Court in Corway. Furthermore, the Committee is of the view that in a modern Constitution, blasphemy is not a phenomenon against which there should be an express constitutional prohibition.
On 20 May 2009 at the Bill's committee stage, section 36, dealing with blasphemy was introduced by Minister for Justice Dermot Ahern as an amendment.[54] Section 36 defines a new indictable offence of "Publication or utterance of blasphemous matter",[55] which carries a maximum fine of €25,000.[55] The offence consists of uttering material "grossly abusive or insulting in relation to matters held sacred by any religion", when the intent and result is "outrage among a substantial number of the adherents of that religion".[55] A defence is permitted for work of "genuine literary, artistic, political, scientific, or academic value".[55] "Religion" excludes profit-driven organisations or those using "oppressive psychological manipulation".[55] Upon conviction under section 36, a court warrant can authorise the Garda Síochána (police) to enter premises to search for and seize any copies of the blasphemous material.[56] Only the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP) can instigate proceedings, as distinct from private prosecutions like Corway. [57] Ahern said:[58]
I am ... puzzled as to the hysterical and incorrect reaction whipped up by some media reporters and commentators on this point. ... I as the responsible Minister, and we as legislators, do not have the luxury of pursuing a "do nothing" approach while we wait for an opportune moment to move a constitutional amendment
Mary McAleese, the President of Ireland, convened the Council of State to discuss whether the Bill should be referred to the Supreme Court to test its constitutionality; she decided not to do so.[59] The bill became law when McAleese signed it on 23 July 2009,[51] and came into force on 1 January 2010.[60]

Implementation
Edit:
As of 9 May 2017 no prosecution has ever been brought under the 2009 act.[57]

The advocacy group Atheist Ireland responded to the enactment by announcing the formation of the "Church of Dermotology" (named after Dermot Ahern).[61] On the date on which the law came into effect, it published a series of potentially blasphemous quotations on its website and vowed to challenge any resulting legal action.[62]

...

After the election on 26 February 2016, protracted negotiations led to a Fine Gael–independent government on 7 May with confidence and supply support from Fianna Fáil.[92] The government programme published on 11 May includes a commitment to holding a referendum on blasphemy.[5] After the May 2017 story about Stephen Fry, a Department of Justice spokesperson said that it had undertaken "preliminary consultations and preparatory work" on the amendment, with future scheduling to be decided by the government.[93] Simon Harris, the Minister for Health, said the existing law was "silly, a little embarrassing and needs to be changed".[93] In the Dáil Gerry Adams asked Enda Kenny whether a referendum would be held in 2017; Kenny replied "There are quite a number of referenda backed up, and they take time".[57]


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Re: Ireland

#31

Post by TollandRCR » Wed May 10, 2017 1:38 pm

Connecticut seems to be enforcing its blasphemy statute as an issue of zoning law. http://www.ctlawtribune.com/id=90000537 ... curindex=0


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Re: Ireland

#32

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 10:15 am

So Enda Kenny, Irish PM, has resigned, and the race is on to fill the post. I think he did a reasonably good job all things considered, with minor wrinkles like closing the Irish Embassy to the Vatican because the Church controls everything in Ireland. :bored: He did do things like apologizing for the states role in the abuse scandals which I give him credit for. He did recently cave to the idiocracy who were OUTRAGED that the Sisters of Charity would have partial ownership and a seat on the board of the New children's hospital being build. The fact that CATHOLIC NUNS would have anything to so with health care was a scandal that could not be allowed, because the Catholics secretly control everything in Ireland.

To be fair there is also controversy over the fact that it is going to cost too much to build (because this is corrupt Ireland and everything needs to have 200 pairs of hands in it scooping out Cash and bribes.) But at the mention of Nuns all talk of all that shit vanished in the name of a good priest beating session.

Sorry, am I giving the impression that I'm still a bit cheesed off at something someone said at on the previous page?

Anyway, the 2 main contenders are; Leo Varadkar, the guy that deflected the issue of his total mismanagement of the Health service during his time as Health Minister, by announcing that he was Gay, thereby forcing everyone in the media to suddenly start saying nice things about him. I'm not exaggerating. There was a media storm at revelations of his mismanagement, including universal calls for his resignation, and then he announced he was Gay, and within a day it was all forgotten about as the media fell over itself to talk about his "courage." And Simon Coveney, who... um... well he has had to have done something memorable bar be ambitious and throw himself in front of cameras a lot...

So yeah, not exactly enthused by either of them. Coveney at least seems the more competent of the 2, but no one will be able to say boo about Varadkar, unless the "Gay out of controversy!" card is something you can only play once. We shall see.

Anyway, another interesting thing about Irish Democracy at the moment. Right now in the Dail (parliament) there are the biggest Representation of Trotskyites that have been in any Western Democracy, ever. There are 9 Trot TDs; 3 from People Before Profit, 3 from Anti Austerity Alliance, 2 from Independents for Change, and 1 from the Workers and Unemployed Action Group. That fact that the 9 are split between 4 different groups should tell you everything you need to know about Trotskyism, and indeed the Far left in Ireland. Not that attempts haven't been made to bring them together, but there is a further deep rivalry between the Socialist Workers party (which controls PBP,) and the Socialist Party (which controls the AAA,) which means one or other keep scuppering things, as well as the 4 way fighting between the various groups themselves.

That said the far left in general's success is indication that people are seriously fed up with the "Main Parties," and indicates a real level of anger out there.


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Re: Ireland

#33

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 10:41 am

Since I'm in the mood for typing, I guess I should talk about another couple of things. There is one man who controls 70% of the media in Ireland, and that mans name is Denis O'Brien. He made his money the usual way in Ireland - by bribing a politician. His company Esat Digiphone was marked third in the running for Ireland's lucrative second Mobile phone license, when the then Minister in charge of things, Micheal Lowery, awarded his company the license. This caused a massive row and a tribunal eventually ruled that O'Brien had bribed the minister to hand his company the license, but it didn't matter, because it swelled his fortune massively, and he used it to begin to systematically buy up every media company he could. He is also VERY happy to take you to court for the slightest mention of him in a bad light, and the resulting media bankruptcies have swelled his control further as he bought them up.

Lowry was thrown out of the Fine Gael party over it, but, because the Irish Electorate are idiots who love the corrupt "cute hoors", he is still a TD and tops the Poll in Tipperary every election, and his hands are constantly well crossed with Silver to this day.

To show the level of O'Briens control, and the media timidity, last year a TD invoked Dail Privilege from prosecution, and made a speech talking about O'Brien and his various unethical moves. The National Broadcaster RTE, who are strong, sleek, and muscled with courage when taking on the Mighty Catholic Church, literally announced on the news that they were forbidden to publish or broadcast that speech because of "constitutional issues," and spent 10 minutes talking about it. Of course there was no constitutional problem, and at least one magazine proved it by publishing the entire text of her speech 3 days later with zero problems. RTE had completely made it up to avoid the wrath of O'Brien. And allegedly not much goes on air from O'Briens companies without his say so.

Not bad for a guy who officially lives in a small flat in the Camen Islands. Ireland is too unimportant a place to actually pay tax in don'tyaknow.


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Re: Ireland

#34

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 10:52 am

On the subject of Irish people being idiots, you might wonder do we have the equivalent of Trump here. Well, yes we do, its a man by the name of Danny Healy Ray, who with his Brother Michael has topped the poll in Kerry.



Does that guy look like a prat? Well, yes he is. I CBA to look up his record, but he is anti Global warming, pro fracking, and just yesterday he said that eating a big meal was the same as drinking before driving, so the Drinking laws should be abolished dontchaknow. That's fairly typical of his fucking dumnass statements, and the public love him for it, thinking its all harmless fun and shourleee he does not mean any of it. And the Media lurves it as his dumnassness gets a lot of clicks.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/po ... 25513.html

His brother is more sophisticated in his image molding. That cap is part of his image, and he puts himself out as a poor farmer type. with his socks up against the fireside of an evening. He is just as much of a gobshite as his brother though.

Image


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Re: Ireland

#35

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 11:32 am

Just to finish up I'll just mention one thing. When the Goverment wanted to pass the Bank Guarantee - which made Irelands Financial problems a lot worse - they needed 2 more votes. Micheal Lowry gave his vote for the promise of the granting of a gambling license for a Casino in Tipperary. Danny Healey Rays Father gave his vote for the promise of a road By-pass in Kerry. Heres a picture of the redoubtable Jackie Heally Ray by the way. He was somewhat Trump like, and to be fair mostly wore a peaked cap to hide his baldness.



Image

MIchael Lowry;

Image

Denis O'Brien

Image

Simon Coveney

Image

Leo Varadkar

Image


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Re: Ireland

#36

Post by Addie » Thu May 18, 2017 11:38 am

Thanks, Suranis. Interesting read.


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Re: Ireland

#37

Post by TollandRCR » Thu May 18, 2017 1:00 pm

Suranis, as you know the U.S. Dept. of State has issued a travel warning for Europe. Does this reasonably apply to Ireland? I would love to visit once more one of the most beautiful and most friendly countries I know.


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Re: Ireland

#38

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 1:42 pm

Honestly, you should be fine. I'm cynical about the troubles in the North, but really the only trouble nowadays are gangs shooting their own side in the north to maintain control of their areas in Belfast. Stay out of Belfast and you wont see any trouble at all. Hell you probably wont see any in Belfast itself. Neither side has anything against Americans.

Dublin has pretty much turned into New York in terms of gang culture, and its an expensive city to stay in as well. But it should be perfectly fine as long as you stay in the more tourist areas of it. Everywhere else you are more in danger of stubbing your toe on something.


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Re: Ireland

#39

Post by RoadScholar » Thu May 18, 2017 2:20 pm

Due to living in Baltimore, my Urban Trouble Radar is finely tuned. During my trip this spring to Dublin and the surrounding areas the needle never budged. I felt totally safe.

As a history, literature, and revolution wonk I was in hog heaven.


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Re: Ireland

#40

Post by Suranis » Thu May 18, 2017 2:30 pm

Yeah I haven't lived in Dublin in 12 years. Back then it was pretty rank, and its probably improved since then.


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Re: Ireland

#41

Post by Maybenaut » Thu May 18, 2017 3:21 pm

Suranis wrote:Honestly, you should be fine. I'm cynical about the troubles in the North, but really the only trouble nowadays are gangs shooting their own side in the north to maintain control of their areas in Belfast. Stay out of Belfast and you wont see any trouble at all. Hell you probably wont see any in Belfast itself. Neither side has anything against Americans.

Dublin has pretty much turned into New York in terms of gang culture, and its an expensive city to stay in as well. But it should be perfectly fine as long as you stay in the more tourist areas of it. Everywhere else you are more in danger of stubbing your toe on something.
Maybe it is because that is where my people are buried, but I enjoyed western Ireland much more than Dublin (which to me was just another big city). I'm glad I went to Dublin, but next time I go to Ireland I'll likely fly to Shannon and stay in the west. It was interesting knocking around Killarney and seeing the faces of my family in the locals (all of my grandparents were from there).



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Re: Ireland

#42

Post by RoadScholar » Thu May 18, 2017 4:09 pm

Suranis wrote:Yeah I haven't lived in Dublin in 12 years. Back then it was pretty rank, and its probably improved since then.
Rank, yes, still. Dangerous, no.


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Re: Ireland

#43

Post by magdalen77 » Tue May 23, 2017 3:57 pm

When I go to Eire I'll probably hang out in the West. Most of my ancestors were from County Mayo (or Galway or Roscommon due to shifting borders). I still think they should give me Irish citizenship since I'm related to half of County Mayo. Granted the relationship is 4 or so generations back, but let's not get picky.



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Re: Ireland

#44

Post by RoadScholar » Tue May 23, 2017 4:07 pm

Our progenitor, Matthew Lyon, hailed from Wicklow. His father, in today's terms, would be approximately an "anti-government hillbilly." He was hung by the King's men (whether as a revolutionary or just a criminal isn't clear), which occasioned Matthew's emigration to America in 1764. So that plus wanting very badly to see the ancient sites in the Brú na Bóinne meant my first trip had to be to the East.

But I must see the West next. The scenery, the music, the traditions, the Gaeltacht so I can hear Irish spoken... gotta do it.


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Re: Ireland

#45

Post by TollandRCR » Tue May 23, 2017 6:24 pm

But Dublin has that Library!


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Re: Ireland

#46

Post by stoppingby » Wed May 24, 2017 5:24 pm

Suranis wrote:Yeah I haven't lived in Dublin in 12 years. Back then it was pretty rank, and its probably improved since then.
Can I ask what you mean by rank? I did a month-long study program at Trinity College in the 1990s, and thought it was lovely. However, I mainly hung out in that area. Are you saying there are other areas that are slum-like?

edited to add: and thanks for posting the information on Irish politics. I'm always fascinated by the insider view of other countries' politics.



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Re: Ireland

#47

Post by Dan1100 » Wed May 24, 2017 5:58 pm

stoppingby wrote:
Suranis wrote:Yeah I haven't lived in Dublin in 12 years. Back then it was pretty rank, and its probably improved since then.
Can I ask what you mean by rank? I did a month-long study program at Trinity College in the 1990s, and thought it was lovely. However, I mainly hung out in that area. Are you saying there are other areas that are slum-like?

edited to add: and thanks for posting the information on Irish politics. I'm always fascinated by the insider view of other countries' politics.
About 8 years ago I walked through what locals later told me was the worst part of Dublin. It was 7 am on a Monday, but nothing said "slum" or "dangerous" to me. The only activity seemed to be working people getting on to buses and going to work. However, being from St. Louis, I have pretty high (or I guess low) standard as to what I'd call a slum.


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Re: Ireland

#48

Post by RoadScholar » Wed May 24, 2017 6:03 pm

I was taking "rank" in the sense of "funky," not dangerous or slum-like. My town is pretty funky too. A lot of cities are, especially those with lots of taverns and restaurants, near bodies of water.

I loved Dublin. I felt at home there.


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Suranis
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Re: Ireland

#49

Post by Suranis » Wed May 24, 2017 6:55 pm

Dublins a harbour city originally, and I leaved near the docks. You could smell things pretty well in the morning, and both places I lived in were damp as hell.


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Suranis
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Re: Ireland

#50

Post by Suranis » Fri Jun 02, 2017 3:11 pm

Mr "Hey, did you know if you vote fer me you will be the first party to have a GAY as leader of the country?" won with 60% of the Electoral College vote.

I hope he does a good job. But based on his screwing up the health service, and other things he was put in charge of, I'm not going to be surprised otherwise. And its not like I liked the other guy either.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/resu ... 92095.html


"I think its pretty troubling when a backyard decoration comes out swinging harder against Nazis than the President of the United States." - Stephen Colbert

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