Hijack this thread

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ZekeB
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22051

Post by ZekeB » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:30 pm

I zoomed in on the picture and I wasn't especially impressed. You fogbowettes may feel otherwise. To each their on as far as how someone dresses. :)


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Orlylicious
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22052

Post by Orlylicious » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:45 pm

This was something else. My Mom is 77 and in Orange County and the stupid cable company can't ever get it together. Apparently, she was so frustrated that on the phone with them she said if you people don't fix this I'll hang myself. Well a week later two cops showed up to see if she was OK! She figures that had to be the call, she told them she was just kidding but dang, look out what you say to those people. :lol:


From Michael Moore: RESISTANCE CALENDAR! A one-stop site for all anti-Trump actions EVERY DAY nationwide: http://resistancecalendar.org

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Re: Hijack this thread

#22053

Post by Foggy » Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:26 am

Umm ... there are Orange Counties in at least 4 states that I know of ... :confused:


If dogs run free, why not we?

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RoadScholar
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22054

Post by RoadScholar » Wed Nov 15, 2017 6:23 am

“Fake news” is fake news.

“Hoax” is the real hoax.


Carry on.


The bitterest truth is healthier than the sweetest lie.

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p0rtia
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22055

Post by p0rtia » Wed Nov 15, 2017 6:30 am

DejaMoo wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:28 am
TollandRCR wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:56 am
Read a very powerful article in the current Atlantic by Caitlin Flanagan. In this period when powerful men are losing their jobs for sexual assaults, what does Bill Clinton owe the nation?
Nothing. He has been exposed and punished already for his (eventually) admitted dalliance with Lewinsky; his other accusers had significant credibility issues. Not only Bill himself paid the price, but his wife and daughter are paying to this very day, because the right wing conspiracy machine will simply not let go of their Clinton fixation. ETA: And Bill has to live with that on his conscience. He not only smeared the nation's politics, he also caused his wife and daughter to suffer immensely. They couldn't even deal with the hurt privately, but in the relentless glare of the media. Worst of all, it will never go away. It's been hurled at them for the past two decades and will follow them into their graves. Good job, Bill.
I believe them. I think he harassed, inappropriately touched and raped women. Just sayin'.


No matter where you go, there you are! :towel:

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Orlylicious
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22056

Post by Orlylicious » Wed Nov 15, 2017 6:31 am

Sorry, Orange County California... And yes, we've specifically warned her about a certain nearby Dentist/Lawyer :lol:


From Michael Moore: RESISTANCE CALENDAR! A one-stop site for all anti-Trump actions EVERY DAY nationwide: http://resistancecalendar.org

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Re: Hijack this thread

#22057

Post by AndyinPA » Wed Nov 15, 2017 10:50 am

Weird.

https://www.alternet.org/activism/activ ... resistance
The resistance will have a juice bar and cost $200-$300 a night.

From the first anti-Trump protests erupting the day after the 2016 election, the bottom-feeders of America contemplated how to make activism lucrative. Some even offered diamond-encrusted safety pins. Now, those capitalizing on the political moment have found their next opportunity for profit on the backs of protest: a hotel.

Washington, D.C.'s Eaton Workshop is, according to founder Kathryn Lo (daughter of Hong Kong hospitality billionaire Ka Shui Lo), “The manifestation of me ‘following my bliss,'" as she explained to the Washingtonian, "so others can follow theirs.” As Bloomberg reports, it's the "world’s first politically motivated hotel, the flagship for a global brand that’s built around social activism and community engagement."



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22058

Post by Sunrise » Wed Nov 15, 2017 7:49 pm

We've probably all been to funerals where the attendees laughed at a humorous anecdote told during a eulogy. I was at a funeral today where most of the mourners (and especially the immediate family) had to stifle laughter during a very solemn moment. It was a military funeral for a staunch, lifelong Democrat who despised 45. When the folded flag was handed to the widow the presenting officer said, "On behalf of the president of the United States............" We all had the same reaction, that the deceased was turning over in his coffin which was directly in front of us. That, or at least rolling his eyes. :roll:



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22059

Post by P.K. » Wed Nov 15, 2017 10:54 pm

Please tell me I'm not the only one on this board who loves Hamilton - An American Musical. Tomorrow night I have the privilege of seeing it for the third time in its Los Angeles run. When the tickets went on sale in April I bought two single tickets to two different performances. Mr. K had made it clear that he was not interested, and it's hard enough getting him out of the house for something he really loves, so buying two single ticket for myself made the most sense. When the show opened in August, I was impatient and didn't want to wait until my late October first ticket, so I entered the ticket lottery almost every day, and miraculously won in mid-September - I asked a musical-theatre loving friend to be my date, and we had front row seats for ten bucks each! I had a nosebleed seat for my first purchased performance three weeks ago, and I have a back-of-the-orchestra seat tomorrow night. I know that among your average Hamilton fan I am the luckiest girl in the world to get to see it three times, but I will keep trying the lottery, and I will be super sad when it leaves Los Angeles.


IANALBIPOOTV - I am not a lawyer, but I've played one on TV. In fact, IANA (fill in the blank) but chances are I've played on on TV.

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Re: Hijack this thread

#22060

Post by AndyinPA » Wed Nov 15, 2017 11:45 pm

:clap:

:dance:



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22061

Post by Fortinbras » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:07 pm

So many prominent men are being accused of iinappropriate conduct towards women, that we might assume that the guilt for such stuff is practically universal among everyone with a Y chromosome (altho, of course, the severity or magnitude of the offense may differ individually). I suggest that ALL men show their contrition in some way.

I suggest every man wear one of the knitted 'pussy caps' such as were worn by women in the Women's March on Jan. 21st. Instead of the red or pink that was used in the women's caps, the men's caps should be a yellowish-orange (a hue I picked entirely at random).

Is there anyone here, male or female, who could make and sell us such caps??



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22062

Post by maydijo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:26 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:07 pm
So many prominent men are being accused of iinappropriate conduct towards women, that we might assume that the guilt for such stuff is practically universal among everyone with a Y chromosome (altho, of course, the severity or magnitude of the offense may differ individually). I suggest that ALL men show their contrition in some way.

I suggest every man wear one of the knitted 'pussy caps' such as were worn by women in the Women's March on Jan. 21st. Instead of the red or pink that was used in the women's caps, the men's caps should be a yellowish-orange (a hue I picked entirely at random).

Is there anyone here, male or female, who could make and sell us such caps??
I disagree with this premise. Most men aren't like this, and I don't think people who haven't done something should have to apologise for it.

I listened to an interview with the novelist Peter Carey yesterday. He made the point that Australia (and the US too) was founded through the genocide of Indigenous people, but said that we shouldn't feel guilty about that, because we didn't don't. Instead, he said, we had a responsibility to make amends. I would argue this is what men need to do too. Don't feel guilty if you haven't done it. Don't show contrition for sins which are not your own. Instead, take responsibility for your actions, and for those of the men in your circle of influence - your sons, brothers, friends, colleagues, etc. - and let it be known that you find sexual harassment and assault to be morally reprehensible, that you will not tolerate it, and that you hope they will do likewise. Then, if they don't, be brave enough to call them on it.



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22063

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:34 pm

Don't feel guilty if you haven't done it. Don't show contrition for sins which are not your own. Instead, take responsibility for your actions, and for those of the men in your circle of influence - your sons, brothers, friends, colleagues, etc. - and let it be known that you find sexual harassment and assault to be morally reprehensible, that you will not tolerate it, and that you hope they will do likewise. Then, if they don't, be brave enough to call them on it.
:like:



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22064

Post by Slartibartfast » Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:13 pm

maydijo wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:26 pm
Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:07 pm
So many prominent men are being accused of iinappropriate conduct towards women, that we might assume that the guilt for such stuff is practically universal among everyone with a Y chromosome (altho, of course, the severity or magnitude of the offense may differ individually). I suggest that ALL men show their contrition in some way.

I suggest every man wear one of the knitted 'pussy caps' such as were worn by women in the Women's March on Jan. 21st. Instead of the red or pink that was used in the women's caps, the men's caps should be a yellowish-orange (a hue I picked entirely at random).

Is there anyone here, male or female, who could make and sell us such caps??
I disagree with this premise. Most men aren't like this, and I don't think people who haven't done something should have to apologise for it.

I listened to an interview with the novelist Peter Carey yesterday. He made the point that Australia (and the US too) was founded through the genocide of Indigenous people, but said that we shouldn't feel guilty about that, because we didn't don't. Instead, he said, we had a responsibility to make amends. I would argue this is what men need to do too. Don't feel guilty if you haven't done it. Don't show contrition for sins which are not your own. Instead, take responsibility for your actions, and for those of the men in your circle of influence - your sons, brothers, friends, colleagues, etc. - and let it be known that you find sexual harassment and assault to be morally reprehensible, that you will not tolerate it, and that you hope they will do likewise. Then, if they don't, be brave enough to call them on it.
I think Forti had the right instinct (to acknowledge that harassment is endemic in our society), but maydijo's is a much more appropriate (and effective) way to do something positive. You cannot be complicit in other's behavior if you speak out against it.


"Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat."
---Sun Tzu (quoting Thomas Jefferson)
nam-myoho-renge-kyo---Thomas Jefferson (quoting Slartibartfast)

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Re: Hijack this thread

#22065

Post by DejaMoo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:23 pm

Fortinbras wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:07 pm
So many prominent men are being accused of iinappropriate conduct towards women, that we might assume that the guilt for such stuff is practically universal among everyone with a Y chromosome.
It's not a male thing. It's a human thing. Being human, we all can potentially be bad people who sometimes do good things, or good people who sometimes do bad things. And that most definitely includes females.

It's odd...I was thinking about this last night, even before learning the news about Franken. The gist of what I was thinking was that this is an opportunity for us to decide how best to handle such instances of misconduct when they occur or become known.

There is a difference between a person committing one or two bad acts and a person exhibiting a pattern of bad behavior. Both are in the wrong, but the latter indicates a bad character.

The human tendency is to assume that other people are basically good. When a person does something bad, our first reaction usually isn't to think, "I knew it!" Instead, we usually feel disbelief and/or confusion. We don't know how to react. We tend to give the offender the benefit of the doubt. We don't call him or her out on her behavior. We overlook it. That's an act of generosity towards one who is generally good, but it backfires with a person who is generally bad. The bad character sees that as confirmation that she or he can get away with it. So they have no compunction about doing it again. And again.

Our social rules need to be regularly exercised to teach people and enforce our social expectations that some things are out of bounds. Not everyone is in a position to call out an offender at the time the offense occurs, but those who can, should. This gives the offender an opportunity to realize and apologize for her behavior. Being human, we tend to go on the defensive when called out, and we tend to see apologizing as an act of weakness. In truth, a sincere apology is more likely to earn the offender forgiveness and respect for being willing to acknowledge having done wrong and humbling herself by doing so.

An acknowledgement of the hurt caused and a genuine apology is really what most people want. Most people will be happy to end it there. We do not tend towards vindictiveness. But the sincerity of the apology is judged in part by its timing. If the apology only comes when the offender basically has no option but to apologize, its validity will be suspect, and the victim will be less inclined to forgive.

As a union steward, the willingness of an offender (whether that term is justified or not) to see the encounter from the other person's perspective and give them a genuine apology is a powerful tool in my arsenal. Because the truth is, that's all that most people want. They want to hear the offender say, "I was wrong. I shouldn't have done that, and I am genuinely sorry." Or even "I didn't realize how hurtful that was. I didn't mean to cause hurt, and now that I know I did, I feel horrible. I am truly sorry."
Give them that and it will end there, and everyone will think better of your for being willing to apologize.

But if a person continues to behave badly, we have a bigger issue. It's not a good person occasionally being a jerk. Jerkhood is his or her full-time profession, and an apology will no longer suffice. Those are the people who need to be named and shamed. If we can't change their behavior, we can at least make it difficult for them to find social acceptance and gainful employment...if only to derive them of potential future victims.



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22066

Post by maydijo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:40 pm

:yeah:

I remember learning that even in cases of severe medical malpractice, the best way to prevent a lawsuit is a sincere and genuine apology.

None of us are perfect. We all say and do things that we desperately wish we could take back. We all have baggage, and we all interpret the present through a lens of our past personal experiences. The measure of a person isn't, "Did she do something wrong?" but rather, "When she did something wrong, did she learn from it and go on to do better?"



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22067

Post by Maybenaut » Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:42 pm

DejaMoo wrote:Our social rules need to be regularly exercised to teach people and enforce our social expectations that some things are out of bounds. Not everyone is in a position to call out an offender at the time the offense occurs, but those who can, should.
:yeah:

This is so, so fraught. What I hope comes out of all of this is that more people will feel empowered to come forward at the time. It shouldn't matter to her credibility that a victim waited to come forward, but it does. People's lives are usually messy enough that others who are so inclined can link the timing of a "late" disclosure to some other event in the victim's life, making it appear that the disclosure was intended for gain or deflection.

Regrettably, it's what I do for a living.



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22068

Post by AndyinPA » Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:55 pm

maydijo wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 4:40 pm
:yeah:

I remember learning that even in cases of severe medical malpractice, the best way to prevent a lawsuit is a sincere and genuine apology.
While it wasn't a case of malpractice, I had a doctor who waited a long time (years) to do something about my excruciating pain. After having me see several other specialists, he finally decided to do surgery. After the surgery, he came in and apologized sincerely for all the suffering I had been through. I don't think I would have sued him. He had stayed in the hospital with me with a labor that was longer than a day; he never left me in the care of anyone else. There aren't many doctors who did or do that. But his apology went a very long way for my being able to forgive him for all I had been through. So I pay attention to apologies and a truly sincere one means a lot. The kind that we see most days any more --"if you were offended"-- means nothing.



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22069

Post by maydijo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:06 pm

This is why I have a shitty relationship with my in-laws. In my family, we were taught that when you did something wrong, you took responsibility for it and apologised. In my husband's family, they were taught that if you did something wrong, you waited until the other person got over it. My husband will apologise; but none of my in-laws have ever apologised to me for anything, and they have put me through some seriously shitty things. We're not talking minor family squabbles, we're talking things like my sister in law wilfully and knowingly exposing me to rubella when I was in my first trimester of pregnancy. I know it'll be a cold day in hell before they ever apologise for any of it; and I do my best to forgive them anyway and move on; but honestly, he has one sister I can tolerate; the rest (and his mother - and when he was alive, his father) I dread seeing, and will do anything at all to get out of family functions, because I don't trust them and I don't like them.



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22070

Post by DejaMoo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:59 pm

I have been accused of sexual harassment. I was considerably surprised. After being informed that I was so accused, my (male) accuser was called in and all three of us discussed the situation.
Right off the bat, the guy admitted it really wasn't sexual harassment. But he felt I was harassing him, and sexual harassment was the only form of harassment that had repercussions, so he went with it.

The situation: I was the floor manager, and had a handful of employees working under me. I was very busy, but when I had a moment, I had a chair and desk where I'd sit down. When we were all caught up with our work, the crew would gather round and we'd shoot the breeze until something came up. Sometimes somebody'd grab a break in my chair, but they'd beat it when I approached. Except for this guy. He'd be sitting there, leaning back, heels on my desk, watching me approach. I'd snap my fingers and jerk my thumb: you - out of my chair. He'd get up, I'd sit down.

Turns out he didn't appreciate that. He found it demeaning. He said snapping fingers and jerking the thumb was how you'd order around a dog, not a person. So he went to the owner and reported me for sexual harassment.

After he told his story, I thought fast. I decided if he truly was hurt over my jerking my thumb at him, an apology would be appropriate. If he was just trying to get me in trouble, an apology would probably derail whatever he'd planned next. So I said I hadn't even thought of it that way, but now that he'd explained it, I could see how it was demeaning. I told them I wished to apologize, but - I wanted to publicly apologize, in front of all of our employees. Which I did. And it worked out pretty much as I'd anticipated - it made him happy, but to his coworkers, it cemented his reputation as a spoiled rich kid (he was: his dad owned a bank and was forcing him to work to help pay for college, which he bitterly resented).



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Re: Hijack this thread

#22071

Post by Jez » Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:54 pm

Foggy wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:57 pm
Look into suing the insurance company in small claims court, Jez. :towel:
So, anyone know any good lawyers in Ohio?

They just denied my renters claim. It seems renter's insurance only covers your stuff if it's stolen or there is a fire. Anything that resembles a natural disaster (e.g., tornado, flood, earthquake, etc) is not covered. Which is bull pucky.


I have learned silence from the talkative, toleration from the intolerant, and kindness from the unkind; yet, strange, I am ungrateful to those teachers.

~Khalil Gibran

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Re: Hijack this thread

#22072

Post by DejaMoo » Thu Nov 16, 2017 9:24 pm

You'll have to get your policy and read it. It's the only way you'll find out if you're covered, but they're blowing you off, or if your insurance really doesn't cover this type of situation.



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Fortinbras
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22073

Post by Fortinbras » Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:15 pm

A lot of home insurance policies have exceptions for "acts of God" - such as earthquake or hurricanes.

There has been some litigation over what, precisely, constitutes an Act of God. I got real interested in this circa 1977 when there was a major Con Ed blackout in NYC and hundreds of stores were looted because their burglar alarms and security cameras shut off. Con Ed refused to pay a dime because, it said, the blackout, caused by excess demand on the system during a heat wave, was an Act of God. But then it turned out that Con Ed had actually done some manipulation of the blackout - the company made the choice to keep power going to the posh stores in fashionable midtown while taking down the power in places like Harlem, and had enough time to make phone calls warning some of their VIP customers of the impending power failure but didn't warn the smaller stores. Not so much an Act of God as some gritty decisions by Con Ed executives.



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ZekeB
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22074

Post by ZekeB » Fri Nov 17, 2017 6:04 am

I don't know how the renters policy reads. I'm a little more familiar with homeowners insurance. Acts Of God include windstorms, and I wouldn't have insurance that didn't cover that. Flood insurance and earthquake insurance are usually sold as riders or as additional stand-alone policies. Even without flood insurance, water damage is usually covered if it is caused by equipment failure or the contents getting wet due to, say a broken window, because of a storm. It seems that every state have their own requirements for a standard policy.


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Maybenaut
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Re: Hijack this thread

#22075

Post by Maybenaut » Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:08 am

Sometimes the kneejerk reaction is to deny the claim to see if you’ll go away. Perhaps you can push back - ask to talk to someone higher up.

Is the failure of a sump pump an act of God? Asking for a friend.



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