Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

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JohnPCapitalist
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#176

Post by JohnPCapitalist » Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:29 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:
The owner of Yankton pawn shop says Lyle Jeffs revealed who he was on Tuesday when he pawned two pairs of Leatherman pliers for $37 and provided identification, according to the Associated Press.

River City Treasures and Pawn owner Kevin Haug says a store employee notified him that Jeffs was wanted by the FBI after Jeffs had left the store.

Haug says Jeffs provided his last name as his first name, going by Jeffs Lyle Steed.

Haug then read about Jeffs on the internet and called Yankton police. He says he provided officers with store video and pawn paperwork, the Associated Press reported.
http://www.sltrib.com/news/4439005-155/ ... aptured-in
I thought the best part of the story was the reaction from one of the culties:
While the FBI believed Jeffs was removed from his position as bishop while evading law enforcement, FLDS member Norma Richter on Thursday expressed support for the man many FLDS members still call "Uncle Lyle," and doubted the government's accusations.

"I have no reason to believe anything other than he's honorable and the whole case against him was foolish," she said.

"There was really no case," Richter added. "So I don't know why they were still chasing him."
In other words, the state's case is falling apart. Just like it did for Terry Trussell.



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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#177

Post by Notorial Dissent » Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:31 pm

Things must not being going so rosey if he was having to pawn tools. Tres tragic. Doesn't sound like being on the lam went so well. Maybe they really did cut off the money supply. :rotflmao:


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#178

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:51 pm

So the judge will probably hike Jeffs' bail, right? :roll:



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#179

Post by ZekeB » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:10 pm

I wonder what the pawn shop has the pliers priced at? :doh:


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Žluté vlasy se k oranžové tváři nehodí.

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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#180

Post by Kendra » Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:41 am

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/20 ... e_run.html
When polygamist religious leader Lyle Jeffs vanished from house arrest almost a year ago, there were at least two theories about what happened to him. The FBI said he appeared to have used olive oil to slip free from his GPS-enabled ankle monitor and go on the lam. His lawyer, meanwhile, suggested in court documents that the Rapture—you know, the end-times event when God will zap Christians back to heaven en masse—might have been responsible for his disappearance.



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#181

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:07 am

ZekeB wrote:I wonder what the pawn shop has the pliers priced at? :doh:
I lubs you, Zeke. You focus on the most importantest issue. :lovestruck:

ETA Mr.tired says if the pliers are priced right he wants some too.


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#182

Post by jonbeck » Fri Jun 16, 2017 12:26 pm

Olive oil or rapture? I am leaning towards olive oil, and probably extra virgin variety
:rimshot:



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#183

Post by PaulG » Fri Jun 16, 2017 12:59 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:Things must not being going so rosey if he was having to pawn tools. Tres tragic. Doesn't sound like being on the lam went so well. Maybe they really did cut off the money supply. :rotflmao:
I thought the usual choice was a sack of diamonds when you're going on the lam. A sack of leatherman pliers?



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#184

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:09 pm

You know, upon reflection, I think prison/jail would have been far preferable to holding up in a camper in ND, I mean really. The only thing worse than ND in the Winter is ND in the Summer.


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#185

Post by jmj » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:24 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:You know, upon reflection, I think prison/jail would have been far preferable to holding up in a camper in ND, I mean really. The only thing worse than ND in the Winter is ND in the Summer.
Who said anything about North Dakota? He was caught in southern South Dakota, right on the border with Nebraska. Or did I miss something?



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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#186

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:58 pm

My mistake then, same difference otherwise.

I wonder how Jeffy felt being abandoned by his brother?


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#187

Post by Suranis » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:12 pm

That's the thing that got me. people assumed that he was off living the high life in Rio. But it turns out that he may have been immediately cut off by his brother. People like Warren and Donald do not reward loyalty. Loyalty is an assumed given, and does not demand reward. All that matters is the guy at the head of the snake.


"The devil...the prowde spirite...cannot endure to be mocked.” - Thomas Moore

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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#188

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:32 pm

Isn't that the way oligarchies work?


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Suranis
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#189

Post by Suranis » Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:05 pm

No. Oligarchies are a group at the top. Monarchies and Tyrannies have one guy at the top.


"The devil...the prowde spirite...cannot endure to be mocked.” - Thomas Moore

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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#190

Post by Chilidog » Wed Jun 21, 2017 6:45 pm

A federal grand jury on Wednesday returned a superseding indictment that adds a felony count of failure to appear in court against one-time fugitive Lyle Jeffs, who was among 11 members of the polygamous Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints indicted in 2016 in what prosecutors called a conspiracy to defraud a food stamp program. - See more at: http://www.sltrib.com/news/5428434-155/ ... dtDaL.dpuf



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#191

Post by RVInit » Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:12 am

From the article above
Jeffs' co-defendants have pleaded guilty to felony or misdemeanor charges, and all avoided going to jail or paying restitution.
WTF


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#192

Post by Notorial Dissent » Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:48 pm

According to a newspaper report Jeffs has plead guilty to escape as well as the earlier fraud charges. He is facing at the least a five to ten year sentence.

Daily Mail


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#193

Post by Suranis » Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:50 am

Makes sense as he found out the hard way that Warren wont help him while he is on the run. Might as well pop the G plea, and hope for an easier sentence.


"The devil...the prowde spirite...cannot endure to be mocked.” - Thomas Moore

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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#194

Post by Notorial Dissent » Thu Sep 21, 2017 5:14 am

I think he figured out that living on the lam with no support from brother dear was not all skittles and beer. As near as I can see Warren turned his back on him, so much for family loyalty. I hope they make him allocute to all his crimes and maybe further bury his brother.


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#195

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:55 am

Karma?
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... time#img-1
'It's a revolution': polygamist sect loses power over Utah town for first time
Majority control on the town council of Hildale is now set to transfer away from the sect, and a new female mayor is expected to win once ballots are counted


The idea of Hildale with a non-fundamentalist, female mayor in charge would have been unthinkable even five years ago. Even after Jeffs was jailed, he would send orders via his brother, Lyle. But now Lyle Jeffs is also in custody, awaiting trial accused of defrauding the federal food-stamp program.

“There is great uncertainty about who is in charge of the FLDS now,” said Elissa Wall. She moved back from Salt Lake City to Hildale in 2016, years after fleeing the religion in the middle of the night to escape the marriage Warren Jeffs had forced her into with one of her first cousins, at the age of 14.

Wall played a pivotal role in bringing Jeffs to justice by testifying against him in an early trial, even though his conviction then was later overturned on a technicality. It was several years before he was finally caught and convicted for later crimes.

After 10 years of campaigning, Wall recently won two lawsuits, against the FLDS, Warren Jeffs and a trust that controls church land, and moved back to Hildale, taking her two children and her e-commerce clothing business with her. She helped start a grassroots movement to register new, non-FLDS voters in the town and encourage a democratic election process with free and fair voting.


"The people must know before they can act, and there is no educator to compare with the press." - Ida B. Wells-Barnett, journalist, newspaper editor, suffragist, feminist and founder with others of NAACP.

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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#196

Post by Maybenaut » Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:07 pm

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:55 am
Karma?
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... time#img-1
'It's a revolution': polygamist sect loses power over Utah town for first time

<snip>

Wall played a pivotal role in bringing Jeffs to justice by testifying against him in an early trial, even though his conviction then was later overturned on a technicality. It was several years before he was finally caught and convicted for later crimes.

<snip>

Off Topic
A pet irritation of mine. There’s no such thing as a “technicality.” The law is the law; it allows what it allows and prohibits what it prohibits.

And even if such a thing as a technicality existed, this was not one. Jeffs’ conviction was overturned because the jury was not properly instructed about the mens rea required for the offense. That’s not a “technicality.” It’s a “due process violation.”

New York Times wrote:The Utah Supreme Court on Tuesday morning threw out the rape convictions of the polygamous sect leader Warren S. Jeffs and sent the case back for a new trial, ruling that the instructions given to the jury during his prosecution were faulty.

Mr. Jeffs, the leader of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, was given two consecutive sentences of five years to life after he was convicted in 2007 of being an accomplice to the rape of a 14-year-old girl from his church whose marriage he presided over.

But in a unanimous decision, the Utah Supreme Court ruled that a state judge had erred when he failed to tell the jury that Mr. Jeffs could not be found guilty unless he specifically intended for the girl’s husband to have nonconsensual sex with her, which Mr. Jeffs denied.

The ruling was a setback for Utah prosecutors, who had hoped that Mr. Jeffs would serve at least 10 years in prison.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2010/07/28/us/28jeffs.html



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#197

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:26 pm

I agree with your OFF Topic point!


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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#198

Post by Sam the Centipede » Fri Nov 10, 2017 2:02 pm

Off Topic
No such thing as a technicality? What nonsense! That's an example of when lawyers disappear up their own backsides and fail to understand the distinction between law and justice.

If someone committed a crime and avoids conviction because of a small procedural failing by law enforcement or the court, that is getting off on a technicality. What else would you call it? The courts make a decision but the deed exists outside of that adjudication. George Zimmerman committed a murder. A court failed to find him guilty of that murder. Nevertheless, it was a murder, he is a murderer. Not in the eyes of the law, but that is the law's failing or the court's failing. He's as much a murderer as I would be if I killed someone for fun but nobody ever discovered it was me so I was never brought to book. Courts do not create truth. They adjudicate it ... imperfectly.

We saw in Oregon the Bundys getting off. Oh yes, they committed the crimes they were accused of. The court failed to convict. The verdicts were wrong. That was lawful, but it was an unjust. (Yes,s I know that was jury nullification, but the wider point is that courts do not create truth.)

Justice and the law are two different things. Lawyers want law. Ordinary people want justice. The difference is sometimes technicalities, sometimes bad law, sometimes bad judges or bad juries.



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#199

Post by Maybenaut » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:25 pm

Sorry... meant to edit, and quoted instead. The following post is what I meant to say. :oops:



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Re: Jeffs and 10 Others Indicted for Food Stamp Fraud Conspiracy and Money Laundering

#200

Post by Maybenaut » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:38 pm

Maybenaut wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:25 pm
Off Topic
Sam the Centipede wrote:No such thing as a technicality? What nonsense! That's an example of when lawyers disappear up their own backsides and fail to understand the distinction between law and justice.
I don't think there is a distinction between law and justice. I don't think justice can ever be measured by the result. If it could, then there would never be justice in an adversarial system because someone would always be unhappy with the result. I think justice is served when the process is followed, whether I agree with the result or not. ETA: If I thought otherwise, it would mean that I think justice is only served when I get my own way. That's not justice.

Am I happy that Zimmerman was acquitted? Of course not. Was justice served? Absolutely. How do I know? Because the people of Florida through their legislature said that Stand Your Ground is the law in Florida. The judge instructed the jury accordingly, and the jury acquitted. Same goes for the Oregon defendants. I don't have to like the result to think justice has been served.
Sam the Centipede wrote:If someone committed a crime and avoids conviction because of a small procedural failing by law enforcement or the court, that is getting off on a technicality. What else would you call it?
Due process. It's what our Constitution demands.

If all of this means I have my head up my ass, so be it.



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