Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

User avatar
Sterngard Friegen
Posts: 40882
Joined: Wed Aug 05, 2009 12:32 am
Location: Trump International - Malibu

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Tue Jul 11, 2017 9:35 am

Foggy wrote:Human Rights Campaign, not that lady who couldn't beat the worst candidate in American history.

That had me goin' for a second, so I read it again.
I think you just made my point, Pappy.

User avatar
Foggy
Posts: 24510
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:00 pm
Location: Fogbow HQ (Rawly NC)
Occupation: Dick Tater

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Foggy » Tue Jul 11, 2017 11:21 am

:thumbs:
If dogs run free, why not we?

User avatar
TollandRCR
Posts: 18969
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:17 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by TollandRCR » Thu Jul 13, 2017 4:08 pm

In Kansas:
Kansas State sophomore offensive tackle Scott Frantz publicly came out as gay in an interview with ESPN, joining incoming Arizona freshman My-King Johnson as the only active openly gay Bowl Subdivision players for the 2017 college season.

Frantz, who started 13 games for the Wildcats last season, said the first time he ever came out to anyone was with all of his teammates during an offseason team-building exercise in 2015 — after Frantz’s redshirt season. Coach Bill Snyder brought in a motivational speaker, who encouraged players to reveal authentic details about themselves.

"So the very first time I said those words were in front of, you know, 110, 120 football guys,” Frantz told ESPN. "So you can imagine how scared I was, how nervous I was. ... This could go either really bad or could go really good. And thankfully, my teammates embraced me with open arms, and it was great.

“I came out to my teammates, and I've never felt so loved and so accepted ever in my life than when I did that. And ever since then, it's been great. I've grown so much closer to my teammates since. So it's been an amazing experience."
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/n ... 475154001/
“The truth is, we know so little about life, we don’t really know what the good news is and what the bad news is.” Kurt Vonnegut

User avatar
Foggy
Posts: 24510
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:00 pm
Location: Fogbow HQ (Rawly NC)
Occupation: Dick Tater

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Foggy » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:43 pm

Dusty in here. :cry:
If dogs run free, why not we?

User avatar
NotaPerson
Posts: 2643
Joined: Mon May 18, 2015 9:33 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by NotaPerson » Thu Jul 13, 2017 6:50 pm

TollandRCR wrote:In Kansas:
"So the very first time I said those words were in front of, you know, 110, 120 football guys,” Frantz told ESPN. "So you can imagine how scared I was, how nervous I was. ... This could go either really bad or could go really good. And thankfully, my teammates embraced me with open arms, and it was great.

“I came out to my teammates, and I've never felt so loved and so accepted ever in my life than when I did that. And ever since then, it's been great. I've grown so much closer to my teammates since. So it's been an amazing experience."
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/n ... 475154001/
:clap:

Another sign that the future is on our side.

Is that crazy fundamentalist church in Wichita(?) still around? I hope they hear about this.
Am I being detained?

User avatar
TollandRCR
Posts: 18969
Joined: Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:17 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by TollandRCR » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:06 pm

The Millennials that I know are not hung up on gender or sexuality.

Westboro Baptist is still going, although the excommunication of founder Fred Phelps and then his death may doom them. They are in Topeka across from this house.

“The truth is, we know so little about life, we don’t really know what the good news is and what the bad news is.” Kurt Vonnegut

User avatar
bob
Posts: 21990
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by bob » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:12 pm

NotaPerson wrote:Is that crazy fundamentalist church in Wichita(?) still around?
Westboro? Oh, yes. Picketing the Neil Diamond concert in Wichita tomorrow, for example.

"Neil Diamond??!?" I hear you say. Thrice married. :fingerwag:
Imagex4 Imagex2 Imagex2 Imagex2

Sunrise
Posts: 389
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 3:29 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Sunrise » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:16 pm

bob wrote:
NotaPerson wrote:Is that crazy fundamentalist church in Wichita(?) still around?
Westboro? Oh, yes. Picketing the Neil Diamond concert in Wichita tomorrow, for example.

"Neil Diamond??!?" I hear you say. Thrice married. :fingerwag:
Oooooh! Maybe they can picket 45? :mrgreen:

User avatar
Tiredretiredlawyer
Posts: 3473
Joined: Tue May 10, 2016 2:56 pm
Location: Animal Planet
Occupation: Permanent probationary slave to 5 dogs, 2 cats, the neighbor's cat, and 1 horse

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:47 pm

Foggy wrote:Dusty in here. :cry:
Yes, it is.
“I’ve been hooked since my first smell of C-4.” Linda Cox, first female Air Force Explosive Ordnance Disposal Technician, first to lead her own unit, go to war, be awarded a Bronze Star, and hold the highest enlisted rank of chief master sergeant.

User avatar
Tiredretiredlawyer
Posts: 3473
Joined: Tue May 10, 2016 2:56 pm
Location: Animal Planet
Occupation: Permanent probationary slave to 5 dogs, 2 cats, the neighbor's cat, and 1 horse

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:48 pm

TollandRCR wrote:The Millennials that I know are not hung up on gender or sexuality.

Westboro Baptist is still going, although the excommunication of founder Fred Phelps and then his death may doom them. They are in Topeka across from this house.

Love it!!! :rotflmao:
“I’ve been hooked since my first smell of C-4.” Linda Cox, first female Air Force Explosive Ordnance Disposal Technician, first to lead her own unit, go to war, be awarded a Bronze Star, and hold the highest enlisted rank of chief master sergeant.

User avatar
RVInit
Posts: 4177
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:31 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by RVInit » Fri Jul 14, 2017 8:14 am

A rainbow house across the the Westboro Baptist Church and Scott Frantz' story, these are wonderful things. :lovestruck: :bighug:
"I know that human being and fish can coexist peacefully"
--- George W Bush

User avatar
vic
Posts: 3029
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 1:36 am
Location: The great San Fernando Valley
Occupation: Web developer

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by vic » Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:35 am

https://patch.com/california/los-angele ... ol-offices

Legislators Sued For Displaying Pride Flags
LONG BEACH, CA — Long Beach Rep. Alan Lowenthal Wednesday pledged to fight a lawsuit by a lobbyist, who wants to force him to ta his "Pride Flag" down from his Washington, D.C. office because it makes him feel uncomfortable.

Chris Sevier, a self-described "former Judge Advocate General, combat Veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom, DC lobbyist, overseas missionary, whistleblower and recording artist," filed the suit in federal court in Washington Tuesday. He specifically named Lowenthal and Reps. Susan Davis (D-San Diego) Donald Beyer, (D-Virginia) and Earl Blumenauer (D-Oregon) as defendants.

Sevier claims the flag makes him feel unwelcome in federal buildings and therefor unable to approach the defendants to perform his lobbying duties.

Lowenthal, among the first legislators to raise the Pride flag in his office, said he won't be intimidated by lawsuit.
:snippity:
He's got all sorts of crazy history -

He sued in Utah to be able to marry his laptop
He sued Apple for not protecting him from porn
Convicted of assault on his father-in-law when he tried to take his son during a supervised visit (and injured the child)
Failed to pay child support

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/tag/chris-sevier/
http://www.thedailybeast.com/porn-filte ... nd-assault
http://www.abajournal.com/news/article/ ... _gets_sec/

User avatar
Notorial Dissent
Posts: 8564
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:21 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Notorial Dissent » Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:56 am

Sevier sounds like he is most of the deck short. I wonder if he's ever heard of the First Amendment??? As to the rest of his claimed CV, ya shur!!!!
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

User avatar
bob
Posts: 21990
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by bob » Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:29 pm

Courier-Journal: Taxpayers on hook for Kentucky clerk Kim Davis' fight against gay marriage:
In a victory for same-sex couples denied marriage licenses by Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis, a federal judge Friday awarded $222,695 in fees to their attorneys.

* * *

U.S. District Judge David Bunning ordered the state to pay the fees, rather than Davis or Rowan County.

He said Davis was protected because she was acting in her official capacity when she stopped issuing marriage licenses in 2015 on religious grounds after the Supreme Court held gay marriage is a fundamental right. He said the state rather than the county was liable because the state is primarily responsible for regulating marriage.

In a 50-page ruling, Bunning said he was awarding the fees under a federal law that allows them to be granted to the prevailing party in civil rights cases. He overruled a magistrate judge who had denied the money because he said the plaintiffs hadn’t really prevailed.
IIRC, when Davis pulled her stunt, the Kentucky legislature was not in session. And the governor refused to call it into special session (to change the law) because it would have cost around $100k to do so.
Imagex4 Imagex2 Imagex2 Imagex2

User avatar
Dr. Blue
Posts: 808
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 10:01 am
Occupation: Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Dr. Blue » Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:26 pm

bob wrote:Courier-Journal: Taxpayers on hook for Kentucky clerk Kim Davis' fight against gay marriage:
In a victory for same-sex couples denied marriage licenses by Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis, a federal judge Friday awarded $222,695 in fees to their attorneys.

* * *

U.S. District Judge David Bunning ordered the state to pay the fees, rather than Davis or Rowan County.

He said Davis was protected because she was acting in her official capacity when she stopped issuing marriage licenses in 2015 on religious grounds after the Supreme Court held gay marriage is a fundamental right. He said the state rather than the county was liable because the state is primarily responsible for regulating marriage.

In a 50-page ruling, Bunning said he was awarding the fees under a federal law that allows them to be granted to the prevailing party in civil rights cases. He overruled a magistrate judge who had denied the money because he said the plaintiffs hadn’t really prevailed.
IIRC, when Davis pulled her stunt, the Kentucky legislature was not in session. And the governor refused to call it into special session (to change the law) because it would have cost around $100k to do so.
Didn't the state of Kentucky actually tell all county clerks to issue licenses to same-sex couples? And now the state has to pay Davis' legal fees because she refused to do what the state told her to do? That doesn't seem right ("right" as in "just", not "right" as in "correct')...

User avatar
bob
Posts: 21990
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by bob » Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:48 pm

Dr. Blue wrote:Didn't the state of Kentucky actually tell all county clerks to issue licenses to same-sex couples? And now the state has to pay Davis' legal fees because she refused to do what the state told her to do? That doesn't seem right ("right" as in "just", not "right" as in "correct')...
I don't recall whether the state did, but Davis, as an elected official, wasn't obligated to follow those orders. But your point is a good one: short of calling a special session to change the law, I think it would be fair to say Kentucky encouraged Davis to issue those licenses.

But who should pay? Not Davis: she had (qualified) immunity because her actions were part of her official acts. And not the county, because the judge found the state had more authority than the county over the regulations concerning marriage licenses. (This was Arpaio redux: an unconstrained elected official can create much hell for someone else's checkbook.)

This type of ruling is meant to "encourage" states to clean up loopholes, because if it is unclear where the buck stops, then it stops with the state.
Imagex4 Imagex2 Imagex2 Imagex2

User avatar
Notorial Dissent
Posts: 8564
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:21 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Notorial Dissent » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:04 am

When and how does "qualified immunity" come in to when the official in question is actually breaking the law at the time.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

User avatar
Dr. Blue
Posts: 808
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 10:01 am
Occupation: Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Dr. Blue » Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:29 am

bob wrote:
Dr. Blue wrote:Didn't the state of Kentucky actually tell all county clerks to issue licenses to same-sex couples? And now the state has to pay Davis' legal fees because she refused to do what the state told her to do? That doesn't seem right ("right" as in "just", not "right" as in "correct')...
I don't recall whether the state did, but Davis, as an elected official, wasn't obligated to follow those orders. But your point is a good one: short of calling a special session to change the law, I think it would be fair to say Kentucky encouraged Davis to issue those licenses.

But who should pay? Not Davis: she had (qualified) immunity because her actions were part of her official acts. And not the county, because the judge found the state had more authority than the county over the regulations concerning marriage licenses. (This was Arpaio redux: an unconstrained elected official can create much hell for someone else's checkbook.)

This type of ruling is meant to "encourage" states to clean up loopholes, because if it is unclear where the buck stops, then it stops with the state.
I did verify my recollection that the Governor did in fact tell the clerks to issue the licenses: from the linked story - Gov Beshear to county clerk before all the bruhaha:
"Neither your oath nor the Supreme Court dictates what you must believe,” he wrote to them. “But as elected officials, they do prescribe how we must act.”
Of course, that's just one elected official to another, and you can make the argument that the Governor is not the boss of the clerks. But at some point, it seems like a county official in clear defiance of what the state tells them to do should move responsibility from the state level down to the county level or the individual. I'm not sure what it would (or should) take to move responsibility for that defiance though - maybe an official act of the state (rather than a letter of advice from the Governor)?

Anyway, it's not worth getting really worked up about this one - the amount of money is small for the state (about a nickle per resident). Still, if I lived in Kentucky, I'd be pissed that even a penny was going to cover this bigots illegal actions. And to make it worse, people in Louisville have to pay for her actions even though they have no power to correct the problem by voting - they are entirely at the mercy of the citizens of Rowan County to correct it at the ballot box.

User avatar
Dr. Blue
Posts: 808
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2012 10:01 am
Occupation: Boom, Boom, Boom, Boom

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Dr. Blue » Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:52 am

OK, I read a different article about this that described the state's responsibility a little more clearly:
http://www.kentucky.com/news/politics-g ... 85388.html
And had the state chosen to, Bunning wrote, it could have pursued criminal penalties against Davis for official misconduct — then-Attorney General Jack Conway, running for governor in 2015, refused a formal request to do so — or the legislature could have impeached her and removed her from office.
So the state did have actions it could have taken, and by not doing so they were letting her official actions stand. Then they take responsibility. That makes sense to me.

User avatar
bob
Posts: 21990
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:22 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by bob » Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:27 am

Notorial Dissent wrote:When and how does "qualified immunity" come in to when the official in question is actually breaking the law at the time.
In general, government officials who act in furtherance of their official duties are immune from personal liability. Without such a rule, no one would become a government official, for fear of lawsuits from dissatisfied customers.

There are exceptions, but one of the biggest exceptions to the exceptions is when there is uncertainty in the law. The same-sex-marriage ruling was new, and it hadn't been tested. So it was argued there was uncertainty, and Davis was trying to follow the law under the circumstances (as there are laws that provide faith-based accommodations in certain circumstances). In essence, there's a "first one's free" rule, and Davis successfully argued she was entitled to it.
Imagex4 Imagex2 Imagex2 Imagex2

User avatar
Chilidog
Posts: 7516
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2012 11:36 am

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Chilidog » Sun Jul 23, 2017 3:18 pm

From Jamaica, mon
Head of the Anglican Church in Jamaica and the Cayman Islands, Bishop Howard Gregory, has broken ranks with many of his Christian brethren and urged the parliamentary committee examining the Sexual Offences Act and related laws to recommend the removal of the offence of buggery from the law books, widen the definition of rape, and recognise marital rape.

In a written submission to the committee in which he emphasised that his views were personal, Gregory placed his position in line with executed German Christian leader Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who had argued that the aim of the Church is not "that the authorities make Christian policies, Christian laws and so on, but that they be proper authorities in the sense of their special commission".

According to Gregory, the State should not waste time with a referendum on the buggery law but should just strike it from the books.
http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/lead ... colleagues

Is it wrong that the word "buggery" makes me want to giggle? There's something about that word that is just absurd and English.

User avatar
RVInit
Posts: 4177
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2016 4:31 pm

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by RVInit » Sun Jul 23, 2017 3:58 pm

:thumbs:
"I know that human being and fish can coexist peacefully"
--- George W Bush

User avatar
Volkonski
Posts: 13403
Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2013 4:44 pm
Location: Texas Gulf Coast and North Fork of Long Island
Occupation: Retired Mechanical Engineer

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Volkonski » Thu Jul 27, 2017 3:10 pm

Jess Sessions strikes again. :madguy: :madguy:

Justice Dept. Says Rights Law Doesn’t Protect Gays

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/27/nyre ... .html?_r=0
The Department of Justice has filed court papers arguing that a major federal civil rights law does not protect employees from discrimination based on sexual orientation, taking a stand against a decision reached under former President Barack Obama.

The department’s move to insert itself into the New York case was an uncommon example of top officials in Washington opining directly in the courts on what is an important but essentially private dispute between a worker and his boss over gay rights issues. Civil rights advocates immediately criticized the filing not only for the arguments it advanced, but also for having been made on the same day that President Trump announced on Twitter that transgender people would be banned from serving in the military.
Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace

User avatar
Estiveo
Posts: 6529
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 7:31 pm
Location: Trouble's Howse

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Estiveo » Tue Aug 01, 2017 10:31 am

A sweet little short.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2REkk9SCRn0
"Cosmic apotheosis wears off faster than salvia." --Rick Sanchez

User avatar
Foggy
Posts: 24510
Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:00 pm
Location: Fogbow HQ (Rawly NC)
Occupation: Dick Tater

Re: Gay Rights - LGBT - Same Sex Marriage

Post by Foggy » Tue Aug 01, 2017 11:11 am

:lovestruck:
If dogs run free, why not we?

Post Reply

Return to “Social Issues”