Stock Market

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fierceredpanda
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Re: Stock Market

#651

Post by fierceredpanda »

I saw a quote earlier today from the partner running the Energy Practice section for a Houston law firm saying they're pulling lawyers off other projects to work on planning oil company bankruptcies. He was also saying that the ultra-low prices could very well mean a lot of those bankruptcies are likely to be Chapter 7 liquidations rather than Chapter 11 reorganizations. The typical debt-for-equity swap two-step of a reorganization doesn't work if your creditors aren't interested in equity in a company that pulls a worthless commodity out of the ground.

A bell sounds and a violin weeps for the fracking industry.

:violin: :violin: :violin:


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Re: Stock Market

#652

Post by TexasFilly »

Perilous times always seem to result in lots of work for civil lawyers. I was busy for many years during and after the S&L crisis. Bankruptcy lawyers will certainly be fully employed now (if getting back to work doesn't kill them).


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Sterngard Friegen
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Re: Stock Market

#653

Post by Sterngard Friegen »

Sounds like it's time to start investing in windmills. Except for the cancer they produce, they seem like a good investment right now.


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Suranis
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Re: Stock Market

#654

Post by Suranis »

Better be careful. An accident at a wind farm recently sent a wave of highly energetic wind across Ireland.


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Re: Stock Market

#655

Post by Mr. Gneiss »

fierceredpanda wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:59 pm A bell sounds and a violin weeps for the fracking industry.

:violin: :violin: :violin:
From a geologist's perspective, I'm looking forward to a long lull in seismic activity for the stable craton otherwise known as mid-America! :mrgreen:


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Princess foofypants
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Re: Stock Market

#656

Post by Princess foofypants »

Whatever4 wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:05 pm That’s the thing about commodities: you screw up, you have to figure out where to put your pork bellies or corn or oil when they deliver it.
Actually had a client that happened to except he needed to deliver on a contract that he didn’t have.


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Re: Stock Market

#657

Post by kate520 »

Sterngard Friegen wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:26 pm Sounds like it's time to start investing in windmills. Except for the cancer they produce, they seem like a good investment right now.
And the poor birds. The ground will be littered with them. The windmill industry won’t lift a finger to protect those birdies.
/snarcasm


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Re: Stock Market

#658

Post by Whatever4 »

Princess foofypants wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:25 pm
Whatever4 wrote: Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:05 pm That’s the thing about commodities: you screw up, you have to figure out where to put your pork bellies or corn or oil when they deliver it.
Actually had a client that happened to except he needed to deliver on a contract that he didn’t have.
Oh my goodness... what happened?


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Re: Stock Market

#659

Post by Volkonski »

Courthouse News
@CourthouseNews
·
29m
First June Dow Opening Comes With Tiny Dip http://ow.ly/I4Bz30qLyss
@NickRummell
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Not sure why they choose that photo for this tweet. :?


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NotaPerson
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Re: Stock Market

#660

Post by NotaPerson »

In case you hadn't noticed, the Dow is now up about 50 percent from its low several weeks ago. :shock:


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Re: Stock Market

#661

Post by RTH10260 »

individual1 will claim this as a victory in 3... 2... 1...
The S&P 500 erases its losses for the year as Wall Street’s rally continues.

Stocks on Wall Street erased their losses for the year, a remarkable milestone for a market that was reeling just a few months ago as investors feared the damage caused by the coronavirus pandemic.

The S&P 500 rose more than 1 percent on Monday, adding to a weekslong rebound that has been fueled by hopes for a quick economic recovery, significant intervention by the Federal Reserve and a disregard for the serious risks that businesses and consumers still face.

A familiar list of companies has been leading the recent gains. Airlines have been lifted by signs that domestic travel is starting to pick up, and they rallied again on Monday along with Boeing. With oil prices rebounding, crude briefly crossed above $40 a barrel on Monday for the first time in months, energy companies have also surged.

Stocks have been on an upward trajectory for weeks as investors have responded to signs around the world that the virus was abating. New York, the center of the coronavirus outbreak in the United States, on Monday began to lift some restrictions on construction, manufacturing and retail operations.

Progress like that, and early evidence that it means people are returning to work, helped fuel a nearly 5 percent gain in the S&P 500 last week — its biggest weekly run since early April. But the market’s rebound really began in March, after the Federal Reserve signaled its willingness to funnel unlimited amounts of liquidity into financial markets. Since then, stocks have risen more than 44 percent.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/08/busi ... k-7bd27140


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Re: Stock Market

#662

Post by ZekeB »

They're still swooning at the 13.3 percent unemployment rate when the real rate is 16.3 percent. Wait until the earnings figures start coming in.


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Re: Stock Market

#663

Post by ZekeB »

Dow down about 1350 points at 11:30 AM here. There must be some real rookies investing in stocks lately. They look at one day's worth of news and golly gee, they think things are going to be Wunderbar in three months. Then the smarter investors sneak in and snatch any possible gains from the newbs.


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Re: Stock Market

#664

Post by TexasFilly »

ZekeB wrote: Thu Jun 11, 2020 12:30 pm Dow down about 1350 points at 11:30 AM here. There must be some real rookies investing in stocks lately. They look at one day's worth of news and golly gee, they think things are going to be Wunderbar in three months. Then the smarter investors sneak in and snatch any possible gains from the newbs.
True. CNBC won't let me copy, but here's their main story: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/06/10/stock-m ... -news.html

Looks like a combination of things like investors who bought airline and cruise ship stocks dumping them, the Fed report from yesterday and Wall Street finally noting that re-opening is causing COVID surges in places like Texas and Arizona. Scott Gottlieb, the former FDA commissioner points out that Texas never got out of the first wave.

Reading about the markets sickens me as there is no concern for human life, unemployment, massive unrest. It's been party time on Wall Street. How many times have we seen this?

We'll see how the day ends, but this will make the Lunatic in the White House even more unhinged.


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Re: Stock Market

#665

Post by Addie »

The Hill: Trump blasts Fed as stocks plunge, coronavirus cases rise


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Re: Stock Market

#666

Post by ZekeB »

Some investors sit there with abated breath, waiting for another Trump lie that will give them a reason to buy.


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Re: Stock Market

#667

Post by RTH10260 »

I hear a baby crying in the WH
Stocks fall, 1.5 million more U.S. workers file for unemployment, and Congress is divided on extending aid.

Stocks on Wall Street suffered their sharpest daily decline in three months on Thursday as investors’ confidence was rattled by grim new economic forecasts, another 1.5 million weekly unemployment claims and a worrisome uptick in cases in parts of the United States.

The S&P 500 fell nearly 6 percent, and the Dow Jones industrial average fell by nearly 7 percent. Oil prices also cratered, reflecting the sudden unease that swept across financial markets.

Stocks had been on an upward trajectory for weeks, a rally that stood in stark contrast to a collapse in economic activity but seemed to show that investors were betting on a quick recovery as states lifted stay-at-home restrictions. By Monday, the S&P 500 had climbed about 45 percent from its lows in late March and recouped all of its losses for the year.

As the bad news brought Wall Street’s recent rally to a halt, policymakers remained divided as to their next steps. The Labor Department reported Thursday that another 1.5 million U.S. workers had filed state unemployment claims last week, but Republicans and Democrats in Congress remained at odds over whether to extend federal jobless benefits.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/11/worl ... k-660c6432


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Re: Stock Market

#668

Post by kate520 »

The irrational exuberance of the market since March is all on him. He’s been lying to us and himself about any rebound, against all evidence and common sense*.






* Yeah, I know. The day they were handing out sense trump thought they said tents and said ‘fuck tents, I’m living in a house’.


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Re: Stock Market

#669

Post by Slim Cognito »

Holy crap! Can somebody tell me what's up with the stock market? I heard the Dow was down 700 yesterday but shrugged it off. I didn't think it was a big deal and, today being Friday, I assumed we'd gain half of it back, but right now it's down another 400. Is there something specific doing this or is it just a correction?


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Re: Stock Market

#670

Post by neonzx »

Slim Cognito wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:57 am Holy crap! Can somebody tell me what's up with the stock market? I heard the Dow was down 700 yesterday but shrugged it off. I didn't think it was a big deal and, today being Friday, I assumed we'd gain half of it back, but right now it's down another 400. Is there something specific doing this or is it just a correction?
I think it's just a partial correction. Many equities are overvalued, especially techs, and don't reflect reality.

You'd expect the market on Wall Street to be a lagging indicator of the economy on Main Street, but that doesn't appear to hold true in this 'recovery' or whatever the hell it is.


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Re: Stock Market

#671

Post by ZekeB »

Slim Cognito wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:57 am Holy crap! Can somebody tell me what's up with the stock market? I heard the Dow was down 700 yesterday but shrugged it off. I didn't think it was a big deal and, today being Friday, I assumed we'd gain half of it back, but right now it's down another 400. Is there something specific doing this or is it just a correction?
IMO the stock market has been climbing since June for no good reason. Perhaps false hopes put forth by the liar in chief? If you ask me the DJIA is still way overpriced. Just remember that the DJIA is a group of large select companies. It doesn't reflect the holdings of your average investor. Look at your own portfolio and see how it is doing. Do NOT buy any stocks during the pandemic unless your well-versed broker tells you to.


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Re: Stock Market

#672

Post by bob »

Slim Cognito wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:57 am Holy crap! Can somebody tell me what's up with the stock market? I heard the Dow was down 700 yesterday but shrugged it off. I didn't think it was a big deal and, today being Friday, I assumed we'd gain half of it back, but right now it's down another 400. Is there something specific doing this or is it just a correction?
The impeached president recently was bragging that the DJIA had returned to pre-COVID levels, so I'm not surprised that some investors took that as a cue to sell off. (Too also, recently released trade deficit numbers were poor, as were the national-deficit-to-GDP ratio numbers.)

Numbers like 700 or 400 are relatively small fluxations as a percentage. They sounds huge, but they are less than three percent changes in the index, which is presently around 28,000. Yesterday, for example, the DJIA lost around 808 points. That was the 17th largest single-day drop ever as measured in points, but only a 2.78 percentage drop, which is not particularly notable.


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Re: Stock Market

#673

Post by Slim Cognito »

thanks all!


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Re: Stock Market

#674

Post by JohnPCapitalist »

Slim Cognito wrote: Fri Sep 04, 2020 10:57 am Holy crap! Can somebody tell me what's up with the stock market? I heard the Dow was down 700 yesterday but shrugged it off. I didn't think it was a big deal and, today being Friday, I assumed we'd gain half of it back, but right now it's down another 400. Is there something specific doing this or is it just a correction?
It is indeed a bit of a correction. I agree with the other replies above that the market is ignoring either current or reasonably anticipated future bad news, like the probable wave of evictions coming soon, and the potential for commercial real estate defaults from failed retail businesses (which turns into problems for banks). The end of supplemental federal unemployment benefits means consumers have less to spend, driving even formerly safe businesses like grocery stores, to start to struggle.

Another structural issue is that middle-class consumers continue to put money into their 401(k)'s. At the same time, the number of stocks to invest in continues to drop as the IPO market remains dry and as bankruptcies, mergers and private equity buyouts reduce the number of listings of institutional quality stocks. If inflows continue to the tune of $100 to $200 billion per month and there are ever fewer places to put the money to work, it will go to work propping up a smaller number of stocks. And managers are going to chase the momentum, buying more of what worked last month (Apple, Amazon, Google, Facebook, whatever). This will likely prolong market rises, but it will also have the tendency of deepening the troughs when investors rotate to bonds or even cash.

And the bond market doesn't seem to me to be all that safe (though I'm an equity guy and not a credit geek, so I'm not an expert on fixed income). If interest rates go up due to issuer defaults or due to bank problems, bond prices will plummet. I wouldn't want to be in bonds at this point. And if the bond market crashes and burns, then the economy will really stall because companies can't get credit. Most large companies are sitting on record levels of cash, but eventually they'll need external financing.

So yeah, it's utterly perplexing to me that the market has rallied to all-time highs as we're en route to history's worst-ever GDP drop, record bankruptcies, consumer distress, and the biggest ever budget deficit.


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Re: Stock Market

#675

Post by Slim Cognito »

(One of) My fear is the house of cards will topple right after Biden is inaugurated so if it's going to happen, let it happen soon.


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