The Airline Industry

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RTH10260
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The Airline Industry

#1

Post by RTH10260 »

to complement the Flying the unfriendly skies thread and the crashes thread

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Re: The Airline Industry

#2

Post by RTH10260 »

on the discussion of First / Business class seating in a thread elsewhere


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Re: The Airline Industry

#3

Post by RTH10260 »

FAA says it again: Boeing’s 737 Max is not ready for certification
PUBLISHED TUE, NOV 26 20196:11 PM ESTUPDATED TUE, NOV 26 20197:09 PM EST
Phil LeBeau

With just 35 days left in 2019, the FAA is making it increasingly clear it is unlikely to recertify the Boeing 737 Max this year, a target Boeing has been eyeing for months.

For the third time in two weeks, the FAA said publicly it will take all the time it needs to deem the Max safe. The FAA issued a new statement, saying, “The FAA has not completed its review of the 737 Max aircraft design changes and associated pilot training. The agency will not approve the aircraft for return to service until it has completed numerous rounds of rigorous testing.”

FAA tells Boeing it controls approval process for 737 Max return

CNBC has asked Boeing if it sticks by its guidance of the 737 Max potentially returning to commercial service by the end of January. The company says it has not changed its outlook.

This is the latest move by the FAA to publicly push back on Boeing’s belief that Max deliveries could resume soon. In its most recent 737 Max progress report issued on Nov. 11, Boeing said it is “possible that the resumption of Max deliveries to airline customers could begin in December, after certification, when the FAA issues an Airworthiness Directive rescinding the grounding order.”


https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/26/faa-say ... ation.html

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Re: The Airline Industry

#4

Post by RTH10260 »


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Re: The Airline Industry

#5

Post by tek »

There's no way back
from there to here

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Re: The Airline Industry

#6

Post by tencats »

Boeing 737 Max: new 'troubling communications' sent to regulators
Tue 24 Dec 2019 11.29 EST
https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... ations-faa
:snippity:

The release is likely to deepen the sense of crisis enveloping Boeing, which has taken more than $8bn in costs and lost more than 20% of its market value since the 737 variant was grounded in March following two crashes. Last week, the company said it would temporarily halt production of the troubled jet.

Forkner, meanwhile, has reportedly hired his own criminal defense lawyers and invoked his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination to avoid turning over records to the Department of Justice, which has opened a criminal inquiry into the company’s handling of the 737 Max’s development.

It was Forkner who requested that information about MCAS be omitted from flight manuals and pilot training, rendering the pilots of both the doomed Lion Air and Ethiopian flights helpless when the system kicked in, pushing the plane’s nose down repeatedly until they ultimately lost control.
:shock:

Remember reading about Boing's 737 chief test pilot Mark Forkner back in October in usatoday.com.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nat ... 024504002/
:snippity:
In the November 2016, message exchange, 737 chief test pilot Mark Forkner — Boeing describes him as a "former employee" — writes that MCAS is "running rampant in the sim on me," a reference to a flight simulator in which it was being tested at the time. "I am levelling off at like 4000 feet, 230 knots and the plane is trimming itself like crazy. I'm like, WHAT?" he said.

He quipped, "granted, I suck at flying, but even this was egregious."

Forkner said he "basically lied to the regulators (unknowingly)" based on the simulator experience though the co-worker is quick to counter, "it wasn't a lie, no one told us that was the case."

In a batch of emails that the FAA later sent, Forkner notes in a March 2016 missive to the FAA that mention of the MCAS system in flight crew operating manuals is unnecessary because MCAS is present in both of the plane's flight control computers, operates in a transparent way and was designed to kick in only in rare circumstances. Pilots have complained that the existence of the MCAS system was kept secret from them until after the Lion Air crash.

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Re: The Airline Industry

#7

Post by RTH10260 »

Boeing Employees Mocked F.A.A. and ‘Clowns’ Who Designed 737 Max
The company expressed regret at the embarrassing communications it sent to investigators on Thursday, which included a comment that “this airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys.”

By Natalie Kitroeff
Jan. 9, 2020

Boeing employees mocked federal rules, talked about deceiving regulators and joked about potential flaws in the 737 Max as it was being developed, according to over a hundred pages of internal messages delivered Thursday to congressional investigators.

“I still haven’t been forgiven by God for the covering up I did last year,” one of the employees said in messages from 2018, apparently in reference to interactions with the Federal Aviation Administration.

The most damaging messages included conversations among Boeing pilots and other employees about software issues and other problems with flight simulators for the Max, a plane later involved in two accidents, in late 2018 and early 2019, that killed 346 people and threw the company into chaos.

The employees appear to discuss instances in which the company concealed such problems from the F.A.A. during the regulator’s certification of the simulators, which were used in the development of the Max, as well as in training for pilots who had not previously flown a 737.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/busi ... sages.html

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Notorial Dissent
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Re: The Airline Industry

#8

Post by Notorial Dissent »

Can we say lawsuits lining up around the block and stock in free fall?????? A very unhappy insurance company and some very embarrassed FAA and engineering inspectors. Not a good start to the New Year after a really bad ending to the last one.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: The Airline Industry

#9

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer »

Some criminal charges would be nice too.
A 19th Amendment Centennial Moment:
The 19th Amendment was first introduced to Congress in 1878, yet it was not approved by Congress until 1919 – 41 years later.
- https://legaldictionary.net/19th-amendment/

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Notorial Dissent
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Re: The Airline Industry

#10

Post by Notorial Dissent »

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 9:46 am
Some criminal charges would be nice too.
From the sounds of it, are entirely in order.
The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

Panch Villlain

Re: The Airline Industry

#11

Post by Panch Villlain »

RTH10260 wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 6:25 am
Boeing Employees Mocked F.A.A. and ‘Clowns’ Who Designed 737 Max
The company expressed regret at the embarrassing communications it sent to investigators on Thursday, which included a comment that “this airplane is designed by clowns, who are in turn supervised by monkeys.”

By Natalie Kitroeff
Jan. 9, 2020

Boeing employees mocked federal rules, talked about deceiving regulators and joked about potential flaws in the 737 Max as it was being developed, according to over a hundred pages of internal messages delivered Thursday to congressional investigators.

“I still haven’t been forgiven by God for the covering up I did last year,” one of the employees said in messages from 2018, apparently in reference to interactions with the Federal Aviation Administration.

The most damaging messages included conversations among Boeing pilots and other employees about software issues and other problems with flight simulators for the Max, a plane later involved in two accidents, in late 2018 and early 2019, that killed 346 people and threw the company into chaos.

The employees appear to discuss instances in which the company concealed such problems from the F.A.A. during the regulator’s certification of the simulators, which were used in the development of the Max, as well as in training for pilots who had not previously flown a 737.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/busi ... sages.html
If there weren't 346 people who died in the two crashes we could call it a farce. For the personal injury lawyers involved this may be a BIC - best imaginable case. For Boeing and the insurers a nightmare that will not go away soon.

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Re: The Airline Industry

#12

Post by RTH10260 »

Juan Browne interprets the FCA interim report of last years crash of the Amazon delivery plane near Houston.

Pilot error strongly indicated.


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Re: The Airline Industry

#13

Post by RTH10260 »

Comments by a pilot on his Youtube channel about the Boeing 737NG family,


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Re: The Airline Industry

#14

Post by Sterngard Friegen »

Suranis, is that you???

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Re: The Airline Industry

#15

Post by RTH10260 »


Panch Villlain

Re: The Airline Industry

#16

Post by Panch Villlain »

Why you better not fly a 737 MAX


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Re: The Airline Industry

#17

Post by RTH10260 »

part 2 on the fuel dump incident


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Re: The Airline Industry

#18

Post by RTH10260 »

other opinion, also pilot


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Re: The Airline Industry

#19

Post by RTH10260 »

New Software Flaw Could Further Delay Boeing’s 737 Max
By Alan Levin and Mary Schlangenstein
January 17, 2020, 8:03 PM GMT+1 Updated on January 17, 2020, 10:23 PM GMT+1
Boeing says in statement it’s working with FAA on the issue
Software problem is latest to hit plane grounded since March


Boeing Co. has identified a new software flaw in the grounded 737 Max that will require additional work, possibly further delaying the plane’s return to service.

The company alerted the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration and is notifying customers and its suppliers, it said in an emailed statement. Boeing’s best-selling jet was grounded on March 13 after two fatal crashes involving a flight-control system.

The issue involves how software on the plane checks itself to ensure it’s receiving valid data, said a person familiar with the issue who wasn’t authorized to speak publicly about it. It occurs when the system is initially starting up, the person said.

“We are making necessary updates and working with the FAA on submission of this change, and keeping our customers and suppliers informed,” Boeing said in its statement. “Our highest priority is ensuring the 737 MAX is safe and meets all regulatory requirements before it returns to service.”



https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... 37-max-jet

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Re: The Airline Industry

#20

Post by Volkonski »

Reuters
@Reuters
·
36m
Boeing seeks to borrow $10 billion or more amid 737 Max crisis - CNBC https://reut.rs/2tEarC6
Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace

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Re: The Airline Industry

#21

Post by RTH10260 »

They need to fly on steam engines then impotus will pile coal money on them :twisted:

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Re: The Airline Industry

#22

Post by Sam the Centipede »

RTH10260 wrote:
Mon Jan 20, 2020 3:40 pm
They need to fly on steam engines then impotus will pile coal money on them :twisted:
:think: Tricky! — they'll need in-flight refueling for long flights. A large hatch in the fuselage roof will do the job: a cargo plane flies overhead and drops sacks of coal (labeled "Jet C") directly into the fuel bunker. Water isn't a problem either: fly low over a large lake and use a scoop. Problem solved! :thumbs:

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Re: The Airline Industry

#23

Post by RTH10260 »

Maiden flight of Boeing 777X


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Re: The Airline Industry

#24

Post by RTH10260 »

an opinion on Boeing


Panch Villlain

Re: The Airline Industry

#25

Post by Panch Villlain »

What's wrong with Boeing? Shareholder value über alles.

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