ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

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maydijo
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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1801

Post by maydijo » Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:51 am

I wouldn't go that far. IMO that makes light of one of the 20th century's most tragic histories. In Cambodia, everyone has a terrible story about Pol Pot. It's not uncommon to see people who were tortured and horribly disfigured by that regime. What happened in Cambodia is far worse than anything Trump has done or is likely to do. (And we would do well to remember the role the US played in creating that tragic history.)

However, Trump is increasingly behaving like a dictator in his unilateral decison-making. I am not sure America's system of checks and balances have ever been tested to this extent (but I'm not an historian and am happy to be corrected), and I'm not convinced they are robust enough to survive Trump.



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1802

Post by AndyinPA » Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:38 am

If we get out of this mess in more or less one piece, I think a sane legislature might want to take a look at some of the laws that are on the books as regards presidential power, for just a start. Ethics should be written more firmly into law rather than as just suggestion or precedent. It may not have seemed necessary before, but 45 proves it's needed. I've always had a problem with the idea of executive orders. I understand their use, but 45 makes it obvious they can be used to do really awful things, such as threaten the lives of millions of people with his "health care" plans.

I think that while they are at it, maybe they should look at the Supreme Court. They were meant to be an equal branch of government, but have become the final arbiters on everything. I understand the legislature can create legislation to overrule them, but that hasn't proven to work out very well.

I'd say we could use a constitutional convention, but with all the states in republican hands, that would only be a complete disaster. They are chomping at the bit to rewrite our constitution in their image (mainly with libertarian ideas). To them, the current constitution really is just a piece of paper, as it was to W.



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1803

Post by Slim Cognito » Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:51 am

So much to unpack here.
Untitled.png
Was going to put it in the tweets thread but this seemed more appropriate.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1804

Post by Volkonski » Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:07 am

Slim Cognito wrote:
Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:51 am
So much to unpack here. Untitled.png

Was going to put it in the tweets thread but this seemed more appropriate.
Hey, Trump! You could get defense contractors' stocks to fall by reducing defense spending. :-D


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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1805

Post by Chilidog » Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:31 am

Slim Cognito wrote:
Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:51 am
So much to unpack here. Untitled.png

Was going to put it in the tweets thread but this seemed more appropriate.
Hmmmm, if the insurance profit margin is fixed by law and 20%, and if the stock prices fell, that must mean that investor's see the profits falling. and if the profits fall, then the amount paid out in claims (80% of the premiums) must also be falling. but health costs are the same, so therefore, fewer people must be covered by insurance because the insurance companies have less money. . . .



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1806

Post by pipistrelle » Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:42 am




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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1807

Post by pipistrelle » Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:45 am




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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1808

Post by RTH10260 » Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:07 pm

GreatGrey wrote:
Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:44 am
Trump is starting to make Pol Pot look like a compassionate man.
:o :shock:



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1809

Post by Fortinbras » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:18 am

I'm not sure I understand. Trump evidently doesn't want health insurance companies to be prosperous -- he takes it as a bad sign that their stocks are in good shape, altho on other occasions he has claimed the credit when the stock market goes up. He has also undermined ACA several times by means of his own Exec Orders - such as eliminating the incentive for healthy young people to buy insurance, eliminating federal subsidies to insurance funds, eliminating various efforts to assist consumers in buying ACA-related insurance plans, etc. - and then announces that ACA is failing, as if it were its own fault and not his doing, and then claims that he could repair it if only he were asked.



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1810

Post by Sam the Centipede » Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:26 am

Fortinbras wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:18 am
I'm not sure I understand. :snippity:
That'll be because you're not an emotionally stunted, narcissistic, infantile, unintelligent, resentful, racist shitgibbon.

The time to worry is when you think "that's a sound policy from Trump and his team, I like what they're trying to do."



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Re: ACA/AHCA/Whatever the hell the next plan is called....

#1811

Post by pipistrelle » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:19 am

Volkonski wrote:
Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:07 am
Slim Cognito wrote:
Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:51 am
So much to unpack here. Untitled.png

Was going to put it in the tweets thread but this seemed more appropriate.
Hey, Trump! You could get defense contractors' stocks to fall by reducing defense spending. :-D
He's not trying to manipulate the market, is he?



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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1812

Post by Slim Cognito » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:27 am

Title changed again, hopefully for the last time.

Not sure if the GOP will try bringing up another replacement or if Trump will just XO it to death.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1813

Post by Addie » Tue Oct 17, 2017 1:34 pm

The Hill
Dems introduce public option for ObamaCare

Sens. Michael Bennet (D-Colo.) and Tim Kaine (D-Va.) on Tuesday introduced a bill to add a government-run “public option” plan to ObamaCare, modeled on Medicare.

The plan, part of a long-running debate in the Democratic Party about how far to go in expanding government-run health insurance, would move ObamaCare to the left but does not go as far as Sen. Bernie Sanders's (I-Vt.) Medicare for all plan.

Instead of scrapping ObamaCare and extending Medicare to everyone, as Sanders’s plan does, the Bennet and Kaine bill would provide an option modelled on Medicare as a choice alongside private plans offered through the existing ObamaCare system.

“We don’t blow up the existing system,” Kaine told reporters. “We maintain the system.”

But the senators said the public option is needed to increase competition on the ObamaCare marketplaces, acknowledging that right now there is a problem on the law’s exchanges where many rural counties only have one insurance option, and some are at risk of having none at all.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1814

Post by Addie » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:57 pm

ABC News
Senators reach deal to continue Obamacare insurance subsidy payments

Less than a week after President Donald Trump signed an executive order to halt government payments that subsidize insurance plans for low-income Americans, Senate leaders agreed "in principle" to a bill that would cover the payments for two years.

Sen. Lamar Alexander, R-Tenn., the chairman of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions committee announced Tuesday that he reached an agreement with Sen. Patty Murray, D-Wash., the committee's ranking member. The senators each made brief presentations on the deal at lunches with their respective parties.

According to one source with knowledge of the bill, the agreement contains $160 million to restore outreach and enrollment funding for the Affordable Care Act.

This is a developing story. Please check back for updates.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1815

Post by Chilidog » Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:15 pm

It still has to go through the the house, right?

Then Trump has to sign it, right?

I'm not holding my breath



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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1816

Post by Slim Cognito » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:00 pm

Chilidog wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:15 pm
It still has to go through the the house, right?

Then Trump has to sign it, right?

I'm not holding my breath
Haven't seen a tweet from Trump (yet) but the twitter machine says he supports it. Two days ago he was bragging that he tanked the insurance industry's stocks because the CSRs were bailouts. Of course, one would have to assume Trump actually understands any of this and we all know he doesn't. He just wants to say he won one.

And I agree about the House. That's going to be an uphill battle.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1817

Post by ZekeB » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:28 pm

He will sign it. This allows him to claim that HE saved Obamacare.


He will fail to mention that he destroyed it first.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1818

Post by Jim » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:32 pm

ZekeB wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:28 pm
He will sign it. This allows him to claim that HE saved Obamacare.
There goes his last supporters who hate anything done by the scary black man.



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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1819

Post by ZekeB » Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:36 pm

Jim wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:32 pm
There goes his last supporters who hate anything done by the scary black man.
The orange man gibbon is a hell of a lot scarier.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1820

Post by MsDaisy » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:16 pm

ZekeB wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:36 pm
Jim wrote:
Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:32 pm
There goes his last supporters who hate anything done by the scary black man.
The orange man gibbon is a hell of a lot scarier.
► Show Spoiler


Birfers are toast

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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1821

Post by Addie » Wed Oct 18, 2017 11:03 am

WaPo
Another last-ditch effort to tackle Obamacare stalls within hours of its release

Yet another last-ditch effort to tackle the nation’s health-care system stalled within hours of its release by a bipartisan pair of senators Tuesday, with President Trump sending mixed signals and Republicans either declining to endorse the proposal or outright opposing it.

The week began on Capitol Hill with a renewed sense of urgency to craft legislation following Trump’s decision last week to end key payments to health insurers that help millions of lower-income Americans afford coverage but that the president argued were illegal under the Affordable Care Act.

The compromise offered by Sens. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.) and Patty Murray (D-Wash.) on Tuesday proposes authorizing those payments for two years in exchange for granting states greater flexibility to regulate health coverage under the ACA. Those payments help offset deductibles and other out-of-pocket costs for low-income consumers who obtain insurance through the law; critics of Trump’s decision said eliminating the subsidies would cause insurers to back out of marketplaces across the country.

The measure presented congressional Republicans with an uncomfortable choice between helping sustain coverage for many Americans and making good on a long-standing campaign promise — and paying the consequences — by allowing the ACA to falter.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1822

Post by RoadScholar » Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:46 pm

GOP Lawmaker Says Emergency Rooms
Should Be Able To Turn People Away


https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/di ... mg00000009

Nice. Let the uninsured die in the streets.

Yes, boy howdy, that's the way to make America seem Great Again. You betcha. :evil:


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1823

Post by Slim Cognito » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:21 pm

Maybe should have gone in the tweets thread, but....
Untitled.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1824

Post by vic » Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:40 pm

RoadScholar wrote:
Wed Oct 18, 2017 1:46 pm
GOP Lawmaker Says Emergency Rooms
Should Be Able To Turn People Away


https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/di ... mg00000009

Nice. Let the uninsured die in the streets.

Yes, boy howdy, that's the way to make America seem Great Again. You betcha. :evil:
But... but... but... wasn't the GOP's argument that denying people health insurance doesn't kill anyone, because they can always go to the emergency room?



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Re: ACA Sabotage/Trumpcare ....

#1825

Post by Addie » Sun Oct 22, 2017 11:00 am

The Hill
GOP redoubles efforts to end ObamaCare mandate

The GOP is redoubling its efforts to eliminate ObamaCare’s individual mandate, a step that would be yet another blow to the health care law.

They are doing so even as key Senate Republicans seek a bipartisan deal that could strengthen the law by extending critical payments to insurers that help low-income people afford their copays and deductibles.

The requirement that everyone buy insurance or pay a penalty is a bedrock principle of the health law, and following the failure of the Senate to repeal ObamaCare in its entirety, the mandate has become a fresh target for conservatives.

The White House this week said the bipartisan bill negotiated between Sens. Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.) and Patty Murray (D-Wash.) must repeal the individual mandate before President Trump would support it.


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