Gun Control Legislation

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mimi
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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#751

Post by mimi » Tue Oct 20, 2015 6:10 pm

Everything I read said the decision wouldn't mean much.

As much as I'd like to see some action, methinks Amurican Stinker is just fear-mongering.



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Fortinbras
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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#752

Post by Fortinbras » Wed Oct 21, 2015 2:19 am

Some of the gun massacres involved weapons that were, in some way, stolen from their rightful owners. In the Sandy Hook case, the shooter killed his own mother, who was legitimate owner of the guns he used.

For at least four years there has been available technology that would tend to prevent such gun thefts from endangering the public. Armatrix, a European manufacturer, turned out a high-quality handgun that would not function unless the person holding it also was wearing a special wristwatch.
I can think of several gun tragedies that such technology would have prevented (including the notoriously common "child finds a gun in the home").
It would seem that having such a safety feature would actually encourage people to buy such guns because they would feel that the gun is so much safer than the saturday night special they have hidden in the drawer.

But the NRA won't stand for it! Notwithstanding its pretence to favor innovations that make guns safer, the NRA not only cursed smart guns but actually encouraged people to buy stupid guns.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/5/5/568350 ... -guns-away
and
http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/05/09 ... sto/199235

Makes me wonder how those NRA people sleep at night.
I might add that there have been a number of newspaper articles indicating that lots of gun owners feel comfortable with legislation that would keep guns out of the hands of some people, and with preventative technology like smart guns, but the NRA ignores their feelings and outshouts them in the public media.



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#753

Post by SueDB » Sat Oct 24, 2015 12:06 pm

A reason for GC Legislation....

Man has TEN Thousands Gunzzzz - gets arrested...

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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#754

Post by ZekeB » Sat Oct 24, 2015 12:20 pm

I like the idea. If he has 10,000 guns that means there are 9,999 others who don't have one.


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Fortinbras
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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#755

Post by Fortinbras » Sat Oct 24, 2015 9:56 pm

At one and the same time (1) TOO MANY people have access to guns, and (2) TOO FEW people have access to the voting booth.

I have an idea: A law that says that registering to vote requires EXACTLY THE SAME documentation as buying a gun or ammunition. Exactly the same.

So if a State has made buying guns ridiculously easy, then it must make registering to vote also ridiculously easy.

Or, if a State still wants to make it tough to vote (- and why? already half the eligible adults don't bother to vote), then it must also make it tough to get a gun or ammo.



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#756

Post by Kriselda Gray » Sun Oct 25, 2015 2:31 am

Fortinbras wrote:At one and the same time (1) TOO MANY people have access to guns, and (2) TOO FEW people have access to the voting booth.

I have an idea: A law that says that registering to vote requires EXACTLY THE SAME documentation as buying a gun or ammunition. Exactly the same.

So if a State has made buying guns ridiculously easy, then it must make registering to vote also ridiculously easy.

Or, if a State still wants to make it tough to vote (- and why? already half the eligible adults don't bother to vote), then it must also make it tough to get a gun or ammo.

Of course, the obvious problem with this kind of scenario is that any state that would want to make it easy to vote and hard to get guns – which, IMHO, is how it SHOULD be – wouldn't be able to do that.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#757

Post by Whatever4 » Sun Oct 25, 2015 4:18 am

Kriselda Gray wrote:

Of course, the obvious problem with this kind of scenario is that any state that would want to make it easy to vote and hard to get guns – which, IMHO, is how it SHOULD be – wouldn't be able to do that.
Welcome to Massachusetts.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#758

Post by RTH10260 » Sun Oct 25, 2015 5:08 pm

Firearms Amnesty 1968
Firearms handed in under amnesty, Scotland Yard, London.

[bbvideo=560,315][/bbvideo]



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#759

Post by RTH10260 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:40 pm

Matches best here:
Maryland scraps gun "fingerprint" database after 15 failed years

The Maryland State Police have stopped collecting shells casing from new firearms as they cease a first-of-a-kind "ballistic fingerprinting" endeavor. Now they are deciding what to do with the 340,000 shells they have currently stashed in the basement of their headquarters in Pikesville.

Erin Cox The Baltimore Sun

Maryland spent millions on a gun database that solved no crimes. Millions of dollars later, Maryland has officially decided that its 15-year effort to store and catalog the "fingerprints" of thousands of handguns was a failure.

Since 2000, the state required that gun manufacturers fire every handgun to be sold here and send the spent bullet casing to authorities. The idea was to build a database of "ballistic fingerprints" to help solve future crimes.

But the system — plagued by technological problems — never solved a single case. Now the hundreds of thousands of accumulated casings could be sold for scrap.

"Obviously, I'm disappointed," said former Gov. Parris N. Glendening, a Democrat whose administration pushed for the database to fulfill a campaign promise. "It's a little unfortunate, in that logic and common sense suggest that it would be a good crime-fighting tool."

The database "was a waste," said Frank Sloane, owner of Pasadena Gun & Pawn in Anne Arundel County. "There's things that they could have done that would have made sense. This didn't make any sense."

In a old fallout shelter beneath Maryland State Police headquarters in Pikesville, the state has amassed more than 300,000 bullet casings, one from each new handgun sold here since the law took effect. They fill three cavernous rooms secured by a common combination lock.

Each casing was meticulously stamped with a bar code, sealed in its own envelope and filed in boxes stacked from floor to ceiling. Forensic scientists photographed the casings in hopes the system would someday identify the owner of a gun fired at a crime scene. The system cost an estimated $5 million to set up and operate over the years.

But the computerized system designed to sort and match the images never worked as envisioned. In 2007, the state stopped bothering to take the photographs, though hundreds of thousands more casings kept piling up in the fallout shelter.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryla ... story.html



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#760

Post by esseff44 » Sun Nov 08, 2015 10:58 pm

So the program was a failure because they couldn't come up with a computer program or system that would be able to make matches. Something doesn't sound right with that excuse. It seems to me if that had a few trained humans, they would be able to make matches without too much of a problem.

I guess real life is not like CIS, Bones and all those shows where the computer whizzes on every team can cross check everything and pinpoint just about every thing that has any kind of digital foot print. This is why Big Brother scenarios are a bit less scary. The level of upkeep for tracking systems and storing information is just too expensive and unreliable.



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#761

Post by RTH10260 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 3:38 pm

Iowa lawmakers pass the state’s most expansive gun rights bill ever
By Kristine Phillips April 12 at 9:00 AM

With one stroke of a pen, Gov. Terry Branstad is poised to make Iowa one of the friendliest states for gun owners.

Lawmakers have passed a bill that many say is the most comprehensive and broadest piece of legislation on gun rights the state has seen. The legislation would, among other things, allow citizens to use deadly force if they believe their lives are threatened and to sue local government officials if they think gun-free zones have violated their Second Amendment rights.

Branstad, the long-serving Republican governor whom President Trump selected to be the ambassador to China, has hinted that he’s inclined to sign the bill, calling it “reasonable” legislation that he “could support.” House File 517 reached the governor’s desk this week.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/pos ... bill-ever/



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#762

Post by Addie » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:59 am

SFGate
Ex-military brass seek tougher gun controls

Sixteen of the nation’s top retired military commanders are urging Congress to pass gun control legislation, arguing that there are many steps that can be taken to curb gun deaths that do not violate the Second Amendment.

In a letter they plan to send to congressional leaders, the retired commanders, including Army Gens. Wesley Clark and Michael Hayden, Navy Admiral Eric Olson, Air Force Lt. Gen. Norman Seip and Marine Brig. Gen. Stephen Cheney, argue that Congress is “no longer speaking or voting for the majority of Americans, including gun owners” when it comes to the issue of firearms.

“There is no acceptable excuse for our elected leaders to avoid addressing this as a national crisis,” they write.

The group is part of the veterans coalition of a gun control group founded by former Rep. Gabrielle Giffords and her husband, Mark Kelly. ...

The letter comes as a House panel last week voted to advance a measure that would expand the ability to carry concealed firearms across state lines. Under the bill, known as concealed carry reciprocity, a person with a concealed-carry permit and a photo identification would be able to have a concealed weapon in any state that allows them. The gun owner would still have to follow state and local laws regarding where and what type of weapons can be carried. The National Rifle Association has called the bill its “highest legislative priority in Congress.”

The legislation is scheduled for a House vote this week. Its sponsor, Richard Hudson, R-N.C., said the bill is extremely popular and “momentum, common sense, and the facts are on our side.”


¡Qué vergüenza!

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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#763

Post by Tiredretiredlawyer » Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:12 pm

http://wwlp.com/2018/01/03/new-stricter ... ssion=true
New state-wide gun laws will go into effect in California

Beginning Jan. 1, criminals must give up their guns when they are convicted of a serious crime.

Gun dealers will need to get a certificate of eligibility from the California Department of Justice to verify they passed a background check.

And online ammunition purchases will be shipped to a licensed vendor for transactions, meaning they will no longer ship to a buyer’s home.

The new laws are provisions of Proposition 63, which was passed by voters last year.

(Complete list of laws at link.)


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#764

Post by Addie » Sat Jan 27, 2018 8:10 am

NJ.com
Murphy reverses Christie's move to let more people carry guns in N.J.

Gov. Phil Murphy announced Friday he's reversing a policy his predecessor, Chris Christie, put in place making it easier for New Jerseyans to obtain a permit to carry a handgun.

"New Jersey cannot and must not become part of the race to the bottom that we're seeing across the country," Murphy, a Democrat, said during a news conference at the YMCA in Trenton. "There are already too many guns in our streets, and simply adding more to the equation will not make us or our communities any safer."

Christie, a Republican, moved in 2016 to loosen the rules determining who can carry a concealed handgun in New Jersey, a state with some of the toughest gun laws in the country.

Originally, the regulations said residents must show a "justifiable need" to carry a firearm because they had been the target of "specific threats" or attacks.

But Christie's administration lowered the bar to allow a chief of police or the State Police superintendent to consider permits for residents who can show evidence of "serious threats" against them.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#765

Post by Judge Roy Bean » Sun Feb 11, 2018 1:31 pm

Tiredretiredlawyer wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:12 pm
:snippity:
New state-wide gun laws will go into effect in California

Beginning Jan. 1, criminals must give up their guns when they are convicted of a serious crime.

Gun dealers will need to get a certificate of eligibility from the California Department of Justice to verify they passed a background check.
:snippity:
Number one seems to be a reasonable idea - but in practice, I find it hard to imagine a prisoner admitting to having any firearms to "give up." And post-incarceration, most supervised release orders I've seen include being prohibited from acquiring or carrying a weapon. Then there's the problem of whether or not the convict will comply at all - does the phrase "hey, hold the 9mm's for me 'til I get out" come to mind?

Background checks can and will save lives. But there are significant problems with them, not the least of which is who gets on a list and how.

How do we go about getting whackos on some kind of list that will keep them from being able to live out their death fantasies and kill tens or dozens of people at a time?

What should we look for other than a young man in a YouTube video holding guns and shouting, “Death to infidels?”

Well, I’d suggest we start by keeping an eye on meticulously-dressed school board treasurers who have chronically-ill wives and whose farms are in foreclosure. Perhaps that would help us identify a person similar to the one responsible for the worst school mass-murder in US history – Andrew Kehoe. On May 18, 1927, Kehoe killed himself and 44 people and injured at least 58, most of them children attending the Bath Consolidated School in Bath Township, Michigan.

We should also keep an eye out for an unemployed veteran who lives with his mother and attends daily church services but has difficulty getting along with his teenage neighbors who make fun of his alleged homosexuality. Howard Unruh went on a walk through his Camden, New Jersey neighborhood in September of 1949, killing 13 people and injuring 3 more. After his trial, he was declared legally insane and died in custody in 2009.

Let’s not forget security guards who have trouble with their wives. In addition to the recent Orlando shooting, another of the worst mass-murders involved a recently-fired security guard, James Huberty. In July of 1984 he walked into a McDonalds down the street from his apartment in San Diego and killed 21 people. 19 more were injured and Huberty was finally killed by a SWAT sniper.

And how many unemployed merchant mariners who were fired for minor drug problems and have trouble with women in his life are out there? In October of 1991, George Hennard drove his pickup into a Luby’s Cafeteria in Killeen then shot and killed 27 people and wounded 23 more before being wounded by police and taking his own life.

A “no firearms purchase list” would be irrelevant in cases like those; Kehoe used explosives and Unruh used a single handgun he brought back from his tour of duty in WWII. Huberty, believing in a coming socio-economic collapse, had collected his arsenal over a considerable period of time. Hennard’s two semi-automatic handguns were purchased approximately 6 months before his rampage.

And this phenomenon isn’t unique to the US.

In Great Britain, taxi-driver Michael Robert Ryan went on a random-shooting rampage in August of 1987, killing 16 including his mother. 15 others were injured in what is known as the “Hungerford massacre.”

In June of 2010, Derrick Bird killed 12 people including his twin brother and wounded 11 others before killing himself.

In France, in September of 1995, 17 year-old Eric Borel murdered three members of his family and proceeded to shoot 16 more people the next day, killing 12 of them. He then killed himself.

Ryan used a handgun and two semi-automatic rifles that he had licenses for and largely as a result of his act England outlawed the possession of semi-automatic weapons shortly thereafter. But that didn’t stop Bird who used a shotgun and a .22 caliber rifle. Borel used just a .22 rifle.

What legislation can be crafted to protect us from people like these?



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#766

Post by Suranis » Sun Feb 11, 2018 1:47 pm

Thise are nice international cases. Unfortunatly, there is a mass shooting in America prety much every day, so what egislation can be crafted to protect Americans from 340 odd Americans every year.

That kind of overrides your list of hard cases.

Mass shooting, by the way, is defined by 4 or more people injured.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng- ... n-violence
1,516 mass shootings in 1,735 days: America's gun crisis – in one chart

The attack at a country music festival in Las Vegas that left at least 58 people dead is the deadliest mass shooting in modern US history – but there were six other mass shootings in America this past week alone.

No other developed nation comes close to the rate of gun violence in America. Americans own an estimated 265m guns, more than one gun for every adult.

Data compiled by the Gun Violence Archive reveals a shocking human toll: there is a mass shooting – defined as four or more people shot in one incident, not including the shooter – every nine out of 10 days on average.
So, shove your list of bullshit up your arse. Oh and Chicago is nowhere near the most violent city in America either. And if you really want me to show the correlation of gun control states with Drops in gun violence, I will, because others have done the studies that the GOP made illegal for the government to do


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#767

Post by Judge Roy Bean » Sun Feb 11, 2018 1:57 pm

A perfect non-answer to the question, "What legislation can be crafted to protect us from people like these?"

And please point out which of the events on the list are "bullshit?"



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#768

Post by Suranis » Sun Feb 11, 2018 3:53 pm

Your list is obviously bullshit becasue the USA has more mass shootings than that list over the course of a fortnight. So your jock itch free gun laws laws aren't doing jack to protect the US hof A, while the rate of Mass shootings in the countries you cite is astronomically less than the Hugh Strokes with Ammo.

That means you are pointing out a supermodel for being fat and crying about how you can protect ourselves from obesity while being a 600 pound porn addict shoving cheeseburgers down your gullet.

But hey if you want to blubber about what laws can protect you, why dont we look at the effect the gun control laws have made in Gods chosen country of FREEEEEEESOMMMMM

Oh yeah, when violent crime goes down it does down less in states with more permissive gun laws, and in general the states with stronger gun control laws have less gun violence.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ce/531297/

http://www.scarymommy.com/strict-gun-la ... ath-rates/

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/do ... caf1a3e838

https://www.safehome.org/resources/gun-laws-and-deaths/

So go stroke your gun on your bed till you discharge.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#769

Post by Foggy » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:34 pm

Hay nao, go easy on him, Suranis. He's a victim of propaganda. :violin:


... and how does that make you feel?
What is it you are trying to say?
:think:

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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#770

Post by maydijo » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:47 pm

At this point, with the preponderance of evidence which supports the role of gun control is preventing gun violence, only an apologist for the NRA could argue that gun control is unnecessary or ineffective.

Will gun violence still happen, even with gun control? Of course. Does that negate the effectiveness of gun control? No more than the fact that no vaccine is 100% effective negates the effectiveness of vaccination.



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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#771

Post by Dan1100 » Sun Feb 11, 2018 4:55 pm

Some people ignore the speed limits, so we all should just drive as fast as we want.

Teenagers get booze and drive drunk all the time. Let's get rid of the drinking age and DWI laws.

Drunks lose their driver's licenses and still drive, so we should stop revoking their licenses.

Etc etc.

A stupid argument. Criminals do X, so X shouldn't be a crime.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#772

Post by Mikedunford » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:03 pm

Judge Roy Bean wrote:
Sun Feb 11, 2018 1:57 pm
A perfect non-answer to the question, "What legislation can be crafted to protect us from people like these?"
Define 'protect.'

Technically, there is no law - as Dan pointed out - which provides absolute protection from anything. People break laws. Always have, always will. So the question is not really whether a law can provide absolute prevention. It's whether a law can reach a reasonable balance between providing additional protection from crime (whether through making it harder for a criminal to obtain supplies or through disincentives for committing the crime) and creating unreasonable restrictions on personal liberty.

When it comes to weapons, as many nations elsewhere in the world have shown, restricting access to firearms has a large impact on firearms related deaths. This does not mean that all deaths are prevented, or that deaths that might be caused by firearms here don't have other causes elsewhere. (As UK commuters who have to deal with disruptions "due to emergency services dealing with an incident" can attest.) But there are substantial decreases in both firearms-related deaths as a whole and multiple-casualty events in particular.

Right now, there are a number of firearms on the market which are of limited use for hunting or personal protection, but which are exceptionally good at killing large numbers of people in short periods of time. Restrictions in this area would seem to make sense - in a sane world.


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#773

Post by Suranis » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:20 pm

Besides, despite what the Ammosexuals think and what the NRA pushes, gun laws do not mean banning guns completely. There is no country in the world that 100% bans guns. If you want guns, all it means is that you have to jump through some hoops to get them.

And the right to home defense is a valid law even here in Ireland, and Ireland has some of the toughest gun laws in the world. There was a case a few years ago where a guy shot a home invader with a shotgun and got off becasue of that.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/f ... 49708.html

And sorry fogster. I just have lost all respect for people who sneer at others while defending guns in America. I'll be good. :blink:


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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#774

Post by Volkonski » Sun Feb 11, 2018 8:49 pm

Image


Image“If everyone fought for their own convictions there would be no war.”
― Leo Tolstoy, War and Peace

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Re: Gun Control Legislation

#775

Post by Foggy » Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:23 am

But ... but ... but ... but those are FACTS!

NO FAIR!! :fingerwag:


... and how does that make you feel?
What is it you are trying to say?
:think:

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