As much as I would like to see Trump thrown out of office, I am not in favor of impeachment at this time.fierceredpanda wrote: ↑Thu Apr 25, 2019 8:54 am
In sum, my position is that Democrats should be telling people what they are for, not why they are against Trump. Trump isn't an outsider anymore. He is the President. That means his ranting about how "they" are to blame for everything will ring much more hollow with voters this time around as long as Democrats don't give him ammunition by proving him right when he says that "they" hate him so much that they just want him out of office no matter what.
It's just a reality that you're never going to get 67 votes in the Senate. The Framers of the Constitution never imagined that partisanship would get that far. So what is the point of pursuing a trial when the outcome is a fait accompli? Hell, there's a lot of legal scholarship suggesting that Mitch McConnell (who never misses an opportunity to take a wrecking ball to our institutions) could simply refuse to hear the case if the House impeaches, or grant a motion to dismiss the impeachment at the outset of proceedings.
Winning elections isn't about "sending a message." It's about getting to 270. If nothing else, consider this: I live in Wisconsin. Trump is vulnerable here statewide, but he's coming to my town this weekend, and the #MAGA types are already getting excited. If you want to drive Republican turnout through the roof here and make it a lot harder for the Democrats to win Wisconsin - which is an absolute must-win if they want to take back the White House - impeaching Trump would be a very good way to do that. Republicans here want to argue about Trump's constant damaging of institutions. They view it as him trolling and owning the libs. They don't want to talk about how he has no plan for health care, his tax bill was a hot mess that screwed most Americans, and the DHS is kidnapping children.
If you attack the king, you had better strike a fatal blow right off the bat. That isn't going to happen. The republicans are absolutely not going to convict him in the Senate.
A failed impeachment would, IMHO, be worse than no impeachment at all. If impeachment fails, the right wing will trumpet it as a resounding success and virtually guarantee Trump's re-election. That must be avoided.
A successful impeachment would give us President Pence. That might be even worse than a Trump presidency. Unlike Trump, Pence has some understanding of how our government works and how to get things done. One saving grace of the Trump era is that he is so ignorant and disdainful of the way government works, that he hasn't been able to get all of his agenda accomplished. Pence might be more successful.
Even if the democrats decided today to impeach Trump, an impeachment trial would not happen before next summer. A failure would happen just a few months before the election, which would be disastrous for the dems.
The dems should continue their investigations, exposing Trump's taxes (I suspect he pays very little. I also suspect that he is no where near being a billionaire), exposing his conflicts of interest, his ties to Russia, etc.
But they should also be emphasizing what they are FOR. Simply running and saying "I'm not Trump" will not cut it. It won't motivate the democratic voters to come out and it won't win over any independent voters. They must have a positive program that resonates with the middle class and young voters.