James Comey

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Chilidog
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Re: James Comey

#251

Post by Chilidog » Fri May 12, 2017 6:03 pm

AndyinPA wrote:Obama should have fired him, but I knew he wouldn't and there were probably good reasons at that time not to. Even before the "leak" about the "new" emails, he should have been in more than a little trouble for the way he went off on Hillary after he said there would be no charges. That was also out of bounds. I'm not finding much sympathy for him either. For someone who seems to have prized his reputation so much, he really blew it twice last year big time. He's going to have to do a lot to make up for that. He might have the chance now that he's a private citizen, but I doubt much will change.

Speaking of the "leaked letter", there is a rumor that Chaffetz was the leaker, and that in return, he received a $10 million campaign contribution from Trump's Russian friends.



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Re: James Comey

#252

Post by Reality Check » Fri May 12, 2017 6:14 pm

Chilidog wrote: Speaking of the "leaked letter", there is a rumor that Chaffetz was the leaker, and that in return, he received a $10 million campaign contribution from Trump's Russian friends.
I never knew there was any doubt. He posted it as soon as the committee received it.


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: James Comey

#253

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 6:42 pm

AS I said earlier, I think Comey should have been fired before the election for improper unprofessional and inappropriate behavior. He was showboating, and it ultimately got him to exactly where he is at the moment. I think his firing was long justified, I just think the actual reasons and timing of it were not. He was perfectly acceptable to Teh Donald as long as he was trashing his enemies, but he got too close, or appeared to get too close, to Teh Donald and wasn't a proper lap dog. It remains to be seen if Comey did anything illegal, but he certainly was anything but impartial and ethical.


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Re: James Comey

#254

Post by RoadScholar » Fri May 12, 2017 6:51 pm

On the other hand, he did refuse to charge HRC for the email nothingburger like the more rabid Rs in Congress wanted him to, and refused to validate Trump's Russia-ties reality distortion attempt. Which only meant that his last shred of honorable neutrality ended up costing him his job, but still.


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Notorial Dissent
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Re: James Comey

#255

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 6:59 pm

Despite his grandstanding, I think he also knew that he didn't have a snowflake's chance of making any of his pretend charges stick and knew better than to try. I also suspect that the AG told him so in no uncertain terms. You can make all the noise you want, but judges ultimately tend to frown on charges with no basis in reality.


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RVInit
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Re: James Comey

#256

Post by RVInit » Fri May 12, 2017 6:59 pm

I believe Comey hated Clinton to the point he didn't care that it meant Trump became President. That is something that could have been fixed, and he was probably well on his way to doing that.


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Re: James Comey

#257

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Fri May 12, 2017 7:26 pm

Comey deserves to be in the dustbin of history. The fact that it was Trump starting Comey on that path just means it was a hell of a billiard shot. Comey was a disgrace to his office. An office previously disgraced by J. Edgar Hoover, and crippled by the stupidity of Louis Freeh. So there is plenty of precedent.



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Re: James Comey

#258

Post by Gregg » Fri May 12, 2017 7:29 pm

Am I alone in thinking that Comey was just a well meaning bungler? I truly believe he struggled with all of his admittedly bad decisions, and paid the price in the court of public opinion for violating what should be any cops prime directive : "Learn to say 'No Comment' and mean it".

I really see him as basically apolitical, he wasn't trying to hurt or help anyone except himself and his own reputation. That's just the way I see it.

I still say the way Trump should have handled it was to wait until the DOJ Inspector General report issued and then ask him for his resignation. Nice, tidy, one day on the headlines and fade to black. Trump's ego and insecurity are the only thing that turned this into the complete dumpster fire it is.


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Re: James Comey

#259

Post by SLQ » Fri May 12, 2017 7:51 pm

Gregg, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, Comey was in a difficult place: Republicans were out for blood, calling him in for a hearing. On the other hand, he could have said almost nothing, and said he could provide the information in a closed hearing, as he did in the most recent round, and as Sally Yates did so competently. So I dunno. He was in a pickle. But I do believe his disparate responses indicate he responded politcally, in favor of Trump, and at Clinton's expense.



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Re: James Comey

#260

Post by boots » Fri May 12, 2017 7:51 pm

I think that Comey was just doing what he thought, at the time, under whatever pressure he was under, was his ethical duty. I don't think he had an axe to grind as far as animus towards Clinton. But I do think it was perhaps one of the more disastrous well-intentioned mistakes in human history. Perhaps not quite on par with George W's belief that God wanted him to invade Iraq. But pretty far up the list.



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Re: James Comey

#261

Post by Lani » Fri May 12, 2017 7:54 pm

Gregg wrote:Am I alone in thinking that Comey was just a well meaning bungler? I truly believe he struggled with all of his admittedly bad decisions, and paid the price in the court of public opinion for violating what should be any cops prime directive : "Learn to say 'No Comment' and mean it".

I really see him as basically apolitical, he wasn't trying to hurt or help anyone except himself and his own reputation. That's just the way I see it.
:snippity:
I wondered about that for time, too. However, nope, he handed Trump the presidency. In turn, Trump fired him.
People familiar with the matter told me that the Obama administration had wanted to respond in a more direct way, through an official finding. That came on Oct. 7, through a statement about Russian hacking from the secretary of Homeland Security and the director of National Intelligence. Comey declined to be included on the statement, telling administration officials that he believed it was too close to the election.
(Article on preceding page.)

Three weeks later, with early voting underway, Comey is not troubled about it being too close to the election to release information about Clinton.


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Re: James Comey

#262

Post by SLQ » Fri May 12, 2017 8:10 pm

Here's some information about the potential recording:
But it's the court cases and laws stemming from Nixon's secret recordings that could send Trump's tweet backfiring.

That's because Congress in 1974 passed the Presidential Recordings and Materials Preservation Act that designated tapes like those Nixon recorded as presidential records that must be preserved in federal archives.

"If Trump installed a taping system ... those are federal records thanks to Nixon's court challenges," said Timothy Naftali, a presidential historian and Nixon expert.

That means it's illegal to destroy presidential recordings and they could by subpoenaed by, say, Congress -- which is part of the reason why no president since Nixon has installed recording devices in the Oval Office.
I note that this conflicts with the information upthread about the transcript provided to a reporter after a meeting with President Obama. However, to the extent they exist, if I had to guess, I'd say that every recording under the Obama administration has been preserved. Not so much with Trump.

More at the link: http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/12/politics/ ... index.html



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Re: James Comey

#263

Post by Sterngard Friegen » Fri May 12, 2017 8:14 pm

It was not Comey's place to lecture anyone, especially not a political candidate for being his boss. It was not Comey's place to reveal facts concerning an ongoing investigation. He knew better. He wasn't doing his ethical duty. He was grandstanding. He deserved to be fired. And he deserves all of the condemnation the American public can heap on him.

I hope history is not kind to him. And I don't mind if he takes down Trump, either. He built Trump up so it's karma.



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Re: James Comey

#264

Post by SLQ » Fri May 12, 2017 8:16 pm

Sterngard Friegen wrote:It was not Comey's place to lecture anyone, especially not a political candidate for being his boss. It was not Comey's place to reveal facts concerning an ongoing investigation. He knew better. He wasn't doing his ethical duty. He was grandstanding. He deserved to be fired. And he deserves all of the condemnation the American public can heap on him.

I hope history is not kind to him. And I don't mind if he takes down Trump, either. He built Trump up so it's karma.
:yeah:



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Re: James Comey

#265

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 8:20 pm

SLQ wrote:
Sterngard Friegen wrote:It was not Comey's place to lecture anyone, especially not a political candidate for being his boss. It was not Comey's place to reveal facts concerning an ongoing investigation. He knew better. He wasn't doing his ethical duty. He was grandstanding. He deserved to be fired. And he deserves all of the condemnation the American public can heap on him.

I hope history is not kind to him. And I don't mind if he takes down Trump, either. He built Trump up so it's karma.
:yeah:
:yeah: too, also!!!!!


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Re: James Comey

#266

Post by SLQ » Fri May 12, 2017 8:22 pm

Regarding the possible recordings:
“James Comey better hope that there are no ‘tapes’ of our conversations before he starts leaking to the press!” Mr. Trump wrote on Twitter.

Mr. Trump appeared to be referring to a report in The New York Times that Mr. Comey had declined to pledge his loyalty during a dinner at the White House earlier this year, an account the president denied. Asked directly about whether there were tapes of his conversations, Mr. Trump refused to say.

“That I can’t talk about. I won’t talk about it,” the president told Fox News. “All I want is for Comey to be honest.”
Oh. So this morning he can tweet the threat of the tapes, but later in the day, he can't and won't talk about it. Who rushed into Donny's office to mete out the punishment?

More at the link: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/us/p ... .html?_r=0



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Re: James Comey

#267

Post by Slartibartfast » Fri May 12, 2017 8:29 pm

Gregg,

I'd like to hear Comey's side of it. I haven't heard an explanation of his actions that I've found fully satisfying yet, but the facts of the matter don't speak well of him. I agree with Stern that the situation that he's in now is just his karma, which he can hopefully redeem by being a part of bringing Trump down. I'll withhold judgement on Comey until things unfold, but I suspect the judgement of history wont be kind. I think we'll understand a lot better after we see what Comey does next.


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Re: James Comey

#268

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 8:45 pm

It is now being reported that Comey is now refusing to testify before the Senate. This just gets better and better.


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Chilidog
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Re: James Comey

#269

Post by Chilidog » Fri May 12, 2017 8:49 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:It is now being reported that Comey is now refusing to testify before the Senate. This just gets better and better.
I suspect that he is waiting for a subpoena to give himself some legal cover.



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Re: James Comey

#270

Post by Sam the Centipede » Fri May 12, 2017 9:28 pm

RVInit wrote::yeah:

I think it's perfectly reasonable to agree that Comey's behavior was unacceptable, and the timing and circumstances of his firing are suspect. These are not mutually exclusive.
Exactly. I think it was discussed earlier: most issues in the real the world are not black or white, yes or no, true or false, and it is the RWers who tend to think in that "us versus them" simplistic way.

Disapproving of Trump, his motives and his behavior does not entail approving of Comey, his motives and his behavior.

Attacking Trump does not entail defending Comey.



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Re: James Comey

#271

Post by AndyinPA » Fri May 12, 2017 9:55 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:It is now being reported that Comey is now refusing to testify before the Senate. This just gets better and better.
I think he might not want to testify because it's a closed hearing.



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Re: James Comey

#272

Post by RoadScholar » Fri May 12, 2017 10:48 pm

Sam the Centipede wrote:
RVInit wrote::yeah:

I think it's perfectly reasonable to agree that Comey's behavior was unacceptable, and the timing and circumstances of his firing are suspect. These are not mutually exclusive.
Exactly. I think it was discussed earlier: most issues in the real the world are not black or white, yes or no, true or false, and it is the RWers who tend to think in that "us versus them" simplistic way.

Disapproving of Trump, his motives and his behavior does not entail approving of Comey, his motives and his behavior.

Attacking Trump does not entail defending Comey.
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Notorial Dissent
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Re: James Comey

#273

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 10:48 pm

He might not want to testify for fear of getting caught lying, which the way things are going is looking more and more like a very real possibility.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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Re: James Comey

#274

Post by Sam the Centipede » Fri May 12, 2017 10:54 pm

Notorial Dissent wrote:He might not want to testify for fear of getting caught lying, which the way things are going is looking more and more like a very real possibility.
He should contact fearless investigator Mike Zullo for advice on how not to testify.



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Re: James Comey

#275

Post by Notorial Dissent » Fri May 12, 2017 10:56 pm

Sam the Centipede wrote:
Notorial Dissent wrote:He might not want to testify for fear of getting caught lying, which the way things are going is looking more and more like a very real possibility.
He should contact fearless investigator Mike Zullo for advice on how not to testify.
Now there's a thought, and he can get KKKlayman or Orbly to act as counsel. He'd be lucky to NOT get the death penalty.


The fact that you sincerely and wholeheartedly believe that the “Law of Gravity” is unconstitutional and a violation of your sovereign rights, does not absolve you of adherence to it.

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