The Ahmaud Arbery case

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SLQ
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#301

Post by SLQ »

Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:13 pm
Most "patriotic American citizens" are chasing people down and killing them, you goofy motherfucker.
:yeah: This guy way overreached. Fatal flaw.
"Try not. Do or do not. There is no try."
-- Yoda

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SLQ
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#302

Post by SLQ »

And we're adjuorned. Please excuse typos. If I wasn't clear on anything, feel free to ask. Others who watched may have a different take or catch something I missed, too.

I realized I wasn't clear on the car. There were some questions on cross and redirect about Ahmaud's car, but it wasn't clear what they were getting at. GBI said they determined it was a non-issue because Ahmaud's car was a beater (my word) and rarely operable. Ahmaud didn't care because he ran everywhere. Travis's or Greg's attorney seemed to think there's something there.

Edit: typo.
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Maybenaut
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#303

Post by Maybenaut »

SLQ wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:29 pm
Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:13 pm
Most "patriotic American citizens" are chasing people down and killing them, you goofy motherfucker.
:yeah: This guy way overreached. Fatal flaw.
Yeah, that was a really stupid thing to say. Personally, I don't think it would have mattered. That's not what lost the case for the defense. What lost the case for the defense was that the defendants murdered Ahmaud Arbery, and admitted to the acts to the police under the misapprehension, I think, that the interrogations were merely a formality and all of this was going to go away. And it almost did. Just as in the Trayvon Martin case, protest in the face of complacent law enforcement is a good thing.
"Hey! You know, we left this England place because it was bogus. So if we don't get some cool rules ourselves, pronto, we'll just be bogus too." - Thomas Jefferson

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bob
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#304

Post by bob »

Maybenaut wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:37 pm
SLQ wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:29 pm
Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:13 pm
Most "patriotic American citizens" are chasing people down and killing them, you goofy motherfucker.
:yeah: This guy way overreached. Fatal flaw.
Yeah, that was a really stupid thing to say. Personally, I don't think it would have mattered.
Mattered to court?: no. But I don't think the court was intended audience. With the nation's eyes on the court, and all that. :roll:
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SLQ
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#305

Post by SLQ »

Maybenaut wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:37 pm
SLQ wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:29 pm
Sugar Magnolia wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:13 pm
Most "patriotic American citizens" are chasing people down and killing them, you goofy motherfucker.
:yeah: This guy way overreached. Fatal flaw.
Yeah, that was a really stupid thing to say. Personally, I don't think it would have mattered. That's not what lost the case for the defense. What lost the case for the defense was that the defendants murdered Ahmaud Arbery, and admitted to the acts to the police under the misapprehension, I think, that the interrogations were merely a formality and all of this was going to go away. And it almost did. Just as in the Trayvon Martin case, protest in the face of complacent law enforcement is a good thing.
Yes, after the last couple of weeks, I don't think there was any chance that the judge was not going to bind this over.
"Try not. Do or do not. There is no try."
-- Yoda

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#306

Post by Maybenaut »

bob wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:45 pm
Maybenaut wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:37 pm
SLQ wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:29 pm

:yeah: This guy way overreached. Fatal flaw.
Yeah, that was a really stupid thing to say. Personally, I don't think it would have mattered.
Mattered to court?: no. But I don't think the court was intended audience. With the nation's eyes on the court, and all that. :roll:
:yeah: :roll:
"Hey! You know, we left this England place because it was bogus. So if we don't get some cool rules ourselves, pronto, we'll just be bogus too." - Thomas Jefferson

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neonzx
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#307

Post by neonzx »

Shout-out to SLQ for the (virtual) BOTG reporting. I flipped the video on a few times for a bit it got tedious for my nerves. Thanks for sticking with it and giving it to us in a digest format.

I really hate those defense attorneys. I know they are just doing what they do, but they know they have no case defense.

The three defendants are fucked. :violin:

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#308

Post by RVInit »

neonzx wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:16 pm
Shout-out to SLQ for the (virtual) BOTG reporting. I flipped the video on a few times for a bit it got tedious for my nerves. Thanks for sticking with it and giving it to us in a digest format.

I really hate those defense attorneys. I know they are just doing what they do, but they know they have no case defense.

The three defendants are fucked. :violin:
:yeah:
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--- George W Bush

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#309

Post by Frater I*I »

neonzx wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:16 pm

The three defendants are fucked. :violin:
Three words, rural county jury.

They move to a new venue, sure to have many white farmers in it, all white jury, robberies in the neighborhood, former type of LEO affecting a "citizens arrest" [surely because of his background he knows probable cause for an arrest they will be told], ect ect ect.

I've seen it in a nearby counties here years ago, move case to white county, and you don't need to convince 12, just one. Mistrial, then threaten to bleed the small rural prosecutors office by delaying retrial, case dropped, clients walk.

I think it was Ms. Filly who mentioned the poor journalism on this case in GA media. The standard for reporting on racist rural police practices here is so low, you'd have to dig to find them.
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#310

Post by Whatever4 »

I’m not certain we deserve to survive as a country.

Ahmaud Arbery, terrorized for some 7 minutes that ended with his life pouring out on the pavement. Chased by 2 trucks, hit by one, boxed in and forced to fight for his life, presumably with no idea why he was in that predicament. George Floyd, held down by 4 cops as his breath slowly gave out over 8 minutes or so. Their tormentors — white men who assumed they were justified in torturing the victims.

I’m angry, sick, tired, worn out — and I’m a middle-aged white woman. I can’t fathom the depths of emotion blacks must feel EVERY DAY.
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#311

Post by Lani »

Whatever4 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:07 am
I’m not certain we deserve to survive as a country.
:snippity:
I’m angry, sick, tired, worn out — and I’m a middle-aged white woman. I can’t fathom the depths of emotion blacks must feel EVERY DAY.
I can't either. I've lived in Indonesian, experienced some hatred in Australia, and am in the minority in Hawaii, but it's not the same. I don't know what I can do, but I've done the best I can do to raise a child who appreciates the diversity of humanity.
Sekrit Stuffs!
True story. Years ago in Indonesia I was in a restaurant in Ubud. There was only one other person there. (monsoon season) We looked at each other, and we both thought that we recognized each other. She asked where I was from. I asked "what year?" We laffed. Our only connections were Hawaii and and our interested in Bali textiles. We talked for awhile about raising our children as universal children. Her name was Ann Dunham.

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neeneko
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#312

Post by neeneko »

Whatever4 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:07 am
I’m not certain we deserve to survive as a country.
I have been in favor of breaking up the US for a long time.

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#313

Post by Dave at Sea »

Lani wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:53 am
I can't either. I've lived in Indonesian, experienced some hatred in Australia, and am in the minority in Hawaii, but it's not the same. I don't know what I can do, but I've done the best I can do to raise a child who appreciates the diversity of humanity.
As an Australian - I apologise for any hatred you felt from anyone here.
We should be better.

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#314

Post by Patagoniagirl »

Lani wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:53 am
Whatever4 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:07 am
I’m not certain we deserve to survive as a country.
:snippity:
I’m angry, sick, tired, worn out — and I’m a middle-aged white woman. I can’t fathom the depths of emotion blacks must feel EVERY DAY.
I can't either. I've lived in Indonesian, experienced some hatred in Australia, and am in the minority in Hawaii, but it's not the same. I don't know what I can do, but I've done the best I can do to raise a child who appreciates the diversity of humanity.
Sekrit Stuffs!
True story. Years ago in Indonesia I was in a restaurant in Ubud. There was only one other person there. (monsoon season) We looked at each other, and we both thought that we recognized each other. She asked where I was from. I asked "what year?" We laffed. Our only connections were Hawaii and and our interested in Bali textiles. We talked for awhile about raising our children as universal children. Her name was Ann Dunham.

Seriously!?

Edit to add: that is such an incredible story! Thanks for sharing.

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SLQ
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#315

Post by SLQ »

Just dropping this docket info here for case info going forward:

State of Georgia vs. Gregory McMichael: https://www.glynncounty.org/2053/State- ... -McMichael

State of Georgia vs. Travis McMichael: https://www.glynncounty.org/2054/State- ... -McMichael

State of Georgia vs. William "Roddie" Bryan: https://www.glynncounty.org/2055/State- ... ddie-Bryan

Currently, there are special pages on the superior court's website and documents are free. I'm hoping that will continue.

Edit: The docket may explain the judge's . . . impatience . . . with Bryan's attorney from the outset of the preliminary hearing. He has filed a slew of motions already. Interestingly, in Travis's and Greg's cases (but not Roddie's) GBI agent Dial successfully moved to file a bunch of search warrant stuff under seal, as shown on the dockets.
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#316

Post by June bug »

bob wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 7:46 pm
I think a certain member flounced, but, if not, may appreciate this lawsplaining from YouTube lawyer Devin "Legal Eagle" Stone:
:snippity:
Who flounced?

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#317

Post by Grumpy Old Guy »

Lani wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:53 am
Whatever4 wrote:
Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:07 am
I’m not certain we deserve to survive as a country.
:snippity:
:snippity:
Sekrit Stuffs!
:snippity: Her name was Ann Dunham.
Sekrit Stuffs!
Ann Dunham was a remarkable woman, because she was able to give birth to the same child in Hawaii, Kenya and Indonesia. :rotflmao:

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#318

Post by Maybenaut »

June bug wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 9:38 am
bob wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 7:46 pm
I think a certain member flounced, but, if not, may appreciate this lawsplaining from YouTube lawyer Devin "Legal Eagle" Stone:
:snippity:
Who flounced?
Jeffrey
"Hey! You know, we left this England place because it was bogus. So if we don't get some cool rules ourselves, pronto, we'll just be bogus too." - Thomas Jefferson

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#319

Post by TexasFilly »

I was disturbed by the focus of the defense on Ahmaud's supposed auditory hallucinations and the claims that he was "off his meds." I don't really see the relevance of that in this case, and it's a clear attempt to dirty up the victim. What actions were taken are on the recording. Many people have mental health problems in this country, does that mean it's ok to shoot them all?

I didn't see Ahmaud take any physical action that would indicate his judgment was impaired, no did I see him take any aggressive action toward these three guys until he was staring down the barrel of a shotgun.
I love the poorly educated!!!

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Maybenaut
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#320

Post by Maybenaut »

TexasFilly wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:21 am
I was disturbed by the focus of the defense on Ahmaud's supposed auditory hallucinations and the claims that he was "off his meds." I don't really see the relevance of that in this case, and it's a clear attempt to dirty up the victim. What actions were taken are on the recording. Many people have mental health problems in this country, does that mean it's ok to shoot them all?

I didn't see Ahmaud take any physical action that would indicate his judgment was impaired, no did I see him take any aggressive action toward these three guys until he was staring down the barrel of a shotgun.
I hope the government's comeback to that is, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." Seriously, though, considering that it's the reasonableness of the defendants' actions that is at issue, whether Arbery was hearing voices or was off his meds is irrelevant unless the defendants knew about it, and how could they have? You're right, Filly -- what matters is whether Arbery did anything to reasonably place these guys in fear. And you can't claim self-defense if you're the aggressor. I guess this is all a preview for the immunity motion* at the Superior Court.

* I cannot believe that such a thing exists in this country, but apparently it does in places.
"Hey! You know, we left this England place because it was bogus. So if we don't get some cool rules ourselves, pronto, we'll just be bogus too." - Thomas Jefferson

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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#321

Post by Frater I*I »

Maybenaut wrote:
Sat Jun 06, 2020 11:34 am

* I cannot believe that such a thing exists in this country, but apparently it does in places.
Welcome to rural Georgia.
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Re: The Ahmaud Arbery case

#322

Post by Maybenaut »

All three indicted.
The Washington Post wrote: The three men — Travis McMichael, Gregory McMichael and William R. “Roddie” Bryan — each were indicted on nine counts, including malice murder, four counts of felony murder, two counts of aggravated assault, false imprisonment and criminal attempt to commit false imprisonment.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... story.html
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